notice and holiday pay

[crazyjim22]

I have been on long term sick leave and have now been medically retired. I have been given statutory notice of 11 weeks as I worked for 11 years but no holiday pay. I am still on a sick note from the GP so am not working my notice. Should any holiday owed be paid over and above my notice and if so do I still accure holiday during my notice period.

 

Many thanks to anyone who can help with this.

[elche]

Hi Jim,

 

Sorry to hear that.

 

Can I first ask what they are paying you during your notice, full contractual pay or SSP, or indeed nada?

 

Che

[elche]

The reason I ask is because it will be easier to look at the notice pay initially.

 

As regards the holiday pay, other CAGGERS will no doubt roll out Stringer (see the sticky thread at the top http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?251897-Sick-pay-amp-all-ancillary-beneifits-DO-accrue-during-sickness), but in fact to rely on Stringer alone is simplistic, as," The stringer case only sought to clarify that sick employees did in fact continue to accrue leave."

 

But since then we have had two contradictory EAT decisions. One (NHS Leeds v Larner) supports you being owed this and is here:

 

http://www.bondpearce.com/(S(impccbvvm4hkjm3hip35dcjw))/insight/Comment/NHS_Leeds_v_Larner_an_updaet_on_holiday_pay_for_sick_workers/

 

But I know (because I have seen a memo about this) that there is another EAT decision knocking about right now that reached a different view and contradicts with Larner but right now I cannot remember the other name

 

I think we're saying at work if the sick employee didn't request the leave within the last 3 months and / or regularly throughout the period of leave, keep the money to one side whilst we await more guidance on this .....

 

EDIT **

 

And lo and behold here is the other case http://www.xperthr.co.uk/article/111139/eat-rules-sick-employees-must-give-notice-of-intention-to-take-holiday-in-order-to-be-paid-for-it.aspx

 

And I have to say it was in fact commented upon prudently by becky on this thread on CAG

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?335796-Larner-v-NHS-and-Fraser-v-South-West-London-St-Georges-Mental-Health-trust.

 

The basic position is that in order to take your annual leave pay in lieu, you have to have asserted your right to take annual leave during the holiday year. This didn't overrule Stringer, but it does mean that there are more stringent rules. The stringer case only sought to clarify that sick employees did in fact continue to accrue leave.

 

Did you contact your employer during your sickness absence to request to be paid for the leave, or has it only now been brought up? If you didn't request it, you may have lost it.

 

Incidentally, I have noted that opinion in the legal world is that the recent decision was pretty non sensical. It basically means that if an employee tells their employer "I have accrued annual leave this year" then they get paid for it, and if they're silent on the matter, it's lost. Seems a bit crazy.

 

 

Edited June 2, 2012 by elche

[crazyjim22]

In theory I am being paid full contrctual pay but it has all been rather messy. Intially I was paid 0.94 of a months pay being I assume unpaid pay and no notice. I queried this and was eventually told I could have 11 weeks notice pay but I won't actually get it as I was told there is a clause in my contract - that I was not aware of - that they can deduct any unpaid school fees from final pay. Which as I pay these by direct debit means if I hadn't of queried it I would have received no notice pay and still have paid the fees by direct debit!! Initially I was annoyed by this but actually now it looks like they have done me a favour as I would have paid twice!!

 

Anyway back to point I have read the stuff on Stringer and it is confusing.

 

My leave years runs Sept - Aug and I get 20 days plus stat hols = 28 days. I went off sick beginning Apr 2011 intially my emplyment was terminated Mar 31st 2012 when I was paid the 0.94 of a month hol pay but last day is now 15th June.

 

Thanks for your help.

Edited June 3, 2012 by crazyjim22

[crazyjim22]

Did you contact your employer during your sickness absence to request to be paid for the leave, or has it only now been brought up? If you didn't request it, you may have lost it.

 

As I had only been on SSP since Sept it was around xmas when my employers were chased up with regards to an OH doctors appointment which took 6 months to arrange and I was told as a goodwill gesture they would pay holiday. The OH appointment finally came through in Feb payment of holiday was chased up in Mar then I got my letter terminating my eomployment and was paid the 0.94.

[elche]

Well Jim I suppose all you can do as regards the holiday is attempt to protect your right to payment for accrued untaken leave upon termination.

 

Are you saying that you have not had any holiday pay at all since April 2011?

 

I think you need to consider a letter to your employer asking for accrued holiday pay, say you believe that you are owed it and ask them why they are refusing to pay.

 

And what is this 0.94 of a month's pay about?

[crazyjim22]

Yep thats right no holiday pay since Mar 2011. When I got my original termination letter I also got paid 0.94 of a months pay. I assumed this was outstanding holiday pay as there was no explanation given for it but it doesn't seem to be the right amount, I had to battle to get the 11 weeks notice and am still trying to get my P60 out of them. You see their admin os pretty bloody poor that or they just don't know what they are doing or assume I don't know what I should receive.

 

So looks like another letter to query holiday pay with the threat of a tribunal to spur them on maybe.