County Court Claim form received - Cabot ***WON***

[Brassed off]

Hello Bo just pm'd you. Should have checked the thread first! LOL! Sounds like things are progressing OK.

 

Thanks Rhia. I PM'd you a while back but you had exceeded your PM quota - wish I was that popular !! Now where's that really good laughing smilie gone???? lol

 

I love that smiley! .... Sums me up most of the time.... lol!!

 

That other one you use is good as well.... I was doing that about my new boss until I found he was MARRIED!!

 

Lol!!

 

I found that by accident P1 rofl!

 

Noooo

 

Oh well, wasn't meant to be then

 

Yeah I like that smilie too - they're growing on me but I really miss the eekk smilie

[Brassed off]

Sorry for the late posting on this - major laptop issues at the moment and a megga bad week which I could do without but hey ho

 

Down to the serious stuff now. AQ is an N149 (SCT)

 

Answers so far:-

 

A - No

B - No

C - Yes

D - 0 (none)

E - No

F - I can fill the dates in on that no problem

G - I'll have to come back to that one!

H - No - that doesn't apply to me only the Claimant

I - No problems with that

 

If someone could check my answers, that would be great.

 

I need to do some work for section G - will get reading up on that, already have a few threads I can read through including pt's sticky which I have somewhere

[Brassed off]

Btw, not had Cabot/Morgans AQ yet - should be interesting though

[Brassed off]

OK, I'm struggling with section G

 

I want them to provide the NOA, T&Cs (no T&Cs, no agreement, no case) and DN together with evidence that it has been properly served but these are not stated on their POCs and in my Defence, I have said that their POCs are not fully particularised and have asked for a strike out under CPR 3.4.2 (a)

 

Help, I'm stuck!

 

The AQ has to be in for Friday and I haven't received a reply to my Part 18 request.

[Rhia]

I'm not the best person on procedure so someone may over-rule me (and happy to let them do so) but I would use section G on the AQ to state that you haven't had any of this information; that you have sent a Part 18 request which has yet to be responded to (but they may do that before Friday, as if) and state that you are unable to present a full defence - the actual word is you are embarrassed - until you receive this documentation from Cabot.

[Hadituptohere]

Btw, not had Cabot/Morgans AQ yet - should be interesting though

 

 

Hi BO

 

In my case with morgans, I called the Court and enquired whether they had received cabots AQ, they informed me they had, I wrote to the court asking for a copy as id sent cabot a copy of mine and felt not having their copy left me at a disavantage.

 

might help

 

Hadituptohere

[Brassed off]

Thanks Rhia - that sounds good to. I'll wait and see if anyone else wants to comment too.

 

Good thinking Hadit - I'll ring the court today and let you know.

[Hadituptohere]

Hey Rhia

 

full inbox for pm's.......

[Brassed off]

Rang the court today and they haven't had the AQ from Morgans yet.

 

Hey Rhia

 

full inbox for pm's.......

 

What it's like to be popular.........

[cymruambyth]

Hi BO does this help?

 

In the County Court

Claim number

 

Between

 

- Claimant

 

and

 

 

- Defendant

 

 

 

Draft Order for Directions

The Claimant shall within 14 days of service of this order file and serve the following:

 

1. Copy of the Terms & Conditions applicable to the alleged credit agreement at the time it was signed and referred to by the Claimant in their amended Particulars of Claim dated 17 December2009

 

2. Copy of the Default Notice dated with proof of posting as referred to by the Claimant in the amended Particulars of Claim. This should be compliant with s87 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) as amended.

 

3. Copies of documents, contracts or deed of assignment applicable to the assignment of this account from xx to xx and from xx to xx.

 

4. Redacted copies of any debt sale agreements proving that the above financial transactions have occurred and the date upon which they occurred. In the event that these cannot be produced other than directly to the Court, a sworn statement to the effect that Capital One have been paid in full for the purchase of this debt by the Claimant and thus have no further fiduciary interest in the account in the event of enforcement by the Claimant.

 

5. Notice of Assignments, with proof of service of the same compliant with s196 of the Law of Property Act 1925 for both the above assignments.

 

6. Copies of any statements or other documents relied upon by the Claimant.

 

7. Where the Claimant seeks to rely on copies in court rather than originals of any of the above documents or those referred to in the Particulars of Claim, the Claimant must produce a copy of the Notice of Proposal to Adduce Hearsay Evidence required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 together with proof of the authenticity of the document(s) as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including but not limited to:

 

(i) a copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

(ii) a copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original document(s)

(iii) copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

(iv) copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedure(s) and audit process(es) comply with the appropriate quality standards.

 

If the Claimant fails to comply with this order, the claim will be struck out without further order.

 

The Defendant shall within 14 days thereafter file and serve the following:

 

An amended defence in response to the documents supplied by the Claimant.

[cymruambyth]

And this

 

In the County Court

Claim number

 

 

Between

 

- Claimant

 

and

 

 

- Defendant

 

 

Box G

 

If the court is in agreement, the Defendant respectfully requests that special directions may be given as per the attached draft order.

 

The Defendant proposes these directions in mind of the Overriding Objectives, and in particular the duty of the parties to help the court further them. The issues outlined below are the crux upon which this claim rests, and the proposed directions identify these issues and will allow them to be assessed in advance of the hearing so that this claim may proceed justly and expeditiously;

 

Without production of the requested documents, I am at a disadvantage in formulating a comprehensive defence. I admit that a debt is owed by myself to a Creditor but dispute that the Claimant is lawfully entitled to assume status as this Creditor or enter into litigation in their own right to seek enforcement on this account.

 

The Defendant has requested the information referred to in the attached draft directions from the Claimant on several occasions under CPR31.14 and CPR 31.16 but to date this information has not been forthcoming. The Defendant therefore seeks the court order its production.

 

It is respectfully requested this case be allocated to the small claims track. It is a straight forward case and is easily resolved on production of the required documentation by the claimant.

 

A copy of this allocation questionnaire and its attachments were sent to the claimant on.

[Rhia]

Sorry about full post box guys. Cleared it now. Didn't think it was full but forgot the sent items.

 

Cymru this is excellent. I would also add and Part 18 in para 4 after the Part 31 references. There is also the little matter of a full Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act 1998 which they still haven't complied with either.

Edited September 20, 2010 by Rhia
Add info

[PriorityOne]

 

The Defendant proposes these directions in mind of the Overriding Objectives, and in particular the duty of the parties to help the court further them. The issues outlined below are the crux upon which this claim rests, and the proposed directions identify these issues and will allow them to be assessed in advance of the hearing so that this claim may proceed justly and expeditiously;

 

Without production of the requested documents, I am at a disadvantage in formulating a comprehensive defence. I admit that a debt is owed by myself to a Creditor but dispute that the Claimant is lawfully entitled to assume status as this Creditor or enter into litigation in their own right to seek enforcement on this account.

 

The Defendant has requested the information referred to in the attached draft directions from the Claimant on several occasions under CPR31.14 and CPR 31.16 but to date this information has not been forthcoming. The Defendant therefore seeks the court order its production. The Claimant has also failed to produce requested documentation under a Subject Access Request (Data Protection Act 1998). the Defendant therefore also seeks the court to order its production.

 

It is respectfully requested this case be allocated to the small claims track. It is a straight forward case and is easily resolved on production of the required documentation by the claimant.

 

A copy of this allocation questionnaire and its attachments were sent to the claimant on.[/font][/color]

 

I'm not sure about the keeping the part highlighted in orange.... and think the part in blue may be a useful addition.

 

Just an opinion though...

[Brassed off]

Thanks for the help - I really appreciate it.

 

I'm with you on the "orange" bit P1 !

[cymruambyth]

Thanks for the help - I really appreciate it.

 

I'm with you on the "orange" bit P1 !

 

Now I'm a bit jittery, even though the logic made sense at the time:???:

[pt2537]

Hi BO does this help?

 

In the County Court

Claim number

 

Between

 

- Claimant

 

and

 

 

- Defendant

 

 

 

Draft Order for Directions

The Claimant shall within 14 days of service of this order file and serve the following:

 

1. Copy of the Terms & Conditions applicable to the alleged credit agreement at the time it was signed and referred to by the Claimant in their amended Particulars of Claim dated 17 December2009

 

2. Copy of the Default Notice dated with proof of posting as referred to by the Claimant in the amended Particulars of Claim. This should be compliant with s87 (1) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) as amended.

 

3. Copies of documents, contracts or deed of assignment applicable to the assignment of this account from xx to xx and from xx to xx.

 

4. Redacted copies of any debt sale agreements proving that the above financial transactions have occurred and the date upon which they occurred. In the event that these cannot be produced other than directly to the Court, a sworn statement to the effect that Capital One have been paid in full for the purchase of this debt by the Claimant and thus have no further fiduciary interest in the account in the event of enforcement by the Claimant.

 

5. Notice of Assignments, with proof of service of the same compliant with s196 of the Law of Property Act 1925 for both the above assignments.

 

6. Copies of any statements or other documents relied upon by the Claimant.

 

7. Where the Claimant seeks to rely on copies in court rather than originals of any of the above documents or those referred to in the Particulars of Claim, the Claimant must produce a copy of the Notice of Proposal to Adduce Hearsay Evidence required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 together with proof of the authenticity of the document(s) as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including but not limited to:

 

(i) a copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

(ii) a copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original document(s)

(iii) copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

(iv) copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedure(s) and audit process(es) comply with the appropriate quality standards.

 

If the Claimant fails to comply with this order, the claim will be struck out without further order.

 

The Defendant shall within 14 days thereafter file and serve the following:

 

An amended defence in response to the documents supplied by the Claimant.

alleged agreement? oh come-on, the only thing that will do is annoy the hell outta the judge,

 

Its an agreement, the question is whether or not its enforceable

 

you will just give the impression of DEBT avoider if you use such words

[cymruambyth]

pt

 

It's a shame that you weren't around a few months ago to give such an belittling reply when I was seeking guidance.

[pt2537]

wasnt meant to be belittling, but you really do need to look at these things properly, the courts have taken a hard line, we all know that, so, you need to show that the issue isnt you just trying to avoid your debt, but you are challenging the enforceability of the agreement.

 

Allegations that it is an alleged agreement will drop you in hot water with the judge,

[cymruambyth]

Hi Bo, this is my version of War and Peace, Cabot style; still a work in progress:madgrin:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?153641-From-Monument-to.......Cabot

[Brassed off]

 

Allegations that it is an alleged agreement will drop you in hot water with the judge,

 

I won't be putting alleged in the AQ pt but thanks

 

Hi Bo, this is my version of War and Peace, Cabot style; still a work in progress:madgrin:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?153641-From-Monument-to.......Cabot

 

I will get round to reading it at some point Cymru - thanks

 

OK, still no reply to Part 18 and I know they have it as I sent it recorded and have POD.

 

Still no SAR on CD from Cabot either.

 

I know exactly what I'm going to put on the AQ now thanks everyone. Will pop it into the court tomorrow.

[gh2008]

the courts have taken a hard line, we all know that.....

 

and they get harder by the day - a DN is deemed served the day it was sent by the creditor?? Interpretation Act doesn't apply to CCA cases......

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?238913-Me-v-Tesco-Incasso&p=3137640&viewfull=1#post3137640

Summary Judgement for the claimant - not good

[Brassed off]

OK a little late posting this - apologies. Major issues with new scanner and Photobucket - don't ask.......

 

Response to my Part 18 to Morgans attached (hopefully) - all comments welcome!

 

I've also received a copy of Morgans AQ response back which I'll post up shortly!

Response to Part 18 from Morgans 23 09 10.pdf

[Brassed off]

Think I'll save their AQ response for the weekend - it will give everyone time to check out the above - especially their response to No 6

[Hadituptohere]

Hi Brassed off

 

Looks like cabot are making their own type of assignment, I was under the impression there was only absolute or equitable but whats this legal assignment??? maybe some more experienced will comment.

 

Nice to see that they are relying on a Credit Agreement, that wouldnt be an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974 would it morgans???

 

Hadituptohere

[gh2008]

Ok, so they are saying that the account is live AND more importantly they are the creditor.

 

How long has it been since you have received any form of statement on this account?

 

Have you *ever* received a proper statement of account from Cabot?

 

Check out S86(a-c) and S86(d) I think for the sanctions.

 

The credit agreement is now between you & Cabot - and you need to see a copy of that agreement - with THEM as the creditor NOT Hitachi

 

oh legal assignment = absolute