Damp and Mould, Rented Flat

[James31]

Hi,

 

My sister currently rents a 1 bed ground floor purpose built flat. She moved in, in May this year. The landlord insisted on a 12 month tenancy.

 

My brother and I helped her to move in, we noticed that the flat didn't smell very nice (musty) but assumed it had been empty for a while.

 

A couple of months later, my sister noticed mould appearing in her bedroom around the bottom of the walls, skirting board, blue/green/grey in colour.

 

She went on holiday for 2 weeks and upon her return in August, found her duvet and pillows were covered in mould spots. Again, blue/green. It was during the period that we had all that heavy rain. Some of her shoes and bags had gone mouldy, and the underneath of her bedside table had a large 6 inch circle of mould. The smell in the flat was pretty unbearable. All of her clothes were damp to the touch. The main problem is in the bedroom (no mould in any other rooms at that point) but the smell eminates to the whole flat, more or less!

 

On 27th August I helped her move clothes etc, out of the flat and she came to live with me temporarily. We moved everything else out of the bedroom except her bed and bedding, into the living room.

 

After contacting the landlord, it transpired that the previous tennant had the exact same problem and had bought a dehumidifier which "solved it". Upon further inspection, some parts of the wall in the bedroom have clearly been re-plastered at some point. The landlord also said they had been meaning to install trickle vents in the windows but hadn't got around to it.

 

I suggested to the landlord that they buy a dehumidifier and add it to the flat inventory, install trickle vents in all windows, add an extractor fan to the bathroom and clean/replace the carpet in the bedroom and repaint the walls. This was all agreed.

 

The dehumidifier has been in place now for about 5 days and is filling up after approx 24hrs, meaning that my sister has to keep entering the flat to empty it (40 miles away, but luckily she works nearby - not so good at weekends). Trickle vents were installed in the bedroom and bathroom on Saturday, but not the kitchen or lounge. There isn't going to be an extractor fan installed in the bathroom; the landlord says they only push air around and won't help.

 

I'm not 100% convinced that the problem is condensation, though the landlord is. My sister has only actually been in the flat for 2 days out of the past 3 or 4 weeks, yet the smell continues to worsen and each time she visits, more of her belongings are growing mould, even now in other rooms including the lounge.

 

I've told my sister to get the housing team/enviromental round there to inspect it and that is in progress.

 

All the while though, she is paying rent for this flat and the landlord says they will not pause rent for the period, nor pay compensation for damaged property. My sister now needs to buy new wardrobes, matress, duvet, pillows, covers and has lost several bags and shoes to mould. I can even smell the horrible smell in the room she is staying in, in my house now - yet all items of her clothing have been washed!

 

After reading on the web it seems the case that condensation is more or less always the tennnants fault. I don't see how, if there are no vents to open, etc, you can only work with what you've got to hand. Also, it doesn't add up that the problem continues to worsen at the flat when it is empty and has been for 3 to 4 weeks now.

 

I think she should move out, but I think she'll have a fight on her hands with the landlord if she tries. The deposit is protected with the government scheme, I've checked that.

 

The current situation is that the landlord is going to replace the carpet in the bedroom with laminate (as per the rest of the flat) and repaint the bedroom walls with mould resistant paint. They say this will be done in the next 2 to 3 weeks. My sister continues to live with me. Obviously this situation isn't ideal, what would be idea is for her to get out of there, get her deposit back and get somewhere else to live asap.

 

Any advice/help appreciated.

 

James

[MrShed]

If it is not condensation, what is your suspicion that it is?

 

Rising damp or penetrative damp would be very obvious - i.e. rising up the wall, or localised to one specific area.

 

The landlord is talking rubbish on the extractor fan though. Decades of building regulations disagree with him on this.

[James31]

Hmmm, I can't be sure if it's condensation or not. I agree it should be obvious and in one area. The affected areas don't feel wet, they just feel cold. However, I read that condensation based mould is usually black - which this isn't.

 

The flat has external walls front and back. I thought it might be possible that water is rising or penetrating the back wall around the area of the bedroom. Seems odd to me that the bathroom has no sign of mould, nor the kitchen, hallway or lounge; only the bedroom.

[MrShed]

What age of property is it? Are there any obvious faults in any downspouts outside?

 

Is it right around the skirting board, and quite low down?

[James31]

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I've attached some photos (a corner, a pillow, a run of skirting and underneath a bedside table). Actually these make it look black in places. There aren't any shots showing the length of the skirting, unfortunately.

 

I haven't had the chance to check outside just yet, it's been dark when I've been there personally. It appears to be fairly new, probably late 80's/early 90's.

 

The main concentration is low down, pretty much along the length of the skirting on the external facing wall and a couple of inches above it. The bedroom bottom corners of that wall have a higher concentration.

 

Apart from this, there's been a nasty sewage smell for months which the landlord has been promising to sort out but han't yet. It comes from the plug holes in the sink and bath. Probably unconnected.

Edited September 6, 2010 by James31

[James31]

Additional image... these sandals were moved from the bedroom to the lounge and ok on 27th Aug. She says she won't be wearing them again

 

[MrShed]

First set of attachments arent working unfortunately!

[James31]

[MrShed]

OK now I'm not a builder (far from it) but that looks very much like condensation to me.

 

Is the property centrally heated, and has it been on regularly ? (obviously not the last few months ) If so is there a radiator in the room in question?

 

Do the windows open?

[James31]

Yes to all... as you say, it's been warm enough to not have heating on, although since she moved out I made of point of setting it to come on if the temp goes below 15c. (Probably hasn't hit that temp though).

 

The windows open outwards at the top.

 

Something that bothers me is that these trickle vents were installed on Saturday, the dehumidifier has been in place since Thursday, but my sister tells me that the flat was even more smelly this morning than it was on Saturday. Perhaps it gets worse before it gets better. It stinks, I wouldn't want to live there.

[MrShed]

Just as a point of note, as the dew point (and therefore condensation point) is 16 degrees, I would set the thermostat at at least that

 

Trickle vents in my experience are an utter waste of time.

 

This is a really difficult one. As long as the property is built to regulations (which there is no reason to think it isnt), AND it is condensation related (again, in my opinion ONLY it is), then any case for rent refund or similar is likely to be extremely difficult.

 

At this stage I would be inclined to remove ALL of the mould, bleach the area, paint with mould resistant paint, then leave the doors and windows to the room open as long as possible, and see if it returns.

[James31]

What about the sewage smell from the bath and sink? She has been asking for something to be done about that for 4 months now but gets nothing but wool and excuses.

 

I think she should just try and get out of that flat. The landlord installed trickle vents in the bathroom but not the kitchen, won't install an extractor fan... and the dehumidifier collected 3 litres of water in 8 hours last night. Given nobody has lived there for 4 weeks really, does that amount of vapour sound normal? (It rained heavily last night, too).

[MrShed]

I forgot about the sewerage smell actually.

 

Its possible that this could be the cause....it sounds like a leaking drain. Should be looked at post haste. I would write to the landlord advising that you are giving them 7 days to resolve that particular issue.

[James31]

Just this second had an e-mail forwarded from the landlord via my sister. She says:

 

> The dehumidifier will need to be emptied everyday if the flat is not

> ventilated any other way it is only removing the moisture produced by

> living in it in a larger or drafty house it would disperse or if the

> windows were open I guess. All the time it is on the ground floor and

> people are out and windows are shut I guess it will be needed. You just

> need to use as much as you need it as each persons way of living is

> different. One old tenant swore by it but our other 2 tenants have not

> needed it.

>

> I have asked management company to chase up drains people but action is

> not going to be overnight as it is major work I would envisage this

> commencing within a month to 6 weeks and I will keep chasing and keep

> you informed. The smell may be worse as you are not there so it is not

> being dispersed and the flat no doubt smells stale. This is the same re

> the damp smell till the carpet goes and the flat is used and lived in

> the smell will not go as there is nothing to counter act it.

>

> The contractor re floor has said it should be no later than end of next

> week as I said before but it really will not be a problem for you to be

> resident so do not delay a return as it would help the above.

>

> The management company checked for damp recently and it was

> condensation and I think from my viewing with my builder on Thursday

> with a damp meter that it is just that however I have asked the

> management company to review the overhanging trees and gutters which

> make the external walls damp and although this does not penetrate as

> there is a damp proof course it does make walls colder which does not

> help with your condensation issue.

>

> As I have said I will do my best and I have gone above and beyond many

> landlords already would but if it is not good enough let me know next

> weekend once hopefully all items are remedied with except of drains

> which are an external issue and I am relying on the management company.

[James31]

Regarding the drains, the landlord was alerted to the smell at the very start of the tennancy. Throughout, they have blamed a slow response from the management company for the building.

 

I'm trying to get my sister out and keep her deposit in tact, perhaps get her rent returned for this month (which she has just paid). Do you know if the landlords responsibilities end where the building's management company begins?

 

(I'm looking at section 11 of Landlord & Tennants Act 1985)

[MrShed]

The landlord is responsible for the entirety - in terms of obligations to you.

 

The management company is not the tenants concern.

[James31]

Thank you MrShed, you've been a really great help.

 

If I could trouble you with one more request, I'm having trouble trying to ascertain at which point the breech of contract (insofar as the landlord has not rectified the drainage issue despite 4 months of asking) occured with regards claiming back any rent paid + deposit.

 

Common sense tells me that the period ought to be from the point my sister vacated (28th Aug), that resulting in a partial period of 11 days plus a full period of 1 month paid on 6th Sep.

 

Thanks again.

[MrShed]

I think you are perhaps a bit confused.

 

Breach of contract does not equal termination of contract, so in many respects the "date of breach" is irrelevant.

[James31]

Does that mean then that she should only ask for any future rent that has already been paid to be refunded, or can it be backdated to some point in time?

[MrShed]

It means that there is not neccessarily a basis for any rental refund at all.

 

The refund would be in the form of compensation for not having full use of the property, in terms of a percentage of rent whilst the issue has been ongoing, NOT the entirety of the rent either past or present.

 

This would have to be negotiated with the landlord.

[James31]

My sister asked for the tenancy to be terminated on the basis that the landlord has failed in their duty to perform repairs in a reasonable timeframe (the sewage smell, which the landlord says is down to "major works" that need to be done to repair a part of the drainage system).

 

The landlord has refused to an early surrender of the tenancy. Environmental Health are visiting the property on Tuesday 14th. The landlord has decided that this is now the day they are sending somebody in to replace the flooring and re-paint the walls. I have asked for this to be postponed.

 

They said: "I understand if you want to move but I am unable to agree to a rebate or unconditional surrender. If you want to give notice I will agree for you to surrender the tenancy once a new tenant is found which will not take long I would expect a month - 6 weeks subject to terms or you can continue with your enviromental health inspection which is not going to show any matters of health concern."

 

The dehumidifier has now been running 24/7 for 8 days and collected 36 litres of water, even though the property is vacant and has been for 5 weeks!