Freedom pass problem

[Django2013]

Perhaps. But it's pretty irrelevant in your case. You wern't entitled to use the pass, full stop.

 

I never implied it was relevant to me personally.

[fairyliquid]

I sent off my letter at the end of last week, but unfortunately didn't have time to post it here and get it checked. Oh well, I'll just see how it goes.

 

By the way, how long does it usually take for them to respond? Weeks? Months?

 

Hey Django2013,

 

Did you hand write your letter or did you print it? I need to send one back and it says to write on the back. Dunno if handwrite good or attach a seperate print out.

[firstclassx]

Hey Django2013,

 

Did you hand write your letter or did you print it? I need to send one back and it says to write on the back. Dunno if handwrite good or attach a seperate print out.

 

As long as the content is good - it won't matter how it is presented.

 

(I find it easier to read typed documents. Some handwriting is quite difficult to follow!)

[fairyliquid]

Thank you firstclassx for help.

[Django2013]

Okay, it looks like the court letter has arrived, summoning me to court next month in July.

 

Any advice on what I should do?

 

Also, to Kitoo: I'm just curious, but how did you contact the prosecution? And could you maybe give some more advice on what I should do, judging from your experience of going through a similar situation?

[kitoo]

Okay, it looks like the court letter has arrived, summoning me to court next month in July.

 

Any advice on what I should do?

 

Also, to Kitoo: I'm just curious, but how did you contact the prosecution? And could you maybe give some more advice on what I should do, judging from your experience of going through a similar situation?

 

Sorry Django

I only just saw your post now, have you been to court yet or did you manage to get out of it. I contacted them on the telephone no provided on the first letter they sent me. But that advice might be too late for you now. Honest these freedom pass prosecutions are a joke considering cautions are only givenfor drug pushing, or hurting people. Its disgusting

[honeybee13]

Sorry Django

I only just saw your post now, have you been to court yet or did you manage to get out of it. I contacted them on the telephone no provided on the first letter they sent me. But that advice might be too late for you now. Honest these freedom pass prosecutions are a joke considering cautions are only givenfor drug pushing, or hurting people. Its disgusting

 

Hello there.

 

I don't think they are a joke, are they? I can see that you might think other offences receive lenient treatment, but if you've been caught by a transport company you're stuck with the laws and byelaws that underlie their system, unfortunately.

 

Unless you start a campaign to change laws that have been in place for a century or more, you can't change things.

 

And Freedom Pass offences are misuse of public money, aren't they?

 

HB

[sailor sam]

Sorry Django

I only just saw your post now, have you been to court yet or did you manage to get out of it. I contacted them on the telephone no provided on the first letter they sent me. But that advice might be too late for you now. Honest these freedom pass prosecutions are a joke considering cautions are only givenfor drug pushing, or hurting people. Its disgusting

 

What would you suggest then... let you off scott free?

[Old-CodJA]

Honest these freedom pass prosecutions are a joke considering cautions are only givenfor drug pushing, or hurting people. Its disgusting

 

Just once in a while I read a post on here that touches a nerve. The comment above is one of those posts.

 

As HB says, Freedom Passes are funded by public money with the sole purpose of assisting the most needy in our society to get around the TfL area by using public transport.

 

When someone who is not entitled to hold a Freedom pass is caught deliberately misusing such a concession for personal gain and is therefore effectively stealing from everyone else, I am fully behind robust action to deal with the offender. Occasionally I might offer suggestion that might help where non-intentional misuse may be evident, but I make no apology for saying that everyone who sets out to cheat & steal by abusing the benefits set aside for the most vulnerable in our society deserves to be punished.

 

There is already quite enough pressure on maintaining funding for such benefits without widespread misuse being cited as a reason for withdrawing them

 

Personally, I don't find the idea that being prosecuted for such an offence should be considered a 'joke'. In fact, I am very pleased that it is taken seriously and that the Courts deal with it in the same way.

[Django2013]

Sorry Django

I only just saw your post now, have you been to court yet or did you manage to get out of it. I contacted them on the telephone no provided on the first letter they sent me. But that advice might be too late for you now. Honest these freedom pass prosecutions are a joke considering cautions are only givenfor drug pushing, or hurting people. Its disgusting

 

I've contacted them and they said I need to send a letter if I want to settle out of court. I sent the letter last week and am still waiting for a response now.

Edited July 16, 2013 by Django2013

[honeybee13]

Thank you for letting us know, Django. I hope it goes well for you.

 

Please come back and let us know either way.

 

HB

[Django2013]

Okay, it looks like they're not willing to settle this out of court and want to continue prosecution. With my court date due in a few days time, is there any way I can convince them to settle out of court?

 

Also, I sent off my "not guilty" plea last week. However, on the form it said something about the date being adjourned to a later date if I plea 'not guilty', but I haven't heard back yet from the court whether the date has been adjourned or not. Does it usually get adjourned when you plea not guilty? And if there is no way out of court, any advice on how I should proceed and handle the case?

 

Also, to Kitoo: How did you speak on the phone to the prosecutor directly? I've called them a few times, and I always end up speaking with the receptionist. Did you maybe call them earlier in the morning? Also, how did you convince them to settle out of court even after they turned you down before?

[Old-CodJA]

Okay, it looks like they're not willing to settle this out of court and want to continue prosecution. With my court date due in a few days time, is there any way I can convince them to settle out of court?

 

Also, I sent off my "not guilty" plea last week. However, on the form it said something about the date being adjourned to a later date if I plea 'not guilty', but I haven't heard back yet from the court whether the date has been adjourned or not. Does it usually get adjourned when you plea not guilty? And if there is no way out of court, any advice on how I should proceed and handle the case?

 

Also, to Kitoo: How did you speak on the phone to the prosecutor directly? I've called them a few times, and I always end up speaking with the receptionist. Did you maybe call them earlier in the morning? Also, how did you convince them to settle out of court even after they turned you down before?

 

 

If they have made up their mind to proceed it may not be possible to change that. If the TOC consider that the alleged offence warrants prosecution that is their prerogative.

 

As you have already sent a not guilty plea I suggest there is little that will change the prosecution manager's mind now

 

What may have worked for someone else is unlikely to work for A N Other because all cases are judged on individual merit.

 

If you plead not guilty the case will be adjourned to full trial at a later date when the TOC will be required to put their evidence to the Court and may bring their witnesses to give live evidence.

 

I have previously provided a 'sticky' which can be viewed at the top of the forum page entitled 'What happens when you get to Court' and which may help your understanding of the process.

 

If you intend to proceed with a not guilty plea I strongly suggest that you speak to a solicitor specialising in criminal matters and who is familiar with the Court at which your case is to be heard. An initial short consultation will normally be inexpensive, but can be very helpful in a case such as this.

[sailor sam]

Okay, it looks like they're not willing to settle this out of court and want to continue prosecution. With my court date due in a few days time, is there any way I can convince them to settle out of court?

 

Also, I sent off my "not guilty" plea last week. However, on the form it said something about the date being adjourned to a later date if I plea 'not guilty', but I haven't heard back yet from the court whether the date has been adjourned or not. Does it usually get adjourned when you plea not guilty? And if there is no way out of court, any advice on how I should proceed and handle the case?

 

Also, to Kitoo: How did you speak on the phone to the prosecutor directly? I've called them a few times, and I always end up speaking with the receptionist. Did you maybe call them earlier in the morning? Also, how did you convince them to settle out of court even after they turned you down before?

 

Sorry I must of missed something. I thought you had been caught using a freedom pass to which you were not entitled to use?

Obviously by pleading not guilty you couldn't of done. Otherwise that wasn't the smartest thing to do. All you will achieve is a harsher sentence. Unless of course you were IN FACT not guilty.

[Django2013]

Sorry I must of missed something. I thought you had been caught using a freedom pass to which you were not entitled to use?

Obviously by pleading not guilty you couldn't of done. Otherwise that wasn't the smartest thing to do. All you will achieve is a harsher sentence. Unless of course you were IN FACT not guilty.

 

Like I explained before, it was an unintentional accident.

[Django2013]

If they have made up their mind to proceed it may not be possible to change that. If the TOC consider that the alleged offence warrants prosecution that is their prerogative.

 

As you have already sent a not guilty plea I suggest there is little that will change the prosecution manager's mind now

 

What may have worked for someone else is unlikely to work for A N Other because all cases are judged on individual merit.

 

If you plead not guilty the case will be adjourned to full trial at a later date when the TOC will be required to put their evidence to the Court and may bring their witnesses to give live evidence.

 

I have previously provided a 'sticky' which can be viewed at the top of the forum page entitled 'What happens when you get to Court' and which may help your understanding of the process.

 

If you intend to proceed with a not guilty plea I strongly suggest that you speak to a solicitor specialising in criminal matters and who is familiar with the Court at which your case is to be heard. An initial short consultation will normally be inexpensive, but can be very helpful in a case such as this.

Thanks for the advice.

 

I think I might do just that and consider consulting a solicitor.

[sailor sam]

Like I explained before, it was an unintentional accident.

 

Unfortunately that dosn't mean you were 'not guilty'. You may be making things worse by pleading so. As OC says, you should consult a solicitor.

[kitoo]

Hi Django

 

Any developments re soilicter , court case, tf make my blood boil. Unitentional accidents do happen and according to tfl youve got to pay for them for eternity practically Well if I was you I would take all my mitigation to court ( u said u were a carer for your dad innit, all the stress of the carers could have well made you forgetful and I would go to the Carers support group see carers uk and ask them for some letter or something to support that you are carer and can face a lot of stress, stick to your guns as it sounds like you are completely truthful ( why lie) and hopefully Godwilling the judge or whoever will see that tfl are just nonsense. Also in some cases I believe that the barrirsters can do a arrangemnet on the day if they are too busy and you can pay cash fine on the day to settle out of court.

[Grotesque]

Yes... if THEY want. Not whether you want them to. And if they go all the way to theCourt steps having refused offers of settlement, why would they suddenly change their minds. That would be rather a volte face... innit

[kitoo]

Yes... if THEY want. Not whether you want them to. And if they go all the way to theCourt steps having refused offers of settlement, why would they suddenly change their minds. That would be rather a volte face... innit

 

Actually its not so much about they ie tfl reps it depends very much on the barrister and if the barrister is keen on setting out of court. If thebarrister thinks it will be too much hassle( for whatever reason) than they just might settle out of court. If it was up to tfl they would give you the death penalty.

[Grotesque]

Err... who instructs the barrister? Under whose instructions are the Barristers working?

[kitoo]

Err... who instructs the barrister? Under whose instructions are the Barristers working?

 

are you a abarrister or do you know any or how the court system works in practice? The barrister may be under instruction but they do advise and often persuade their clients

[kitoo]

Practice not theory dont go by the textbook, operationally things can be quite different!

[Grotesque]

Yes... as I would know, padawan

[Old-CodJA]

I think this thread appears to be becoming slightly surreal.

 

I suggest that talk of Barristers handling what appears to be a straightforward summons to a Magistrates Court hearing is very wide of the mark of reality here and does indicate a lack of understanding of at what level this type of offence will be heard..

 

From the OPs post, this is certainly not a Crown Court matter.

 

Seeking the advice of a solicitor can be the best course of action in these cases.