Hoist/? Claim Form - old husbands HSBC OD 'debt'

[hollysmum]

Good morning everyone!

 

My partner has had recent contact from this shower, who are acting on behalf of HSBC.

A while ago, my partner opened a bank account with HSBC.

He admits to running into an overdraft of £200, and, because he panicked, has ignored a number of letters from them trying to resolve it.

 

He realised he couldn't ignore it any longer when a text message came to my landline for him, and I happened to pick this up, and asked him about it.

 

he did telephone them, and spoke to the ethereal "Chris", who said that, if he coughed up instantly (there's no way he can), he would only have to pay £240, and not the £308 that they'd quoted (£108 being the "penalty" for not paying back the original £200).

 

He has never denied that he owes the £200, but trying to set up an arrangement to pay in instalments is proving difficult.

He telephoned "Chris" again about a week after the original call, and got his ansaphone, on which he left a message asking to be called back. That hasn't happened, at least, we've not had a call from "Chris".

 

Another text message came to my landline last Saturday morning, from the equally ethereal "Claire", saying that no payment had been received, and they couldn't hold off further action any longer.

 

He immediately phoned the quoted number, and found that the office was closed, even though someone somewhere had triggered off the text message, and so he left another message, saying that he was going to be out of the country until 4th October (he's a continental coach driver, and often away for more than 7 days at a time), please would "Claire" phone him back then, as he wanted to make arrangements to pay.

 

I am typing a letter for him to send to them, as I think we should now deal with this only in writing

- I'm sick of having to deal with text messages, and tw*ts who don't phone back.

 

I have already suggested that he offers to pay £10 per month - this is what I would like your views on.

 

Should this be agreed, what would be the best way to make payment each month?

Neither of us is keen on trying to set up a DD or SO

- I've read too many horror stories on this site!

 

I've offered to write a cheque for him each time, but he's worried that they'll then have MY details, too, and try other nefarious things. He likes the idea of a postal order.

 

Your opinions would be very gratefully received.

 

Thank you all in advance.

[hollysmum]

Thank you, unclebulgaria - I will add in the bit about the no additional charges - I wouldn't put it past them to bung on a few more hundred, either! I've also put in my letter that we will not be responding to any contact other than that put in writing from now on. I want proof of everything!

[hollysmum]

Jimbo - thank you so much for your reply. Thankfully, the account is now closed, so I'm hoping that the Horrible Swindly Bank Corporation will be kept out of this performance. I have to say I'm still not sure why he opened this account, as he already had one at Natwest (and still does), where his wages are paid in. I may be able to prise that information out of him when he gets back from Germany!

[hollysmum]

I thought I would just update this thread. Whilst my partner was away in Germany (strangely, he wasn't lying to "Claire" when he phoned her number), I had two further landline text messages, so they clearly ignored the message he left on "Claire's" ansaphone. He was delighted with the letter I typed up for him, and we have sent it off first class to CRS. Just as he left for work on Saturday morning (2nd Oct), the phone went, and it was them again, wanting to leave a dratted text message!!! I simply hung up. We now await their response to the letter. If it's really exciting, I'll post again!

[hollysmum]

I've just realised that "CRS" actually seems to cover several companies! Please could someone confirm to me the debt collection agency's address? I've spotted "Churchill Recovery Solutions" "Credit Resource Solutions" and "CRS Debt Collection Solicitors" - I'm bothered that we've sent our letter to the wrong one!!! Thanks very much.

[hollysmum]

Good morning! My husband received a Claim Form mentioning this Hoist lot yesterday, telling him that it was in respect of an unarranged overdraft at HSBC, which was initially £345, but with added charges and fees, the sum was now over £1000. The thing is, he's never banked with HSBC. Clearly, we can't ignore the form, or he'll have a totally undeserved CCJ made against him, but please could you advise how we should complete the claim form in order to make them aware that he's never banked with HSBC and therefore, this alleged debt is not his? Thank you so much - Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Good morning!

 

 

My husband received a Claim Form from the Court Business Centre in Northampton yesterday, in respect of Hoist something-or-another, regarding an alleged debt of around £340, which was apparently an unarranged overdraft at HSBC.

 

 

He's never banked at HSBC, so the debt cannot be his,

but of course, we need to respond, or he'll end up with an undeserved CCJ.

 

 

I should add that with "charges" and "legal fees" the full amount they allege he owes is over £1000.

 

 

What is the best way to complete the form to ensure that they know he does not acknowledge this debt?

 

 

Thank you very much for your help

 

 

- Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Sorry, Old Cogger, ignoramus here doesn't know what MCOL is???

[hollysmum]

Cheers, Andy!

[hollysmum]

Thanks very much Old Cogger and Andy - I've printed off the information to take home to my husband this evening, and we can go through it. Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Hi, dx100uk

- we sent the Claim Form acknowledgement back telling the court that my husband will most certainly be defending the claim.

 

 

We have also written to the "solicitors" named on the claim, Howard Cohen & Co, and also Hoist whatever-they-are telling them that we've done so.

 

 

I noted that the date given under Particulars of the Claim mentions that the alleged debt arose or was sold to Hoist whatever-they-are on 17th September 2010.

 

 

The claim from the court is dated 19th September 2016,

so in the letters,

it has been suggested that,

whoever is responsible for this alleged debt,

it is very likely to be statute barred now.

 

 

We have made absolutely certain that we have stated as often as possible that my husband denies that he owes this alleged debt, and most definitely not to Hoist, or the original creditor, HSBC.

 

 

We sent off a CPR 13 (is that correct, I've not got the paperwork with me to check) request for copies of the "agreements" and any other paperwork that they consider proves his guilt,

 

 

all done by "Signed For" post, and keeping proof of postage.

[hollysmum]

Hubby's choice to do it by post, Andy, and I take your point regarding documentation for an overdraft - as it didn't exist in the first place, I think they'll have a hard time finding any evidence in any case! We've obviously kept copies of everything we've sent, and I'll track the letters' delivery, of course.

[hollysmum]

dx - I've not got the paperwork with me to refer to, but will jump online as soon as I get home this evening, with hubby. Thanks so much for all your help - I'll come back with any update. Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Ha ha! Obviously! I've created an account for him, anyway, so we can get straight on with it when I can see all the reference numbers etc.

[hollysmum]

Good morning! I posted in September about this, but can't now find my original post - sorry! Please could you good people give me some guidance regarding the forms that have now arrived from the Courts Centre in Northampton?

 

The background to this - a Claim arrived totally out of the blue (no previous threatograms or anything from Hoist or anyone else) in mid-September. It concerns an alleged outstanding overdraft, the original creditor being HSBC. The claim is against my husband. It is not his debt - he has never had any account, ever, with HSBC.

 

The form was completed with this defence, it not being his debt. It wasn't until we'd sent back the form (having been perhaps understandably concerned to get it back in good time) that I took a far closer look at it and realised that, whoever's debt it is, it is now statute barred - the date mentioned on the claim details was, I think, 15th September 2010.

 

We wrote to Hoist, their "solicitors" Howard Cohen and also to the Courts Centre, to point out this fact, and asked that, it being apparently statute barred, and not my husband's debt anyway, that the claim against him be dropped forthwith, unless Hoist/Howard Cohen could come up with any evidence to suggest otherwise within 21 days. We had heard absolute diddly from anyone until the forms arrived from the Courts Centre yesterday.

 

It is headed "Notice of Proposed Allocation to the Small Claims Track", and we have to respond by 14th November. Under "Important Notice" it says "If you do not comply with this notice, the court will make such order as appears to be appropriate. This could include striking out the claim or entering judgement". What confused me a little was under "TAKE NOTICE THAT" it says "This is now a defended claim. A copy of the defence has already been sent to you by the defendant". Now of course, my husband IS the defendant, and we only sent stuff back to the Courts Centre, not to anyone else. Is what he has received, therefore, a copy of what has gone to Hoist/Howard Cohen?

 

Attached to this notice is a Directions Questionnaire (Small Claims Track), an N180, I believe. Then, there is an EX730, which says "Would you like to settle your case without going to a court hearing?" and goes on to explain about mediation. I should say that we've never received anything in the form of evidence against my husband, i.e. nothing to prove that the debt is his, and as I said, nothing from Hoist/Howard Cohen, ever, prior to receiving the Claim notice in September.

 

Simply because it is relevant to us, I will tell you that my husband is recovering from a massive heart attack, and I have therefore been acting on his behalf during this imposition from Hoist/Howard Cohen. He simply does not have the strength, physically or mentally, to try and deal with this right now.

 

Please could you advise me how I should now proceed on his behalf? What should I put on the form, if anything? Needless to say, I do not want to incur any expenditure if it's not necessary.

 

My very grateful thanks to you all. Catherine.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Andyorch
Paras

[hollysmum]

Good afternoon!

 

I wanted to share with you the experience I have had following my sending a complaint to the FCA about Hoist Portfolio Holdings 2 and Howard Cohen.

 

The latter two have been pursuing my husband for a debt that doesn't belong to him, and HPH2 lodged a claim against him via the Court in Northampton.

 

Because he is recovering from cancer and a serious heart attack,

I have had to take over trying to deal with all this.

 

The original debt was with HSBC, an overdraft apparently, and was sold on to MKDP, then on to Hoist, who are now seeking a CCJ.

 

I reiterate that it is NOT my husband's debt,

he has never had any sort of account with HSBC, ever.

 

This fact formed his defence, of course, that and the fact that the debt appears to be statute-barred, regardless of who it might belong to.

 

We are now waiting to hear what is to happen next.

I was so angry about the whole situation that I decided to write to the FCA,

thinking, naively as it turns out,

that they would be able to investigate Hoist, at least, and give them a good legal thrashing and tell them to leave us alone.

Hah! Was I wrong?!!

 

I got a letter back from them which repeated mine to them almost word for word, and then it said that Hoist are no longer recognised by the FCA,

are not subject to their regulations,

therefore they can do absolutely nothing about them.

 

They very helpfully pointed me in the direction of my local Citizen's Advice Bureau.

I was gobsmacked

- what's the point of the FCA if they can't investigate the conduct of a debt-buying outfit who have caused the two of us so much extra worry and upset?

 

I doubt we're alone - judging by the threads on this Forum,

there are thousands just like us.

 

If the FCA is this ineffectual,

who can I contact who might be able to actually do something?

 

I already feel better having offloaded on all you good CAGGERS!

Thank you all. Catherine

[hollysmum]

Hi, dx -

the debt is not my husband's debt

- the first he knew about any of this was when the Court letter with Hoist's claim arrived in September.

 

There had been absolutely nothing at all before, no notifications, threatograms, nothing.

He has never had any sort of account with HSBC,

he's never had anything from MKDP from whom Hoist seem to have acquired the "debt".

 

He has been extremely ill, as I pointed out,

most recently from a massive heart attack, brought on by the radiotherapy he had for cancer,

and this Claim business was just the straw that broke this camel's back.

 

"How can this happen?" is what he said to me when we realised that we had no choice but to respond to the Claim or a CCJ would be entered against him regardless of whether the debt was his or not.

 

The situation at present is that we sent off his defence, on the form sent with the Claim.

We received another set of forms back from the Court telling us that Hoist are taking this down the Small Claims Track, so that has been filled in and returned, and copies forwarded to Hoist and Howard Cohen.

 

I sent all of it via Signed For post (hubby's choice to use post instead of online!).

Looking at the Royal Mail tracker was quite funny,

as neither seem capable of legibly signing anything

- the Hoist ones are blank, with just the post man having marked it "Delivered" and the Howard Cohen ones have literally squiggles that are supposed to say "Michael McDonnell".

 

I should add that I did phone the Court in Northampton to ask advice as to how to fill out the most recent form, and to advise that I have had to take over dealing with things, as my husband is not fit, physically or mentally, to do so.

 

I've advised Hoist and Howard Cohen of the same.

We have never received anything at all from Howard Cohen or Hoist

- I did send requests asking for proof that the debt is my husband's,

and also proof that the debt is NOT statute-barred,

whoever might be responsible for it.

 

As I said, absolutely nothing has been received,

only acknowledgements from the Court in Northampton, as I would expect.

 

Forgive me for not using the reference numbers for the various forms

- I've not got the paperwork with me at my desk today.

[hollysmum]

Hi, Unclebulgaria - thank you very much for your reply.

 

 

Yes, we returned the directions questionnaire, so we are just waiting for the next "move".

 

 

I will draft a letter to Howard Cohen as you suggest

- to us, it is clearly a matter of the DCA having got the wrong person,

and it was really the fact that it is not my husband's debt,

and his serious illness, that made me see a dark shade of red and write to the FCA when we realised that someone was actually trying to take the poor man to court over something that was nothing to do with him.

 

 

It just added to all our worries. Thanks again - I will post again if anything else happens. Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Oh, that's brilliant! To be honest, I'm not especially bothered about compensation, but I do want to make a point, so will bear this in mind, UncleBulgaria, once the sorry process has been played out. Thank you so much. Catherine.

[hollysmum]

Yes, indeed, to both points!

[hollysmum]

Hi again, dx - yes, we sent that off pronto after receipt of the Claim. There is a partial number on the Claim form, but most of it is "XXXXXX".

[hollysmum]

Nope, absolute diddly.

[hollysmum]

I'm going to go back to all the paperwork, I think, check out the alleged account number and see if HSBC can shed any light.

[hollysmum]

Hello, Bankfodder! Firstly, I need to say that, because this is the first time ever that either me or my husband have been the subject of any sort of court action, when we saw the Claim from the Courts Centre in Northampton, our very first thought was to respond as quickly as possible to ensure that no CCJ was made against my husband unfairly.

We did submit a defence - the debt is not his as he has never had any sort of account with HSBC, the original creditor.

In fact I think that is precisely what we wrote on the form.

 

We sent off a request to Howard Cohen, who purport to be solicitors and are acting on behalf of Hoist, a CPR 31.14, immediately. The names that appear on the claim are Hoist Portfolio Holding 2 Ltd, having been assigned the debt by MKDP LLP (ex HSBC).

 

The name Michael McDonnell appears alongside that of Howard Cohen Solicitors.

 

Again because we were so thrown by receiving this Claim totally out of the blue, it was a couple of days before I sat and looked far more thoroughly at the Particulars of Claim, and noticed the dates.

It stated 17/09/2010 as the point from which the debt had accrued. The date of the Claim was 19th September 2016, and therefore six years had passed, and I felt that it was possible that, whoever was responsible for this debt, it was now statute-barred.

 

With my husband's agreement, I wrote to Hoist, the Court and Howard Cohen to this effect.

I should point out here that the reason this has been done by post is because that is how my husband wanted it to be done - he is not especially confident online, and, dare I say, is not especially trusting of doing things online! All correspondence from us, immediately following receipt of the claim, was despatched Signed For on September 26th - 53 days ago now.

Nothing at all has been received from either Hoist or Howard Cohen. He never had a Default Notice, prior to that no threatograms or other correspondence about this alleged debt.

 

I am inclined, like you, to believe that it is a case of them having got the wrong person. I have pointed out previously, simply because it is relevant to us, that my husband has suffered two very serious illnesses in the last 18 months, cancer followed by a massive heart attack, and I think that this has also influenced how we reacted to the Claim arriving - it was just one more thing to worry and upset us.

 

Quite possibly we haven't reacted in the very best possible way, but we have at least lodged his defence, submitted the CPR 31.14, and have pointed out at every possible opportunity that this is not his debt, and that it is believed to be statute-barred, regardless.

 

That's another thing - we asked Howard Cohen/Hoist to provide us with evidence that it is NOT statute-barred, and this has not, so far, been forthcoming.

 

I've also had to inform all parties that I am now acting on behalf of my husband because of his state of health. Because I am at my desk at work, I don't have any of the correspondence/Claim with me to upload today, but I can do my best to do that on Monday.

I'm thinking, having read your post, that I should try and make contact with HSBC to ask about this, and determine what might have gone wrong.

There is a partial account number on the Claim, in the format XXXXXXX1234. I will also prepare an SAR for HSBC/Hoist/Howard Cohen - there can be no harm in doing that, presumably?

I very much appreciate your response.

Catherine.

[hollysmum]

This is so helpful, BankFodder, thank you so much for taking the time to respond. I do keep a diary, as it happens, and have recorded what has happened in respect of this Claim since it arrived, and have kept receipts for the postage etc.

 

 

This sounds so lame, but at home we only have a laptop, no printer or scanner or anything, so if we ever need to do either of the latter, I bring stuff into work, hence now having to wait until Monday, but I will be preparing the SAR and searching for the COBS, BCOBS and CONC rules you mention. I agree that a well-worded letter to Howard Cohen might be more fruitful than trying to get anything out of HSBC!

 

 

My thanks again, it's very much appreciated. Catherine.