The Taking Control of Goods Regulations 2013. A general discussion thread.......

[Highland mav]

I think you will find the ifo I have given is on the right thread as regards to Bailiffs.

 

One thing I forgot to mention was the fact; In Halsburys Laws of England, it states that all Magistrates and County Courts are Administrative Courts and have no jurisdiction, and also states ' The Law is very clear on this'.

 

So there ya go, all Magis and Counties are as effective as a chocolate fire guard.

[dx100uk]

posts moved

 

dx

[sequenci]

Hi,

 

I think you will also find that a bailiff or Enforcement Officer can only enter your property peaceably, by way of, open window or open door. That has never changed, nor will it ever.

 

Apart from it has. Windows are no longer allowed.

[Highland mav]

Oh well, that is a good thing, you only have to watch the door then.

 

What I meant was, they cannot force a window. Anything that stops them is a good thing.

 

 

all the best

[tomtubby]

Highland mav

 

You have made 2 very interesting posts above. The first one states that you were 'in the industry for 25 years' and that Lord Denning stated the following:

 

"If a bailiff enters without the express permission of the householder, you have the right to hit him over the back of the head with a milk bottle' and treat him/her as trespassing".

 

Your 2nd post states that:

 

"In Halsbury's Laws of England, it states that all Magistrates and County Courts are Administrative Courts and have no jurisdiction, and also states ' The Law is very clear on this'.

 

 

Firstly, Lord Denning did NOT state what you claim he did. It would seem that you have visited certain websites closely associated with the Freeman on the Land movement.

 

This is also CONFIRMED by your second post regarding "Administrative Courts". Again, this is 'stuff and nonsense' from FoTL supporters.

[brassnecked]

As to Tools mentioned previously it appears that the EA may take tools of the trade above the total value of £1350, so the van, and specialist tools are at risk leaving the spanners so to speak. Am I correct?

[HCEOs]

As to Tools mentioned previously it appears that the EA may take tools of the trade above the total value of £1350, so the van, and specialist tools are at risk leaving the spanners so to speak. Am I correct?

 

In a nutshell, yes.

[brassnecked]

In a nutshell, yes.

 

Thanks HCEOs I can see a few small businesses being closed lot of sole traders attempting to sign on shortly then after the EA takes the plumbers van, or the mechanics trolley jacks and Snap On cabinet.

[HCEOs]

If I'm honest vans were almost always available for seizure in my experience of interpleaders. You may argue wrongly, but many Judge's consider a plumber can get to work using public transport.

 

I don't think this change will see a dramatic effect on the seizure of what some will claim are exempt 'tools of the trade'.

 

But as with all of this new regulation, only time will tell.

[HCEOs]

Hi, I think you will also find that a bailiff or Enforcement Officer can only enter your property peaceably, by way of, open window or open door. That has never changed, nor will it ever.

 

I'll think you'll find it changed on Sunday....

[tomtubby]

Highland mav.

 

I am assuming that your above post is directed to me in reply to my post. Firstly, please read what I said properly. I did NOT accuse you of being a liar.

 

Secondly, Lord Denning did NOT quote the words as stated by you and if you have many Law books as you say you will see this for yourself.

 

The most interesting part of your post however must concern the position of 'Administrative Courts'. Are you trying to say that they have no legal standing? If so, this would be interesting given that in your previous work (for 25 years) you would have no doubt been enforcing warrants (which would of course have come via orders from such courts).

 

I would be interested in your response but there is simply no need for abuse. This is a learning curve and accurate information is vitally important.

 

PS: Under the new regulations of course the position of trespass has now been clarified....An enforcement Agent will NOT be deemed a trespasser. End of.

[mikeymack2002]

Come on guys no need for this to take such a bad turn, lets get back on topic please

[Coughdrop]

Coughdrop....it is a shame that you have posted the link on this page as once again this thread is fast going 'off topic".

 

All of the above posts on this page should be on the right thread which is the DISCUSSION thread regarding the new regulations.

 

Tomtubby,

 

It would help if the question were asked on the right thread then, as my post purely answers it. I apologise for not having time today to plough through every post to see exactly what has been happening.

 

As for keeping on topic, I say Amen to that for all threads, so I do apologise if my answer to a question on this thread took it away from where it was. When I read it in its entirety last, it had gone miles off thread. As I say I haven't had time to plough through everything today.

[brassnecked]

If I'm honest vans were almost always available for seizure in my experience of interpleaders. You may argue wrongly, but many Judge's consider a plumber can get to work using public transport.

 

I don't think this change will see a dramatic effect on the seizure of what some will claim are exempt 'tools of the trade'.

 

But as with all of this new regulation, only time will tell.

 

A Courier could not do 90 drops with parcels on public transport,though, or a Taxi driver do their job on the bus, perhaps the judge and EA would suggest a Rickshaw? so I suppose it is down to what is reasonable

[mikeymack2002]

Read this on another forums can anyone give the real explanation please

 

 

Paragraph 58(1) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals, Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 says when the debtor pays the debt in full then enforcement action must cease forthwith and no further enforcement steps can be taken. It also stops further fees being charged.

 

When you have paid the creditor, you must notify the bailiff by a durable means under paragraph 59(2) of the Act.

 

 

MM

[tomtubby]

Official statement about "Cowboy Bailiffs"

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/chris-grayling/chris-grayling-cowboy-bailiffs_b_5105200.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

[ploddertom]

Official statement about "Cowboy Bailiffs"

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/chris-grayling/chris-grayling-cowboy-bailiffs_b_5105200.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

 

The National was on Saturday, he's still wearing his blinkers.

[Coughdrop]

Official statement about "Cowboy Bailiffs"

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/chris-grayling/chris-grayling-cowboy-bailiffs_b_5105200.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

 

Excellent link. I particularly like this quotation from it:

 

we are making sure bailiffs don't take advantage of vulnerable people who simply don't understand why they are being pursued, or what to do about it. Bailiffs will be trained to recognise when they are dealing with someone vulnerable

 

My schoolboy English tells me the part in red is in the future tense. Is that not a bit tough for vulnerable people who are being pursued now (present tense) under the new regs?

[lamma]

An admission that they have never been trained in the past (to recognise vulnerable people).

If they had already been trained they would not need it now.

[SWLABR9]

This sounds to me as if the intention is you're only held to be vulnerable in law and therefore afforded special consideration if a bailiff decides you are, so no-one is or will be.

[brassnecked]

An admission that they have never been trained in the past (to recognise vulnerable people).

If they had already been trained they would not need it now.

So until they are trained, and they ignore someone who says they have a weak heart, proof is provided but they persist in the same way the JBW bailiff did in the panorama show and the debtor collapses and dies on the doorstep, they can be charged with manslaughter?

 

A nightclub bouncer is probably better trained, and if one acted like the clown on Panorama, wouldn't be on the door much longer.

[tomtubby]

Read this on another forums can anyone give the real explanation please

 

 

Paragraph 58(1) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals, Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 says when the debtor pays the debt in full then enforcement action must cease forthwith and no further enforcement steps can be taken. It also stops further fees being charged.

 

When you have paid the creditor, you must notify the bailiff by a durable means under paragraph 59(2) of the Act.

 

 

MM

 

Your query is vitally important and I now realise where you had read this.

 

For any new visitors, the same internet site are behind the following fiasco and sadly, also behind a recent Form 4 complaint at Torquay & Newton Abbot County Court where the debtor was ordered to pay over £4,000 in costs to the bailiff:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?421842-Suing-a-Bailiff-Company-Enforcement-Agent.....make-sure-you-read-here-first!!!!(3-Viewing)-nbsp

 

Before answering your question it is important to first understand WHAT the website are trying to advise debtors. In a nutshell, the 'advice' is exactly the same as they have always been providing which is that in order to avoid paying bailiff fees the debtor should INSTEAD pay the CREDITOR direct (ie: the local authority (or in the case of court fines) pay cash into the ATM 'drop box' at the Magistrates Court).

 

Giving the importance of this subject it would be better if I started a new thread so that members of the public (and all the helpers and moderators on here) are aware of the correct position regarding payments made direct to the creditor (local authority/magistrates court etc).

[tomtubby]

Just a short note to let everyone know that I am working on another STICKY which will effectively be like an 'IDIOTS GUIDE' about the new regs. I am not sure of the title yet but it should be ready by the weekend.

 

Just a quick note:

 

VAT is NOT chargeable on enforcement agents fee when enforcing non domestic rates, council tax, parking charge notices or CSA arrears.

 

Also, from 6th April an enforcement agent MUST NOT charge the following:

 

DVLA search fee, HPI fee or credit or debit card handling fee.

[ploddertom]

 

Just a quick note:

 

VAT is NOT chargeable on enforcement agents fee when enforcing non domestic rates, council tax, parking charge notices or CSA arrears.

 

Also, from 6th April an enforcement agent MUST NOT charge the following:

 

DVLA search fee, HPI fee or credit or debit card handling fee.

 

May I suggest I/you put the above at the end of the present Stickies done on Sunday so the info does not get lost?

[tomtubby]

Ploddertom,

 

In fact I am going to include the information in my above post in the new 'Dummies Guide'. I need to think of a good title...anyone?