Is This A Valid CCA? They Say Yes - I Say No

[slick132]

Hi LTD,

 

The letters from HL Legal Sol'rs is probably a standard letter as Debt Star suggests. Their suggestion of court action may be serious, or may just be a standard idle threat.

 

In any event, I thought you were about to start proceedings against the bank for charges.

[slick132]

And you can ignore the so-called solicitors, in my opinion.

[letsdothis]

Hi LTD,

 

The letters from HL Legal Sol'rs is probably a standard letter as Debt Star suggests. Their suggestion of court action may be serious, or may just be a standard idle threat.

 

Hi Slick

 

Yes I realise it is probably a standard threat-o-gram, I just don't want to fall foul of anything that could jeopadise the way things go from here.

 

In any event, I thought you were about to start proceedings against the bank for charges.

 

Yes - As soon as the dealine passes from the LBA I am going to proceed that way.

 

I know I shouldn't have done, but I have spoken to CapQuest by phone and told them to stop pestering me, as the account is clearly in dispute. I shall again write to them tomorrow with a copy of the original dispute that I raised, just for the avoidance of any doubt and that they cannot say that I have not informed them of any dispute. The guy I spoke to has told me he will pass it back to admin to sort out the dispute, but they will have to wait until Hell freezes over, or Cap One repay what I am owed before I speak to them again.

[letsdothis]

And you can ignore the so-called solicitors, in my opinion.

 

Duly ignored, thank you for the advice.

[The Debt Star]

Hi TDS

 

The OC was Capital One, CapQuest have bought the debt off them, probably because of the age of the agreement. 2001

 

I CCA'ed CapQuest and they sent me the NOA, the front page of the agreement, which is at the beginning of this thread. But no T and C's

 

CapQuest then sent me the T and C's but these are obviously reprinted and not from the back of the agreement, as there are about 6 pages or so of them.

 

I put the account in dispute with CapQuest and they then wrote a long leter back saying that they do not believe it is in dispute, and then today I received a letter off HL Legal.

 

It does not mention anything about an admin charge.

 

 

 

I haven't actually reported CapQuest to anyone at the moment, and I have a LBA against Cap One sent last week asking for the £4.7k back that they owe me for unfair charges, late fees, and Contractual / Stat Interest. My balance of the Cap One account is said to be just less than £2000 according to CapQuest and Cap One. Therefore, I am owed more than I owe CapQuest.

 

The problem is (or that I can see) Cap One owe this to me, and any balance that I may owe to Cap One is technically owed to CapQuest as they bought the debt.

 

 

 

The agreement to me is unenforceable.

 

 

As it has none of the prescribed terms on it. As previously stated, they have sent a copy of the T and C's but these are on about 6 or 7 pages, and there is no way that they could have been within the 4 corners. I understand this was later addressed, but the date of the original agreement is 2001 so does not come into it afaik

 

The T and C's they have sent do not even correspond to the correct amount being charged for default charges, as in my statements from Cap One show £20 etc but the T and C's have a lower amount, and so could not be from the original agreement anyway.

 

Also the Agreement was sent initially, but with no T and C's and so if they were part of the original agreement, then surely they would have sent them all at the same time.

 

Not just that, its an application form not a credit agreement to my mind! That really is a shocker. Still, I would be minded to argue the toss in correspondence with HL if it was me 'cos you may just find they 'have a word' with CapQuest on the unenforceability of the document plus your counter claim.

[letsdothis]

Not just that, its an application form not a credit agreement to my mind! That really is a shocker. Still, I would be minded to argue the toss in correspondence with HL if it was me 'cos you may just find they 'have a word' with CapQuest on the unenforceability of the document plus your counter claim.

 

Thanks TDS

 

That's what's worrying me, on one hand I am claiming it is unenforceable, on the other I am asking Cap One for the fees they have charged me back. It seems a little not right if you get what I mean.

 

I am quite happy to pay CapQuest in full with the refund from Cap One, it's just do I let them know or do I hit them with it once they issue proceedings. A £4.7k counterclaim should blow any hope of them getting any money out of the water. Hopefully.

[slick132]

I say take the initiative and issue proceedings asap.

[The Debt Star]

I say take the initiative and issue proceedings asap.

 

possibly...but teh problem with that is costs. if you lose, you pay their legal fees. but then, will you? I see the point you are making but, truth be told, both yuo and CrapOne are then saying the agreement is enforceable and you want the charges refunded. Yes, I think this is the way to go and that you probably should sue them. BUT write to the 'solicitors' making your case. You could, in the interim, agree a repayment plan with CrapQuest while you CrapOne case is being pursued?

[diddydicky]

how much are you claiming?

[letsdothis]

how much are you claiming?

 

Hi Diddy

 

The amount including charges, compouded interest and then stat interest is approx £4.7k

[diddydicky]

Hi Diddy

 

The amount including charges, compouded interest and then stat interest is approx £4.7k

 

then it will be small claims and no need to worry about heavy costs from the other side- keep it below £5000 and simple

[letsdothis]

possibly...but teh problem with that is costs. if you lose, you pay their legal fees. but then, will you? I see the point you are making but, truth be told, both yuo and CrapOne are then saying the agreement is enforceable and you want the charges refunded. Yes, I think this is the way to go and that you probably should sue them. BUT write to the 'solicitors' making your case. You could, in the interim, agree a repayment plan with CrapQuest while you CrapOne case is being pursued?

 

In Small Claims I don't think I would be liable to costs?

 

I offered Cap One to settle for approx £4k if they did within 10 days of the LBA but so far not a sausage from them.

 

I do know that Cap One would offset any arrears with CapQuest before I got any money from them, of which I am happy to do, thta was what I have offered them in the reduced without prejudice offer in the LBA I sent.

[letsdothis]

then it will be small claims and no need to worry about heavy costs from the other side- keep it below £5000 and simple

 

Good, that was what I was thinking. I know the interest is going up daily, but I was going to use the original figures that I asked for in the LBA and not rework them to off set the chance of it going over the 5k mark.

[slick132]

Re Death Star's post #133 above, as long as you are confident with the spreadsheet calculations for interest, there is very little chance of losing the court claim for repayment, whether the claim is under or over £5K.

 

I suspect negotiating on this with HL Sol'rs will be a waste of time as they're only interested in getting money FROM you.

[slick132]

Re Death Star's post #133 above, as long as you are confident with the spreadsheet calculations for interest, there is very little chance of losing the court claim for repayment, whether the claim is under or over £5K.

 

I suspect negotiating on this with HL Sol'rs will be a waste of time as they're only interested in getting money FROM you.

[letsdothis]

Received the standard, it is going to take us a while to respond to your query letter this morning. I hope they don't take too long. They have about 6 days left by my reckoning before the 14 days runs out that I gave them.

[letsdothis]

Re Death Star's post #133 above, as long as you are confident with the spreadsheet calculations for interest, there is very little chance of losing the court claim for repayment, whether the claim is under or over £5K.

 

I suspect negotiating on this with HL Sol'rs will be a waste of time as they're only interested in getting money FROM you.

 

Hi Slick

 

I used the standard compound calculator, and worked it out at about 22% as that is the rate shown on my screenshots from Cap One from the SAR.

 

All worked out on a spreadsheet and then the 8% added by that.

 

The only potential issue is the over 6 year rule thingy but I had countered that in my LBA using the words that you mentioned.

 

I agree re the solicitors.

[letsdothis]

It looks like Cap One are not playing ball. The 14 days is up on Thursday, so I shall start the ball rolling re the POC's for my N1

 

Any pointers on how best to present them?

 

Also just to throw a spanner in the works for CapQuest and HL Legal I have sent them a couple of letters.

 

1) I requested under CPR everything that HL would rely on etc if they were to proceed to court

2) I sent CapQuest the 'in serious dispute letter', telling them to bog off until such time that they provide me with an agreement and not an application form, along with the prescribed terms etc

 

Let's see how they resond to that.

 

I hope that CapQuest used HL Legal for a template generic threatening letter, you know the ones for about 75p in bulk. Hopefully now HL Legal have to do some work, and will bill CapQuest accordingly.

[slick132]

Hi LDT,

 

I think asking for info from HL Legal at this stage is a waste of your time. They have no obligation to supply it until they actually start proceedings.

 

Get to work on the POC's. This is from the Cap One forum Stickies - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?117741-New-Cap-1-Poc

 

[letsdothis]

Cheers Slick

 

Will have a ganders tomorrow.

[diddydicky]

In Small Claims I don't think I would be liable to costs?

 

I offered Cap One to settle for approx £4k if they did within 10 days of the LBA but so far not a sausage from them.

 

I do know that Cap One would offset any arrears with CapQuest before I got any money from them, of which I am happy to do, thta was what I have offered them in the reduced without prejudice offer in the LBA I sent.

 

 

without prejudice i hope!

[letsdothis]

without prejudice i hope!

 

Certainly was Diddy.

[Denzyl]

I have a similar issue and the copy of the NOA interests me greatly. I have received a NOA that was supposedly from CITI. It is EXACTLY the same as yours and came in an envelope that has CapQuests POBOX on the reverse so i know it didnt come from CITI.

[Denzyl]

Can anybody help me?

 

I have fallen on hard times and now im unable to pay the full amount on my monthly load to CITI Financial. I have been sending them letter after letter since March asking if they could freeze the

interest

and accept a lower payment (just under 50% of the agreed monthly amount) until my finances recover but they have never bothered to reply. I have however had letters telling me I have had charges added to my account due to non payment.

 

Then today I have received a text message and a letter from CAPQUEST saying that CITI have sold my debt to them. Interestingly I also received a letter supposedly from CITI stating they have sold the debt to CAPQUEST. Both are dated the 24th August and arrived today on the 26th.

 

Upon reading a few posts on here I looked closer at the 2 letters and it’s now crystal clear that the letter from CITI isn’t actually real at all. The idiots at CAPQUEST have clearly just typed up the letter on a cheap piece of plain A4 paper and printed the CITI logo on the top left. I have compared this to previous correspondence from CITI and they are nothing alike.

 

I then looked at the envelope the 2 letters arrived in and as expected, CAPQUESTS envelope stated it was from their office in Fleet. However the envelope used for the “CITI” letter had a different PO Box printed on the back. Further investigation has now shown me that this PO Box belongs to CAPQUEST in Bristol so its impossible for this letter to have been sent from CITI. ********My "NOA" is in fact exactly the same as this one from Cap One. Only the logo is different********

 

I have contacted CITI to complain that they have not written back to acknowledge my request to make a lower payment and to ask if they have any record of sending me any letter stating they were selling my debt on. They have confirmed that they have not sent any letter and I am now going to send them a copy of their own letter.

 

Im thinking they should have either acknowledged my request and also wrote to inform me they are selling on my debt but as of today, I have received neither.

 

Surely this is fraud committed by CAPQUEST but I don’t know what to do next.

 

HELP PLEASE

[slick132]

Denzyl's case is being discussed elsewhere - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?274878-Capquest-Help&p=3104820&viewfull=1#post3104820