MNBA Help Please

[Claire Marshall]

I wrote to MBNA on the 24th October 2011 wanting a true signed executed copy of my agreement under section 78 of the consumer credit act.

 

It has now been some 12 days since I requested this and MBNA have failed to comply. I have had no communication from them at all.

 

I sent them today a letter saying that because they have failed to produce this valid agreement under section 78, I have placed the account under section 10 default notice, to dispute the agreement. I have £1700 on the card to date.

 

If they still don't comply within 30 days to send me the agreement, what can I do then please??

 

Thanks!!

[Claire Marshall]

I wrote a letter to MBNA asking for a true signed copy of my CCA on the 24th October 2011.

 

No response they ignored the request.

 

Today, I sent them another letter this time putting the account in dispute under a section 10 , as they have failed to respond for the CCA.

 

If MBNA still fail to respond within 30 days of giving me a CCA, what is the next step please?

 

I have £1700 on the card, but I pay £40 minimum payment each month.

[dx100uk]

the 30 days no longer exist

 

and TBH i would be very wary of using a paperwork error

to null your debt

times have changed

 

tell us the story

 

dx

[Claire Marshall]

I was told by Consumer Direct about the initial 12 day rule.

 

I will be going into CAB if after I sent MBNA their nasty letter!!

 

I have always been told that if no signed agreement how can the debt be enforced!!??

 

Also is the same with Barclaycard all they have given me is a reconstituted agreement which has no name or signature!!

[rebel11]

Hi claire

 

Have you been mis-sold PPI on these accounts?, MBNA do what they like so you might have PPI without signing for it. Have you got Penalty Charges that you can claim back. I'd be looking at claiming these back with interest before you look at anything else. Send a SAR Request, they will send you all the statements for 6 years plus. Template in the library.

 

http://www.shweb.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/interestcalcs.xls - credit card charges

 

http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/publications/technical_notes/ppi.html

 

Have a read of 1,2,3,4,5 and 6 in my signature.

[Claire Marshall]

Thank you but I don't think I had PPI I check my statements as and when they come in and cant see anything.

 

My monthly payment gets taken via direct debit so is always paid on time.

 

I did however get a cheeky letter from MBNA moaning about me paying the minimum payment each month!!

 

What a bloody cheek!!

[ims21]

Hi

 

As dx says...what is the story? What are you trying to achieve?

 

ims

[Claire Marshall]

I wrote to MBNA on the 24th October asking for my CCA.

 

Waited 12 days, and no reply.

 

Sent them a nasty letter on the 7th November 2011, claiming a section 10 notice.

 

They suddenly sent a letter asking for a £1.00 statutory fee which I sent them recorded delivery.

 

Since then, no response from MBNA, they haven't even sent me the CCA after sending them a £1.00 fee as requested!!

 

I understand that if after 30 days they can't respond i.e. fail to comply, I can report the matter to Office of Fair Trading as they are committing a criminal offence.

 

Anyone else fed up with MBNA over a non-compliance of a section 78 request??

 

Any advice please most welcome!!

 

Thank you.

[rebel11]

Hi Claire

 

Send an account in dispute letter. Remember you've got proof that you sent it, also look up the postal receipt number and print out the signature. You might need to send proof later.

[Claire Marshall]

Thank you rebell11 I have already done this and they have ignored it!!

[Claire Marshall]

MBNA have now officialy failed to comply under a section 77/78 request for a signed agreement.

 

I have been told by a solicitor that if they fail to comply within 30 days, it then becomes a criminal offence!!

 

Well after several letters since the 24th October, and a final letter sent today, MBNA now dont have a leg to stand on!!

 

I have reported them to the Financial Ombudsman Service, and I have written to the Office of Fair Trading.

 

Basically I have failed to have been given a signed credit agreement and its now gone over 30 days!!

 

Why cant they just admit they dont have one to save all this aggravation!!

 

I have also contacted a company called Bank Smart who are based in London and they state on their terms and condition that it becomes a criminal offence within 14 days!!

 

They are going to check my credit agreement to see if its enforceable or if MBNA have one in general!!

[flowerchild]

MBNA have now officialy failed to comply under a section 77/78 request for a signed agreement.

 

I have been told by a solicitor that if they fail to comply within 30 days, it then becomes a criminal offence!!

 

Well after several letters since the 24th October, and a final letter sent today, MBNA now dont have a leg to stand on!!

 

I have reported them to the Financial Ombudsman Service, and I have written to the Office of Fair Trading.

 

Basically I have failed to have been given a signed credit agreement and its now gone over 30 days!!

 

Why cant they just admit they dont have one to save all this aggravation!!

 

I have also contacted a company called Bank Smart who are based in London and they state on their terms and condition that it becomes a criminal offence within 14 days!!

 

They are going to check my credit agreement to see if its enforceable or if MBNA have one in general!!

 

As much as I share your hatred of MBNA, you're wrong! s77/78 is all CIVIL LAW, nothing to do with a criminal offence! For it to be a crime you'd have to be supplied with a document that's clearly a forgery. The information you've been given is completely wrong!

 

I don't know what you were trying to achieve with your request but if you are trying to put the account in dispute, then it should work in your favour, at least for the time being.

 

MBNA have been buying accounts from all and sundry so each account is different, I'm also an MBNA debtor with no CCA by the way.

[flowerchild]

Once you've got it out of your head you're dealing with a criminal offense on their part, you'll need to provide a bit more information on this account:

 

When did you open it?

When did you last pay?

Have you been defaulted?

Are you on a DMP/making token payments?

How much do you owe?

What's the history of the account, i.e. did MBNA buy it from another lender? if so, who?

How did you obtain the account? Did you apply online? over the phone? filling out a 10 minute application?

What was MBNA's reply to your CCA request? Did they say they don't have one? That they are looking for it? that they need more time?

Are you being chased by a DCA for this debt? Who?

[flowerchild]

Thirdly, if you're looking at unenforceability, you need to keep cool! Relax! You can't obtain a 'defective' agreement, take your creditor to court and expect to win! That's no longer the case! BankSmart is a claims management company, anyone with any sense, certainly anyone on this forum, would advise against using any of them! You WON'T win an unenforceability case against a bank as a CLAIMANT, even with the help of a CMC! The Rankines, a couple famous for dealing with such claims was actually banned from using the courts for that purpose nearly two years ago...

 

What you can do is hope they can't produce anything of substance, which is not that uncommon when it comes to MBNA!

[ims21]

Hi

 

Just to jump in with a bit of reference material...

 

S77(4)(b) CCA was repealed by CPUTR 2008 Sch2 Para 19

 

S78(6)(b) CCA was repealed by CPUTR 2008 Sch2 Para 20

 

(These are the bits about commiting offences)

 

See here

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/section/77

 

Regards

 

ims

[Claire Marshall]

Well, MBNA have not produce a CCA for over 30 days now!!

 

The FOS said to me very clearly its an offence not to produce a CCA within 30 days of requesting it!!

 

Bank Smart are NOT a claims management company; they dont charge upfront fees to check agreements, etc etc.

 

I have written 2 letters to MBNA putting the account clearly in dispute and they have ignored my letters altogether; I was told by the FOS that because they ignored my letters this will go more in my favour!!

 

I sent MBNA a £1.00 statutory fee that they requested on the 4th November, still no sign of a CCA!!

 

MBNA are a bloody joke I say!!

[flowerchild]

Well, MBNA have not produce a CCA for over 30 days now!!

 

The FOS said to me very clearly its an offence not to produce a CCA within 30 days of requesting it!!

 

Bank Smart are NOT a claims management company; they dont charge upfront fees to check agreements, etc etc.

 

Quote from their website: Bank-Smart currently offers claims management services for the following types of claim:

 

I have written 2 letters to MBNA putting the account clearly in dispute and they have ignored my letters altogether; I was told by the FOS that because they ignored my letters this will go more in my favour!!

 

I sent MBNA a £1.00 statutory fee that they requested on the 4th November, still no sign of a CCA!!

 

MBNA are a bloody joke I say!!

 

Still not clear what you are trying to achieve with all this and why you are so upset! Do your homework and you'll find plenty of sources telling you no-one can win an unenforceability claim as CLAIMANT any more! Regardless of whether they charge you up-front or not, if that's the reason you're so desperate to get your hands on your CCA, forget it!

 

Unenforceability (UE) can still be used but only as a defence. What happens if MBNA send you an agreement that's 100% enforceable? Once they've done that they can go to court and get a CCJ against you!

 

Without the said agreement, they couldn't get judgment against you so are better off as you are! With a bit of luck they will NEVER find it, that's so far been the case with me, in which case they can't enforce the debt in court. If you want to go down the UE route you just have to sit tight! No point shouting about not having received a CCA, your problems will begin if and when they do send you one!

[minmoo]

Wise words flowerchild, i have been waiting a year for a cca on my mbna card (which was originally another bank). At least they told me they cany currently comply with my request. Everyday without a letter on the mat is good news for me. Take a deep breath and relax Clare Marshall

[Claire Marshall]

Thank you peeps for all your advice; well I hope MBNA are going to get worried when they have 3 firms chasing them over an unenforceable agreement LOL

 

I will keep you all posted how I am doing!!

 

If MBNA cant give me a credit agreement I sure as hell dont reckon they can comply when Bank Smart challenges them for it!!

 

Maybe MBNA in future needs to keep credit agreements LOL

 

They dont have a leg to stand on now!!

[Claire Marshall]

Thank you flowerchild, but as of yet still no CCA even after 30 days!!

 

They haven't even said if one exists, ah well happy days MBNA!! LOL

[flowerchild]

Claire I"m sorry but you still have the whole enforceability thing backwards! ENFORCE = get CCJ against you! That's what they can't do without an agreement thus debt is unenforceable - for now! Failing to comply within the timeframe does not make the debt UE forever just while they are in breach! As your request was very recent you can't be sure they won't be able to find it or do a good recon! You never really posted what their reply was! With me I have letters stating they don't have it nearly 2 ys ago - that's unenforceable but I still have another 4 ys to wait for SB! Even when a debt is UE they can still pursue, threaten & even issue a claim hoping to obtain default judgment!

 

How can '3 companies chase MBNA'? They don't have to answer to any 3rd parties other than the official bodies! You can't take them to court for not providing an agreement however you could do so to reclaim PPI if you had it but that's a totally different subject.

 

These days you don't go to court hoping to get your debt wiped off as the judge won't rule in your favour. You just try to stay out of court and get all your ducks in a row in case they issue a claim. If THEY do without the right paperwork then you may well win provided you build a suitable defence. That would provide the closure you seem to be after but it can be tricky and in your case probably a year or more away (if at all!). If you have stopped paying then the SB clock is already ticking…

[Claire Marshall]

The Financial Ombudsman Sevrice HAS told me if they cant produce an agreement within 30 days it won't go in MBNA's favour. It is still classified as a failure under section 77/78 if they cant produce one in 30 days. The FOS made this very clear which is why they are investigating my complaint against MBNA. The FOS also told me it was unacceptable for MBNA to ignore my letters and not respond as to where the CCA is.

 

I have kept ALL letters sent to MBNA. I kept the receipt for the £1.00 postal order which I sent them for the £1.00 statutory fee which is what MBNA request LOL

 

MBNA have not replied regarding the CCA; that have not said they have one or not!! Just ignored my letters!!

 

How can you deal with a lender who wont reply to letters or state if they have a CCA or not!!??

 

Its frustrating but then again I've seen a lot of peeps who are in my situation with MBNA.

[flowerchild]

Have you sent MBNA a reminder? If not, you can send them this:

 

Dear Sirs

 

Account No/Reference No: XXXXXXXX

 

I refer to my letter dated XX/XX/XXXX in which I made a formal request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA1974) s.77-s.79 for a true copy of the regulated agreement referred to in the above account number. You are reminded that you are obliged to supply this under s.189 whether you are the original creditor or not. I also enclosed the statutory fee of £1.00.

 

To date you have failed to comply with my statutory request and have defaulted in respect of this account. Additionally this alleged agreement is unenforceable until such time as you come out of default or enforced by a court of law. If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor cannot:

 

make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to

get a court judgment against the debtor

 

[OBVIOUSLY YOU HAVE TO DELETE THE FOLLOWING IF YOU ARE NOT PAYING]

As this account is clearly unenforceable, I am considering cessation of payments toward this account, so I do expect you to respond within the next 14 days or you'll leave me with no option but to stop paying into the account, until such time you do comply.

 

Yours faithfully

[Claire Marshall]

MBNA have finally sent a credit agreement received 5 minutes ago through the post!!

 

It says on their letter "copy of your executed agreement".

 

When I read through it, I have not signed the agreement where it says "Signature of Customer". It does show a tick in a box to state that you accept it.

 

Just spoken to the Office of Fair trading on the telephone and they say it ideally needs to be signed by the customer not just tick a box.

 

I opened the account in 2009, so am gutted its not before 2007.

 

Any advice if its legal without a valid signature??

[flowerchild]

I opened the account in 2009, so am gutted its not before 2007.

Any advice if its legal without a valid signature??

 

2009? Forget it! It will be 100% enforceable as s127 which is the one that prevented the courts from enforcing 'defective' agreements was repealed in 2007!

 

Frankly, if your account is that recent, you shouldn't have bothered trying for unenforceability as it only has a chance of working pre-Apr 2007!

 

Sorry to have to say the above, given that I'm no MBNA fan either!