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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Gross Misconduct investigation


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Hi

I have received a Gross Misconduct letter about 3 separate incidents which were supposedly alleged in September 2009. Three staff members in total were given these letters all on separate issues. No investigation has happened, and I have not been given the chance to explain and I have also tried to give HR evidence. HR have informed me last month (May 2010) that due to organisation difficulties no investigation will happen. However, HR have stated they will be perusing a personal development policy. This assumes I am guilty of the allegation, and will involve extra training and will be marked on my personal record. I have suggested that this is not in my best interest. The other two staff members have taken up this ‘offer’. HR have stated that they will peruse the gross misconduct investigation with myself.

1) Can HR re open gross misconduct investigation ?

2) if others have been treated differently I.e. taken the route of personnel development does this mean discrimination?

3) 7 months since letter arrived 9 months since allegation.

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Hi there and welcome. I was just about to sign off when I saw your post.

 

This does sound an odd way of going about the procedures, but I couldn't quote you chapter and verse.

 

Unless other caggers turn up, and it is Saturday night, can I suggest some bedtime reading, if you want to do your own research?

 

Try the directgov website about disciplinary procedures, or the ACAS one. ACAS also have a webstie you could look at, and also a confidential helpline you could ring from Tuesday.

 

I don't claim to be an expert, but the time lag thing you mention sounds odd. Hopefully this will be covered online, unless another cagger turns up with an answer.

 

Have you seen the disciplinary procedure of your company, and have they followed it?

 

HB

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Hi,

Thanks for reply. I will phone ACAS monday*. I work in NHS and I do not think they are following correct policy. Its very hard to get any reply from HR. But hope fellow caggers will be able to help

Thanks

Edited by northwalesman
Tuesday*
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Hi,

I would like to add I have sent HR and Management a letter which included: "HR and management have initially stated they will be investigating the cases under ‘gross misconduct’ and have applied 'sanctions' that are likely to have an effect on ‘my’ current and future employment prospects, a statutory framework will be necessary. There will also need to be guarantees of the independence and objectivity of the affiliates and a robust means of ensuring consistency in their performance and decision-making.

I would like to state that I have no confidence in the proposed procedure “step down” ‘personal development policy’ which I believe is likely to lead to unfair and inconsistent decisions which will not inspire confidence in the suggested procedure by HR and NHS Managers".

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I feel that HR (is actually one person) who is looking at my case is digging her heels as its taken her so long to do anything. My evidence supporting myself is strong but they are refusing to look at it and seem to want to go down the gross misconduct route, really stressed at work as this is looming over me daily.

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Hi there.

 

I know nothing about NHS rules, but they must be standardised throught the NHS, I would guess?

 

Did you know CAG has an NHS forum? There are some nice people on that. You could give them a brief outline of your problem and post a link to here, if anyone wants to have a look. Don't copy and paste what you've put here, make this your only thread about your employment problem, or you and I will have the site federales after us. :)

 

I hope that makes sense when you read it.

 

HB x

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Hi

I have received a Gross Misconduct letter about 3 separate incidents which were supposedly alleged in September 2009. Three staff members in total were given these letters all on separate issues. No investigation has happened, and I have not been given the chance to explain and I have also tried to give HR evidence. HR have informed me last month (May 2010) that due to organisation difficulties no investigation will happen. However, HR have stated they will be perusing a personal development policy. This assumes I am guilty of the allegation, and will involve extra training and will be marked on my personal record. I have suggested that this is not in my best interest. The other two staff members have taken up this ‘offer’. HR have stated that they will peruse the gross misconduct investigation with myself.

1) Can HR re open gross misconduct investigation ?

2) if others have been treated differently I.e. taken the route of personnel development does this mean discrimination?

3) 7 months since letter arrived 9 months since allegation.

 

(a) When did the incidents happened?

(b) Did the three incident you refer to happened in September 2009?

 

In cases of gross misconduct, the employer should have acted reasonably speedily in taking disciplinary action (inc. investigation) - if they delay without reserving their position, they may have waived the right to dismiss summarily (case law: Cook v MSHK Limited [2009] EWCA Civ 624, CA).

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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Hi,

Thanks for the speedy reply.

Yes the alleged incidents happened september 09. I went to see my line manager about two of the alleged incidets and dscused in detail.

 

I was called to see HR and a Senior manager on Novembe 09 and I was adviced to take Union rep which I did. I found out about he 3rd incident then, which had happened in September 09.

 

There has been no investigation. I think 3 people have been asked to investigate but all have pulled out. Then I got a letter stating "due to re oerganisation problems" they choose to go down the route of personal development. This in its self presumes that there is a problem wth a skill and all parties have agreed to this. but I havent and i have always said i am not gulity and i have proof.

 

I will have a look at this case law sounds interesting.

Thanks

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Hi all,

I have read the case law, and its complicated but interesting. Does it mean that if they do eventual investigate my case they are limited to proceed.

 

I would like if anybody can explain if by stopping gross misconduct investigation and going down a route of performance improvement policy and then deciding to go back to gross misconduct investigation is correct. They have decided to do this as I questioned the rational for this policy and I stated I did not have any trust in this procedure. I asked for a meeting with HR and management to discuss this process. But it seems they just want to proceed.

 

As I have stated before its (sep ‘09) 9 months since allegation on a incident form, 7 months since gross misconduct letter, 2 months since performance improvement policy was mentioned.

 

Id like to point out that the alleged incidents has happened to others but they have never been investigated. And have never been taken down the route of gross misconduct or performance improvement route. They are stating as 3 incidents were put down on an incident form within 2 weeks. I have looked at other incident forms and there are many incidents far more serious that have happened in clusters, but none have been investigated.

Thanks NWM:confused:

Edited by northwalesman
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NWM,

Do you have any correspondence stating that the gross misconduct has been halted/withdrawn - as you state above. One would have thought that if they are "investigating" an allegation of gross misconduct they would like to conclude it ASAP. After all it would be in the best interests of the employer ( negative publicity and all that). If you do have corresondence stating it has been halted , they cannot re-instate it. They CANNOT have two bites of the cherry. I would habe thought that if it was GROSS misconduct they would ensure they found someone/ time for the investigation to be completed. As for the perfoprmance side of things, the organisation are at liberty to monitor their employees and if they feel that there is room for improvement in an individuals performane they can give targets to be reached. Performance does not have to relate to discipline. Hope this helps.

 

Cheers - Scousegeezer.

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Hi thanks,

Yes i got a letter its states:

"...the matter was going to be investigated under the discliplinary policy. I can now confirm ...that the matter will now proced under performance imprpvement process..."

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Hi

Sorry for all the little bits im adding.

 

I have also 2 months ago asked for a meeting to discuss possible discrimination issues but I got an e-mail back stating that HR are not discriminating and that was it.

 

Thanks

NWM

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NWM,

It may well be that they are aware of the above case and in effect have timed themselves out. As I have stated above - they are entitled to performance manage their staff - it does not mean that it is discipline related. What is the basis of you allegation of discrimination. Have you seen your union about all this. The information supplied so far on this thread should assist him/her.

 

Cheers - Scousegeezer

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Hi,

Again thanks for information. I do have a Union member (Unison), but I feel the need to make sure I have relevant information to help myself.

 

I believe that they are discriminating against me due to the fact that there have been a lot of incident reporting were I work. I believe 40+ that are far more serious than what I have been accused of. There have been 5 that are the same as mine on one instance and neither have been investigated further than the ward manager looking at them. Like I stated there have been 40+ and neither of then have been investigated. Nobody has been placed on a performance improvement policy exept for the two people i mentioned before and they ar not included in the 40+.

 

This policy is in itself disciplined related as there has to be a shortfall in your working practice and you have to be monitored for 12 months and can be re implemented at any stage in that 12 months and continued again or indeed suspended from work of be placed on gross misconduct.

 

As others in my working environment have been seen to make errors and have not been placed on any sort of gross misconduct or performance improvement, I was queering if this does mean discrimination. Again as the gross misconduct seems to have been stopped and they have tried to place me on performance enhancement, suggesting I am guilty without evidence been looked at.

 

Thanks again

NWM

Edited by northwalesman
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Hi

So it seems that HR are limited to proceed with gross misconduct.

 

However, do I have a case for discrimination or grievance in the way I have been treated, or for them swapping from GM to personal development policy which presumes I am guilty.

 

Thanks

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Hi,

I feel that the HR and Management have treated me in an awful way for the last few months. I am constantly stressed and thinking of the situation all the time.

 

I am thinking if I have a case against them, I just feel that they can not be allowed to proceed in this manner. I am amazed how many people thought this site are being discriminated bullied and harassed . This must be a tip of the iceberg as I did stumble across this site. I am glad I did. I know most if not all my colleagues would probably accept HR and managements decisions.

 

I feel if I allow them to ‘get away’ with treating me in this manner it will become normal practice and acceptable in my working environment. Therefore, making others to have go through this process.

:)

Thanks NWM

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Hi thanks,

Yes i got a letter its states:

"...the matter was going to be investigated under the discliplinary policy. I can now confirm ...that the matter will now proced under performance imprpvement process..."

 

Hi,

 

I wonder if the action(s) resulting from a 'performance improvement process' is/are the same as in a disciplinary process, in your case?

 

I wonder if your employer has not being too 'clever' to change the denomination of his intended action in order to mask the real intentions...

 

You should be extremely careful about the process your employer intends to apply and, most important, what would be the outcome...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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Hi,

I phoned ACAS and they state that I should have had the opportunity to appeal the initial Gross Misconduct, which I did not know about or indeed have the opportunity to do. They also confirm that the length of time it has taken is /will not be seen as good practice as it goes against the ACAS code.

 

They ACAS state that I could write a grievance letter to hold a meeting on my terms to ask them question.

 

Any ideas or terminology case law that I could use or take with me in support.

Tanks NWM

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I seen these points on Internet and I thought that the HR did not follow therefore, I thought they might be the questions I could ask why they did not follow if I was to hold a grievance meeting?

 

…the elements of a fair disciplinary process are not overly complex or technical (Ten things managers need to know about...misconduct disciplinary situations) .

 

A disciplinary process can broadly be broken down into the following elements:

 

carrying out a thorough investigation to establish the facts

 

informing the employee of the evidence and the basis of the case against them.

 

holding a meeting with the employee to allow them to answer the allegation

 

deciding the facts, whether the allegation is made out and if so the appropriate sanction

 

dealing with any appeal against the decision

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Hi,

 

You digged out the right information about disciplinary procedure... well done...

 

Now, you should write (letter/e-mail) to your HR department and request that they clarify what they understand by 'performance improvement process' and what it encompasses... and most important... does that process activate any type of award?

 

You do not want them to call that process anything else but a disciplinary action if it does trigger an award...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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Hi

Thanks for the reply.

 

What does activate type of award mean? what should I look out for?

 

Do I need to ask them to clarify what they understand by 'performance improvement process' before I ask for grievence letter or is that the same thing.

 

Thanks

 

NWM

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In your letter, just state that you acknowledge their intention to initiate a 'performance improvement process', but that you need information related to such a process as you do not know what it encompasses...

 

If the outcome of such a process is to formally warn you about your capabilities or performance, then it would certainly be construed as a disciplinary hearing. Something you want to avoid as they waved their right(s) by waiting such a long time before taking any corrective action.

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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Hi,

I do think the 'performance improvement process' will be about capabilities and performance. Howerver I will write to them via my union rep and ask them about it.

 

I have suggested before to HR that I do not agree or think it fair to use this policy with me, as it suggets I am guilty without any investigation. I have also stated that as far as im aware nobody has ever questioned my performance.

 

The more I reed and advice I get, it seems as if HR is not following any type of policy, or have got it totally wrong. They have caused me so much worry and stress over this matter. But i am learning about employment issues, and I can pass this on to fellow peers.

 

Thanks

 

NWM

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Basically and to simplify...

 

If at the end of that process they award you with say, a written warning, then such a process would be construed as bent as your employer would have used a 'fabricated' route to penalise you... as they could not discipline you over your first offence alledgedly committed in September 2009 (or October 2009).

 

You must find out what the process encompasses and how they will aplly it.

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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