MBNA cant currently comply with CCA, what now?

[minmoo]

Hi Dotty how are you

 

Just to update with a letter received today. Computer generated waffle i guess as it doesn't seem to refer to me much at all except for my name and arrears. Seems they have permanently cancelled my card (must have forgot they have already done that before i missed a payment and asked for help, muppets). No loss lol. Also that they will soon terminate my agreement. What is the difference between that and permanently cancelling the card?

 

Also a lovely leaflet on handling debt giving me alternative contacts for independent advice other than themselves. God i laughed. Do they actually consider themselves to be capable of giving independent advice? Deary me.

 

Edited March 2, 2011 by minmoo

[Bigdebtor]

I love the way these companies advocate using Direct Debit - "this ensures you'll avoid late fees". Really? How come when my Bank bounced my DD's I got BOTH late fees charged by MBNA and unfair £39 charges levied by the Bank? Since MBNA are NEVER wrong this must have been a mistake.

 

I must take this up with them as I have just realised I agreed my 35% F&F with them in May 2007 on the basis of wrong assumptions and didn't realise they had taken loads of late (and over balance) fees in error! That'll be a nice little windfall once I've included contractual interest after nearly 4 years!

 

Do they have an arrangement with all the Banks that any DD they present will be paid to them - even if this results in the unfair £39 unauthorised overdraft charges? If so - and they must - as otherwise their statement is untrue - which is surely not possible from such a "reputable" organisation - then that's VERY worrying! That would mean any current account is totally open to them hoovering out exactly what they want from it!

 

Surely if they give this "advice" they should being giving full and "balanced" advice by also spelling out the cons and risks of using DD's?

 

Come to that - are they actually AUTHORISED to give Financial Advice at all?

 

BD

[Gallahad]

In a press release today a high court judge in wales slated MBNA for torturring a defendant with incessant phone calls and wrote off a card balance of over £20,000 because they failed to supply terms and conditions at the time of signing. This at least proves the banks and government have not got control over all the judiciary yet.

G

[Bigdebtor]

MBNA is based in Chester. Isn't Wales still at war with Chester?

On a more serious note, if MBNA made this mistake once........

 

BD

[minmoo]

its war with them in our house lol

Edited March 3, 2011 by minmoo

[Gallahad]

MBNA is based in Chester. Isn't Wales still at war with Chester?

On a more serious note, if MBNA made this mistake once........

 

BD

Even more to the point what a great rebuff for all the judges that state the opinion that big financial institutions

always get their systems and paperwok correct.

G

[rankore]

After 1 cca has no signature and 3 other credit cards have not sent anything (even though the cheques have cleared) is this my next letter?:

 

A possible letter sent when an 'agreement/application' is received and is questionable..

 

Address

 

Date

 

Dear sir/madam

 

Thank you for your response to my request under the Consumer Credit Act section 78.

In your response you confirm this as a true copy of the original agreement executed by yourselves on the XXXXX.

 

As you must realise this agreement does not conform to sections 60(1) and 61(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 and would therefore only be enforceable by a court under s65. However, the absence of any (prescribed terms / signature icon) means that a court would be prevented from enforcing it under s127(3).

 

I am granting to you a further 21 days to produce a copy of an executable agreement. After that I will consider that the above account is closed and that you will no longer pursue the alleged debt.

 

After this period you should close the file and cease processing an personal data icon relating to me on this matter.

 

Yours faithfully

[Bigdebtor]

R

 

I would check out (in appropriate threads) whether you should also now mention CPUTR 2008. This tends to scare them sh*tless!

 

See PriortyOne's posts for more info on this and a form of words.

 

BD

[rankore]

I am looking at sending the account in dispute after not sending a legible signature template letter in the downloads section. The other 3 i'll send the letter that stats as you have not sent anything back the account is now in dispute.

 

I think they both mention the CPUTR 2008 but don't go into as much detail as the one one page 5 on this thread (which a few people have said is crap anyway).

 

Although after I have sent these letters I would like to ask for a f&f and wondered if anyone has a good template letter for this?

[minmoo]

Hi rankore, sounds like you are going to have a battle on your hands much like most of us. You might do well to start a thread for each of your creditors so you can get personalised advise. As soon as you start getting letters back it could get complicated posting them on this thread.

[stifle]

Reading over this thread; don't forget that any payment, even a pound, resets the six-year clock before the account is statute-barred.

[means2anend]

Consumer credit Agreements regs 1983 allows a copy to be sent without a signature or a copy of a signature.So in these circumstances they very well can 'mask' what what they have not got.However the CPUTR 2008 'flushes' them out..I think a word used by BD

 

rgds

m2ae

[Bigdebtor]

I seem to have mentioned both "flush" and "sh*tless" recently on this thread. Doesn't the latter rule out the need for the former?

 

I recollect a water saving rhyme I heard somewhere :

 

"If it's yellow, let it mellow....

If it's brown, flush it down".

 

That's my bit for saving the Planet done for today!

 

BD

[minmoo]

This thread is going 'right down the pan' lol (poor attempt at a joke, sorry)

 

m2ae; you say flush them out but i think they are honestly just ignoring me and will sell me on at the earliest opportunity. Shame as i was looking forward to a reply.

 

Hope everyone is good

[Bigdebtor]

Minmoo

 

Don't worry. If they do sell you on then DCA's are actually easier (if more unpleasant) to deal with - and the more often your account is moved on, the greater the chance of these low lives mucking (back on this track again!) it up and making the debt unenforceable.

 

BD

[tam65]

my point exactly BD

MBNA are a big fat greedy company with deeeep pockets when it comes to litigation, whereas a DCA cannot reconstruct a CCA, faulty DN defences become possible and CUPTR could also provide additional defences, when the alleged debt gets sold on.

still working on developing a bulletproof strategy.

Tam65

[minmoo]

I think a lot of the time these days though, the debt is only assigned as opposed to sold. So the dca will generally refer back to their 'client' if it seems the paperwork might not be cast iron. Possibly over the last couple lof years things have changed and a dca isnt quite so willing to buy just any old debt.

[tam65]

minmoo

who was your CC originally taken out with?

Tam65

[minmoo]

Hi Tam, would you mind if i didnt say it publicly on the forum just yet? My paranoia forbids me lol. (Happy to pm you though).

 

Anyway, had a letter this morning saying that they were going to halt default charges to give me a chance to catch up with arrears. Not the exact wording but i was in a rush for work so will read tonight. Seems a bit odd though. Cant remember if it was for one month or two either.

 

Also, the wife shocked me by bringing out a dusty old folder. In it was a welcome pack from the original card company. All the PPI paper work, keyfobs, stickers, a few statements etc. But no copy of agreement or application. I find that odd because she has clearly kept everything together so how that would be missing would point to the fact i never had it. Wasnt something similar mentioned in the Harrison case last week and the balance of probabilities mentioned? There was though a booklet for terms and conditions although it said 'general terms and conditions' and didnt have anything to link me to it.

 

Now about the PPI. I remember i was paying it for a couple of years but didnt realise and so cancelled it when the better half pointed it out. But in the welcome pack it says thank you for choosing PPI although the forms i was supposed to send back are still there, unsigned. One for me and one to post. Some of the statements clearly show i was paying it also. Does that seem right? I just dont remember choosing it.

[Bigdebtor]

Min

 

That all sounds VERY promising. How about telling them you have been going through old records and have this letter thanking you for accepting PPI - which you didn't want ad clearly you didn't apply for or accept as you have BOTH copies of the PPI acceptance form - and therefore you want a full refund of ALL PPI payments plus ALL associated contractual interest at THEIR rates refunded PDQ.

 

Not sure if it's worth saying you have kept everything ever sent - and no copy of any agreement or specific T&C's received - might get them to drop everything base don the recent Harrison case?

 

BD

[victoria_siempre]

Hi minmoo

 

I got the same about 1 month ago; default charges only waived for 6 months, how generous.

 

But.... today acceptance of token with all interest and charges frozen; it appears to be computer generated so maybe a shift in stance?

 

x

 

v

[minmoo]

Thats good news Vic

 

No mention of interest freezes for me though.

[victoria_siempre]

Hi minmoo

 

I ignored them but set up a SO for the token anyway; wait and see, the computer may be dealing with folk in reverse alphabetical order.

 

x

 

v

[tam65]

Minmoo

I get the paranoia thing immediately, you are not wrong, they are watching and can probably identify both you and me, if they wanted to, with reasonable certainty. The same goes for almost everyone who has a thread. Don’t worry about it, they know all about CAG, CAG even gets plenty of mentions on The Credit Today discussion boards. While we are on the subject, they even try to infiltrate CAG with threads like “I used to work at MBNA by Joe Blow” and another one purporting to be from an ex-manager (can’t remember the name) but who showed remarkably good in depth knowledge of BofAmerica current policy and customer care guidelines. I spotted his/her subterfuge immediately by the use of the term “Grunt” in reference to the frontline call centre “specialists” who only have the authority to say no, no interest rate reduction, no payment plan, no help whatsoever. I used to work in a call centre, for about a year 4 years ago, I was frontline staff. Using the word grunt to refer to a person is exactly the same as using a racial, religious or ethnic epithet, or referring to a person by reference to their disability. It is not nice and not clever and speaks volumes about the person using it.

To get to the point, mine was an Abbey CC, from the late 90’s, I read in MBNA Successes a thread called “MBNA write off 10.8k” that MBNA cannot produce a CCA from before 2001when they took over the abbey business. Another thread from way back tells a similar story, sorry forgot that one. But this is not the real point.

This almost is. Nov/dec 2010 Set about dealing with things, got nowhere with the call centre, got determined, sent in I&E, discovered CAG, sent in CCA request, tried to cancel the DDebit over telephone banking via Indian call centre but failed security questions, could not remember the last withdrawal on my Current a/c and wasn’t on tinternet so had to go to branch.

Finally, the point is, this is actually interesting. Went to branch and requested to cancel DD and set up a SO for £1 pm, this is Banco de Santander, and the counter assistant said to me, this is almost word for word.....

“you are paying a lot of interest on that card, I can transfer that into a brand new Santander CC which would be interest free for 12/13 months.”

Head down, clickety click on the keyboard, head up, 2 seconds later

“I can transfer that for you immediately with the click of a button no problem “

I politely declined, thank goodness.

Points to remember are that this is nov/dec 2010 and the balance was 7k, there was no mention of Terms and conditions or of signing a new CCAgreement, interesting but not that conclusive.

Go back to the late 90’s, I was in and out of that branch, with cheques (remember those) and complaining/ pleading to get charges refunded, I was good back in the day, hmm.

I honestly cannot remember but I am fairly confident that I did not sign a CCA in the first place, ab national, as it was then, was earning about 3 or 4 hundred bucks a pop for each CC they sold and other of the newish banks were doing the same. For a number of reasons, mostly cause I had a lot of charges,I either requested or was offered a CC over the counter without a CCA being signed. Banks gave them out like smarties. There are a few examples of this in other peoples threads also, some abbey, some other banks.

To bring it back to your thread, the flyer, the furry gonk, everything but the CCA.

[tam65]

even more to the point, after the december kicking from the OFT and the Torture Verdict last week they are trying to appear oh so nice and oh so helpful and concerned about you, poor little minmoo, of course there will be no more nasty default charges, just pay us what you can while you are in difficulty, don't fall for MBNA'S loving embrace.

I will give you 35 good reasons not to, their interest rate larceny for starters....

Tell him Vic S