Ashamed, embarrased - Tesco Theft

[ashamed_lucy]

Hello,

 

Firstly like most others on here,

I find myself feeling sick to the pit of my stomach about the most out of character and utterly mortifying thing Ive ever done.

 

A few days ago I walked out of Tesco with a few bottles of wine.

My reasons for doing so are far reaching and the crux of it comes down to having no money,

not on benefits but money coming in does not cover bills let alone food (debt problems are another story which I wont go into).

 

After a few months of living off food rations and a feeling of utter desperation it led me to do something I am beyond ashamed about. My first and last time.

 

To cut a long story short, I walked out and was apprehended by a store manager and his female colleague,

was taken to the back room of the store and emptied my bag of two bottles of wine. the total was under £35.

 

They asked me my name and address which I gave and they called police they also passed me a piece of paper about RLP but nothing else was said.

 

The police arrived 20 mins later and one officer stayed with me and the other took statements from the security/staff from outside the room.

 

I made a statement, admitted guilt, was searched throughly and was kept waiting for another 30 mins,

they were going to caution me and then they both spoke outside of the room and decided they were going to take me to the police station and arrest me.

 

I asked why they were taking this course of action and they said it was because of the value of the items taken.

 

We got to the police station and DNA samples were taken alongside fingerprints and my photograph was taken.

I was quiet throughout albeit shaking through fear.

I have never been in trouble before and have never been in a police station let alone anything else.

I was told that it would now be referred to the courts to decide on whether to charge me with theft or fine me.

They said I would hear in a few weeks on whether I have to attend court.

 

I haven't slept in a few days and am actually grateful I have nothing to eat in the house as I am not hungry!

I cant speak to anyone about this and am now at a friends house surfing for answers as I am so scared about what is going to happen next.

 

I have no previous convictions and am so scared I will have to go to court.

 

One of the reasons being I have family members who work there and they might see my name on court appearance paperwork?

 

I am not sure what it all means,

As I have admitted guilt will I be charged by the court or issued a caution and fine.

Reading some other posts it makes me feel optimistic that I would be lucky to escape with a fine, and the dreaded RLP letter.

 

Do matter like this noramlly end up with people having to attend court?

I understand that if I am charged I will have a criminal record.

Does this ever get removed after a number of years,

I am so distraught and am feeling like the lowest of the low and sick beyond belief.

 

The thought that I am now on the police network makes me sick with worry.

 

As a detterent to repeat offenders, my shock has worked.

I will never be so stupid as to do anything like that ever again. I am just so scared about the possible ramifications.

Please could anyone reply with what could possibly happen and what has happened in similar circumstances in the past.

I have no one I can confide in about my stupidity as I am utterly ashamed by my actions.

 

Thank you in advance for any advice anyone can give me.

 

Lucy

[ashamed_lucy]

Sorry, I should also add that I wasnt given any verbal banning from the store, will this come in a letter?

 

I have read many posts now where people were just issued on the spot fines,

I am still shaking and so scared at whats happened.

 

Another thing is I have an appointment at the sames tesco's dentist in a few weeks time

and am so scared to go now incase I get shunted out of the door as soon as I walk in.

 

Thanks again

 

Lucy

[dx100uk]

you'l be ok going to their dentist.

 

they dont run any facial recognition

despite what they might claim!

 

you'll prob just get called to the police station for a caution.

 

but WHATEVER happens

 

DO NOT reply or ever pay the RLP speculative invoice!!

 

dx

[ashamed_lucy]

Thank you for your reply, I will not respond to the letter from RLP if it arrives, even though reading from this board I know that they can become quite intimidating.

 

As this has now been sent to the court, what could the possible outcome be for a first offence. If it is a caution will I have to attend the court or is it normally a police station? also the caution will include a fine? I am sorry for the questions, and I know it is out of my hands now and what will be will be but I don't think I will be able to cope with this uncertainty for the next few weeks feeling as sick and as scared as I do now.

 

Thank you for your help

 

Lucy

[stargazerlily]

Hi Lucy, know exactly how you're feeling, try not to beat yourself up about it, we all make mistakes in life, as you say it's out of your hands now. I felt exactly like you about three weeks ago, have had two letters so far from Drydens and though my heart sinks when I see who they're from, I'm not going to let it take over my life any more. Take care.

[dx100uk]

doubt its been sent to court - where did that come from?

 

you'll just get a police caution which is verbal at the station

 

if ANYTHING AT ALL

you might never hear a thing.

 

dx

[ashamed_lucy]

Hi Lucy, know exactly how you're feeling, try not to beat yourself up about it, we all make mistakes in life, as you say it's out of your hands now. I felt exactly like you about three weeks ago, have had two letters so far from Drydens and though my heart sinks when I see who they're from, I'm not going to let it take over my life any more. Take care.

 

Thanks StarGazerlily, I just feel so sick about it, am trying not to think about it too much and have been scouring the internet when I get a chance to find out what happens next, I suppose the police just never informed me properly what would normally result from this, I did ask in situations like this what happens next and they just said it was being sent to the CPS/Proc. Fiscal and they would decide. I just hate the not knowing, will I have to attend court etc...

 

Thanks again for answering, its horrible not being able to discuss it with anyone!

 

Lucy

[ashamed_lucy]

doubt its been sent to court - where did that come from?

 

you'll just get a police caution which is verbal at the station

 

if ANYTHING AT ALL

you might never hear a thing.

 

dx

 

I really do hope thats the case, however is that normally the case when they have arrested you and taken dna and fingerprints that they just let it go? Is it someone at the station who decides or is it the CPS/Proc.Fiscal that decide that it isnt worth a formal caution etc.. I am just petrified of going to court which they were alluding to, I dont know whether to scare me or otherwise... And I am 33 and am still feeling all shaken up by it!

 

Thanks again

 

Lucy

[dx100uk]

scare tactics

 

dx

[ashamed_lucy]

scare tactics

 

dx

 

I really hope so DX..

[Solipsist]

Hello Lucy,

Sorry to hear of this difficult time you are going through.

 

I have had a Police caution for shoplifting. It must be ~13 years ago, and I do not know what has changed, procedurally, in that time.

 

What I do recall is that I was cautioned AT THE POLICE STATION at the time of the offence and it was made clear to me no further action would be taken.

[i don't even think the loathsome RLP existed at this point].

 

So sadly, and wrongly, for a first conviction of goods less than £40 it seems likely it will proceed to court.

 

Firstly I AM NO EXPERT. With a low income you SHOULD be entitled to Legal Aid.

You will have been offered a solicitor at the Police Station, did you take advice from him/her?

If so they would have given you the name and phone no. of the company they represesent.

ASK THEM to advise you further.

 

If you did not get advice from a solicitor from at the Station, firstly, establish your eligibility for Legal Aid,

secondly, GET A SOLICITOR.

They will be better able to offer immediate advice and, obviously, follow the case through to Magistrates Court, should it proceed that far.

 

If it is a genuine first offence, a conditional discharge seems the most likely outcome, yes you will have a criminal record after this.

 

Depending on your type of work, eg: Nurse, it will always show on your CRB.

Sorry if this sounds so gloomy.

 

To my non-legal mind, if they're going to caution at £35, just when in the hell aren't they?

 

Best of luck.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Solipsist
clarify

[ashamed_lucy]

Hello Lucy,

Sorry to hear of this difficult time you are going through.I have had a Police caution for shoplifting. It must be ~13 years ago, and I do not know what has changed, procedurally, in that time.What I do recall is that I was cautioned AT THE POLICE STATION at the time of the offence and it was made clear to me no further action would be taken. [i don't even think the loathsome RLP existed at this point]. So sadly, and wrongly, for a first conviction of goods less than £40 it seems likely it will proceed to court. Firstly I AM NO EXPERT. With a low income you SHOULD be entitled to Legal Aid. You will have been offered a solicitor at the Police Station, did you take advice from him/her? If so they would have given you the name and phone no. of the company they represesent. ASK THEM to advise you further. If you did not get advice from a solicitor from at the Station, firstly, establish your eligibility for Legal Aid, secondly, GET A SOLICITOR. They will be better able to offer immediate advice and, obviously, follow the case through to Magistrates Court, should it proceed that far.If it is a genuine first offence, a conditional discharge seems the most likely outcome, yes you will have a criminal record after this.Depending on your type of work, eg: Nurse, it will always show on your CRB.Sorry if this sounds so gloomy. To my non-legal mind, if they're going to caution at £35, just when in the hell aren't they? Best of luck.

 

Thank you for your reply Solipsist. I havent heard anything yet from the CPS/Proc Fiscal, but the more I read the more likely I think it is I will receive a police caustion at the station and fine, I am going by cases that are similar to mine, I am still feeling sick to the pit of my stomach over a week on, I believe that it will be on my record for all to see. This is what upsets me most because I am actually a loyal, law abiding and trustworthy person, it is out of character and I am trying to understand how I could've been so stupid.

 

This board and the people on it are so kind and helpful, hopefully one day I will be able to ease someones worrries.

[old bill]

Hi Lucy,

 

Unless the bottles of wine were from one of the more expensive vineyards, Tesco are doing their usual and making a mountain out of a molehill. From what you've said in your posts, it seems to me the police are likely to take the same view. It costs around £2,000 per case to prosecute a person at a Magistrates Court or its equivalent in Scotland and the CPS/PF are not going to go to that expense for the sake of a few bottles of cheap plonk, probably costing no more than about £12.00 in total. In my experience, I think it more likely that the police will be told to administer a caution, which is verbal and a written record is kept of it.

[ashamed_lucy]

Hi Lucy,

 

Unless the bottles of wine were from one of the more expensive vineyards, Tesco are doing their usual and making a mountain out of a molehill. From what you've said in your posts, it seems to me the police are likely to take the same view. It costs around £2,000 per case to prosecute a person at a Magistrates Court or its equivalent in Scotland and the CPS/PF are not going to go to that expense for the sake of a few bottles of cheap plonk, probably costing no more than about £12.00 in total. In my experience, I think it more likely that the police will be told to administer a caution, which is verbal and a written record is kept of it.

 

Thanks Old Bill! The bottles of wine were about £10 each .... and I received the dreaded RLP letter today. I am going to take the advice on this board and totally ignore it. I don't even want to reply back saying I deny liability as I am not sure if Tesco's would've sent on CCTV footage? So I hope I am doing the right thing by just ignoring. I now understand why people who receive these letters get scared into paying, they do look mighty official!

[old bill]

Hello Lucy,

Sorry to hear of this difficult time you are going through.

 

I have had a Police caution for shoplifting. It must be ~13 years ago, and I do not know what has changed, procedurally, in that time.

 

What I do recall is that I was cautioned AT THE POLICE STATION at the time of the offence and it was made clear to me no further action would be taken.

[i don't even think the loathsome RLP existed at this point].

 

So sadly, and wrongly, for a first conviction of goods less than £40 it seems likely it will proceed to court.

 

Firstly I AM NO EXPERT. With a low income you SHOULD be entitled to Legal Aid.

You will have been offered a solicitor at the Police Station, did you take advice from him/her?

If so they would have given you the name and phone no. of the company they represesent.

ASK THEM to advise you further.

 

If you did not get advice from a solicitor from at the Station, firstly, establish your eligibility for Legal Aid,

secondly, GET A SOLICITOR.

They will be better able to offer immediate advice and, obviously, follow the case through to Magistrates Court, should it proceed that far.

 

If it is a genuine first offence, a conditional discharge seems the most likely outcome, yes you will have a criminal record after this.

 

Depending on your type of work, eg: Nurse, it will always show on your CRB.

Sorry if this sounds so gloomy.

 

To my non-legal mind, if they're going to caution at £35, just when in the hell aren't they?

 

Best of luck.

 

I hope a solicitor was provided at the police station because it is a legal requirement, under the Police & Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (as amended), for the police to offer you the services of one, at your own or public expense. If that wasn't done, this case ain't going anywhere.

[old bill]

Thanks Old Bill! The bottles of wine were about £10 each .... and I received the dreaded RLP letter today. I am going to take the advice on this board and totally ignore it. I don't even want to reply back saying I deny liability as I am not sure if Tesco's would've sent on CCTV footage? So I hope I am doing the right thing by just ignoring. I now understand why people who receive these letters get scared into paying, they do look mighty official!

 

The premises RLP use as justification for their claims fail to take account of and, indeed, appear to ignore the ruling in the case of Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd -v- New Garage & Motor Co Ltd 1915. This particular piece of case law has stood firm and formed a cornerstone of English Civil Litigation Law for the last 97 years. Its basic thrust is that if you make a claim against another, you must prove that you have suffered actual and quantifiable loss and that the person you allege caused the loss did, in fact, cause the alleged loss. However, in claiming, any damages you seek can only put you in the same position you were in before the alleged loss was suffered or occurred. You are not allowed to be better-off financially. In a court case in Oxford, earlier this year, it was found that the claimant, a retailer, had inflated the sums claimed and would have been better-off financially. It was also found that the case law RLP were quoting did not stand up and the judge, a senior Circuit Judge, dismissed the claim and refused the retailer leave to appeal. From what I have seen of some of the case law RLP quote in order to try and justify their claims, which do not justify the claims being made, it is going to be interesting to see if civil recovery survives as the public tide of anger and outrage is turning on the civil recovery industry.

[flowerbomb01]

Hi Lucy

 

Hope you are feeling a bit better as the days have gone by. I know how you feel and its an awful feeling, but try not to let it consume you, the value was low and I doubt and hope for you that it does not go to court, as per another post the cost of court proceedings for such a low value would seem extreme. Have you actually heard from RLP yet if so have they said how much they are claiming. If you get this please take a look at my thread as I did reply to your post to me on nthat as i couldnt leave one on yours.

 

Fingers will be crossed for you,

Flowerbomb01

[flowerbomb01]

Hi Lucy

 

I am new to all this forum stuff and cannot quite work my way around it, Tried to reply on your thread as am not sure where you get to read but I couldnt add a post on yours as I only had 3 posts myself!!!! I am lost so hopefully you may take a peek at mine again and see my reply

 

thanks

[ashamed_lucy]

I hope a solicitor was provided at the police station because it is a legal requirement, under the Police & Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (as amended), for the police to offer you the services of one, at your own or public expense. If that wasn't done, this case ain't going anywhere.

 

I can't actually recall if I was offered one as there were about 5 police officers in the room taking down all manner of details and I was being asked so many questions with them then talking amongst themselves about things. it was all a bit confusing to be honest Old Bill. Thanks for your reply!

[ashamed_lucy]

The premises RLP use as justification for their claims fail to take account of and, indeed, appear to ignore the ruling in the case of Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd -v- New Garage & Motor Co Ltd 1915. This particular piece of case law has stood firm and formed a cornerstone of English Civil Litigation Law for the last 97 years. Its basic thrust is that if you make a claim against another, you must prove that you have suffered actual and quantifiable loss and that the person you allege caused the loss did, in fact, cause the alleged loss. However, in claiming, any damages you seek can only put you in the same position you were in before the alleged loss was suffered or occurred. You are not allowed to be better-off financially. In a court case in Oxford, earlier this year, it was found that the claimant, a retailer, had inflated the sums claimed and would have been better-off financially. It was also found that the case law RLP were quoting did not stand up and the judge, a senior Circuit Judge, dismissed the claim and refused the retailer leave to appeal. From what I have seen of some of the case law RLP quote in order to try and justify their claims, which do not justify the claims being made, it is going to be interesting to see if civil recovery survives as the public tide of anger and outrage is turning on the civil recovery industry.

 

Yes, no loss was caused to them whether or they could claim time for their staff or security to do what they had to whilst I was detained would figure in that. I really do hope the demise of these companies is imminent!

[ashamed_lucy]

Hi Lucy

 

Hope you are feeling a bit better as the days have gone by. I know how you feel and its an awful feeling, but try not to let it consume you, the value was low and I doubt and hope for you that it does not go to court, as per another post the cost of court proceedings for such a low value would seem extreme. Have you actually heard from RLP yet if so have they said how much they are claiming. If you get this please take a look at my thread as I did reply to your post to me on nthat as i couldnt leave one on yours.

 

Fingers will be crossed for you,

Flowerbomb01

 

Thanks Flowerbomb, I replied on your thread. The RLP letter is demanding £137.50 from me, it looks very convincing and scary, I m however going to stand my ground with this and Ignore and if I get more letters I will come and ask the very helpful peple on this board what to do next. Thanjs again for your kindness, it really does mean a lot that there are people that won't judge and give straight forward advice to those who find themselves in this position. I feel like a total Anthony Worrel Thompson... At least spared the public humiliation.

[old bill]

I can't actually recall if I was offered one as there were about 5 police officers in the room taking down all manner of details and I was being asked so many questions with them then talking amongst themselves about things. it was all a bit confusing to be honest Old Bill. Thanks for your reply!

 

It's very important that you remember if the police offered you the services of a solicitor or actually obtained a solicitor for you. Failure on their part to comply with this legal requirement can impact on the entire case. Believe me, it can.

[flowerbomb01]

Hi Lucy

 

I cant believe they asked for so much £137.50 and you still have the worry of waiting to hear from the police. I am not at all justiying what we have all done but I do believe the security and police know by the persons reaction whether they are 1st time offenders which the police check anyway. In my cirmcumstance the police officer actually said to me I can see you will never do this again which I wont, a short sharp shock certainly brought me swiftly to my senses.

 

The store choose to call the police, the police decide whether to issue a PCN, then it shoud be left that the case has been dealt with by the police and the store should leave it at that if low value .

If the store wants to prosecute then they should be made to go through the courts but after reading all whast on here they dont because it costs too much money. if they want payment recovery then they shouldnt call the police. I am sure they would make more money like that as terrified people would probaly agree to pay anything whilst in that little room, if you could pay the store direct and no involvement with the police or RPL I know I would have done if given the option in that office to pay costs of £137.50 or they will call the police/ involve civil recovery I think would have agreed to almost anything that day They cant have it twice

 

 

If people refuse the PCN then the police have the power to take things further. I really cant understand why they took you to police station and went that far with low value items that was returned, as you have not heard anything perhaps you will be lucky and it may go away and they never follow it up. I doubt a court will look at it too favourably with the value involved and the time and cost of a court case for under £35. Maybe you will get a caution if they contact you. When the police was writing out my PCN he read me my rights you know ths stuff they say on the TV.... anything you say may be taken in writing etc etc I dont know if this was a caution as well for me I wasnt in my right senses to ask what was going on really, he said I wouldnt get a criminal record but the PCN would stay on file for the future so I dont know if I was cautioned or just read my rights, if you have any info on that let me know

 

There is thread somewhere on here from an ex TK max security guard and he says some stores have targets of how many people to catch, worth a read if you have not read it already.

 

I will let you know once I recieve the letter and how much they ask for, keep me posted on how you get on as well and when you next letter arrives, I really wish there where posts with how long it took RPL to give up, it makes me wonder if they ever give up or will it come back to haunt us in years to come when left unpaid.

 

Flowerbomb

[stargazerlily]

Lucy and flowerbomb, hope all works out well for you both.

Does anyone know if it's only at the Police Station you are entitled to a Solicitor or does the same apply when the Police are called to the store?

[old bill]

Lucy and flowerbomb, hope all works out well for you both.

Does anyone know if it's only at the Police Station you are entitled to a Solicitor or does the same apply when the Police are called to the store?

 

The Police & Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (as amended) requires that anyone taken into police custody who is accused of committing an offence is entitled, by law, to the services of a solicitor, at their own or public expense. When police are called to retail premises in cases of alleged shoplifting, the officers dealing will assess the case. This requires them to listen to both sides, view any CCTV footage and use something known as the Ghosh Test. This is the two-part test for dishonesty prescribed by the Court of Appeal in the case of R -v- Ghosh 1982. If only one or neither of the two parts of the test are satisfied, there is no offence. It is becoming evident that retailers are trying their luck with civil recovery when there is clearly no offence or grounds in law for attempting to bring a civil claim.