Debt agency chasing my ex partner for a debt, advice welcome

[citizenB]

One other thing.. can you try and track down a press report on the death of that little boy.. :(You should be able to google it. It would, I think help, in setting out the conditions by which your partner believed they were under obligation to enter into this agreement.

[citizenB]

I would say send in a CPR part 18 as you have no defult notice no letters or anything in relation to this debt that says they have followed to correct procedure and are allowed to add interest.

 

Hi GM:D

 

Clause 1 of the agreement allows for interest to be added to defaulted payments. However, in this instance, the default is none of the OP's making.. if the company couldnt be bothered to set up at least one of 5 bliddy standing orders.. then that is down to them IMHO.

 

I will investigate the CPR18 and draft one up if necessary.

[citizenB]

GM, if you are still around Apparently CPR18 is for requesting further information, but not documents ? Have I worded the following correctly and does it need to be sent to the solicitor or the claimant ? Thanks

 

IN THE XXXXXXXXX COUNTY COURT

CLAIM NO:

 

 

BETWEEN:

XXXXXXXXXX

Claimant

 

 

and

 

 

XXXXXXXXXXX

 

Defendant

 

 

___________________________________________________________________

 

PART 18 - REQUEST FOR FURTHER INFORMATION

____________________________________________________________

 

 

To: Yorkshire Energy Service CIC (Claimant)

 

Please answer the following questions:

 

1. The dates on which you made attempts to contact me during the 5 years between the inception of the agreement and the claim form being issued.

 

2. On what date did you issue a Default Notice and / or formal demand for payment, prior to issuing the claim form.

3. Will you be relying on documents mentioned in point 2 above.

 

 

 

TAKE NOTICE THAT YOU ARE REQUIRED TO ANSWER THE ABOVE REQUEST WITHIN 14 DAYS OF SERVICE OF THE SAME UPON YOU

 

 

Statement of Truth

 

I believe the facts stated herein are true

 

 

Signed................... ......................... ............ Claimant

 

 

Date : ........................................................................................

 

 

 

 

Edited June 28, 2010 by citizenB

[citizenB]

Ok, I have drafted the following.. I am going to ask others to pop in and cast their eye over it for you. So wait until this evening before you make a final decision. You will need to read it carefully and make sure that what I have claimed on your behalf is accurate. Any dates that need to be amended or included then make sure that is done. If there is anything you arent happy with just yell.

 

This will be sent to Incasso. I do not know whether it should be headed up "Without Prejudice" or not. Hopefully others will be able to comment.

 

 

Incasso LLP

Trafalgar House

29 Park Place

Leeds

LS1 2SP

Dear Sir or Madam

Case/ Claim Number:

Yorkshire Energy Service CIC - v Karel’s partner

On 30th April 2010, a claim was issued against me out of Northampton Bulk Processing Centre.

In the absence of information and the vagueness of your Particulars of Claim, I have been obliged to enter an embarrassed defence.

In the interests of saving both time and costs, I would direct your attention to the following.

On DATE, a representative of Kirklees Energy Services (K.E.S) , who at the time I believed to be from the Local Authority, knocked on my door. I was advised that due to the death of a local child through Carbon monoxide poisoning, the Local Authority were checking all boilers and it was deemed that mine was unsafe.

I advised I was unable to afford such an investment and was told I could have an interest free loan.

This was agreed to and I signed an agreement to this affect on 6th October 2005. At the same time a Standing Order was signed in order to facilitate payments.

It would appear that this mandate was never presented to my bank for payment by K.E.S.

On 11th April 2006, this was brought to my attention by way of a letter and I completed the mandate enclosed and returned it to K.E.S.

Several telephone calls were made to K.E.S. asking why this mandate wasn’t being presented, apologies were offered, a further mandate was completed yet it would still appear that nothing was presented to the bank.

On DATE, I moved from the address at which the boiler was installed. However, my partner continues to live there.

At no time since the last mandate was signed has there been any correspondence from K.E.S, until the claim form was issued. If my partner had not still been living at the address, then I would not have known it had been sent.

It is my understanding that in order to proceed to litigation in respect of an agreement made under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, certain statutory procedures are supposed to take place.

The issue of a Default Notice, served under Section 871(1) of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. No such statutory document has been received. Then I believe a Final Demand or Letter prior to Action should have been issued. No such letter has been received by me. My partner will confirm that no such documents/letters have been delivered. Had they been he would have forwarded them on. Should this claim continue, he will provide a Witness statement.

Furthermore, I would point out that you fail to plead that this claim concerns an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act, 1974. However, interest pursuant to section 69 of the County Courts Act, 1984 is being claimed, which you should surely know you are not entitled to by virtue of the County Courts (Interest on Judgment Debts) Order, 1991 (SI 1991 No. 1184 (L. 12)) in particular section 2(3)(a), which clearly prohibits such an award:

 

· The general rule

 

2(3) Interest shall not be payable under this Order where the relevant judgment - (a) is given in proceedings to recover money due under an agreement regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974;

In view of the above, I would be prepared to agree to repaying the loan on the original terms which were:

For the first payment of £129.00 (One Hundred & Twenty-nine Pounds) and 47 x subsequent monthly payments of £48.00 (Forty-eight Pounds) and interest free.

I see no reason why I should be penalised by interest additions where the failure to submit Standing order Mandates or communicate with me, was solely down to the poor administration of Kirklees Energy Services.

If this is offer is acceptable, then please advise me within 14 days.

Yours faithfully

Karel’s partner.

 

[The GodMother]

Hi CB and Karel.

 

I am busy today and tomorrow but will have popping in time from anow and then.

 

I will post up the CPR l use that PT posted years ago, possibly 2007/2008 ish, l dont know if the rules have changed but it might help as it lists everything they will need to provide l dont mean to be funny CB but i think yours request is to filmsey it lacks anything really.

[The GodMother]

this is the letter that PT was advising will need tweeking but for now must go and hoover.

 

Account In Dispute

 

Dear xxxx,

 

I acknowledge receipt of your notice of intended legal action sent by your company on 3rd July 2007 which was received on 6th July 2007.

Please be aware that any proceedings will be extremely vigorously defended and that a counterclaim will be made against ** DCA **. I am unable to respond further at this time, since you have given me inadequate information to investigate the claim. Please note that under the Overriding Objectives, you have a duty to act reasonably at all times.

 

As you are aware, under the pre-action protocols of the Civil Procedure Rules, your letter before action should have included the following information:

4.3 The claimant's letter should —

(a) give sufficient concise details to enable the recipient to understand and investigate the claim without extensive further information;

(b) enclose copies of the essential documents which the claimant relies on;

© ask for a prompt acknowledgement of the letter, followed by a full written response within a reasonable stated period;

(For many claims, a normal reasonable period for a full response may be one month.)

(d) state whether court proceedings will be issued if the full response is not received within the stated period;

(e) identify and ask for copies of any essential documents, not in his possession, which the claimant wishes to see;

(f) state (if this is so) that the claimant wishes to enter into mediation or another alternative method of dispute resolution; and

(g) draw attention to the court's powers to impose sanctions for failure to comply with this practice direction and, if the recipient is likely to be unrepresented, enclose a copy of this practice direction.

I note that your letter failed to enclose copies of the essential documents upon which you will seek to rely, failed to ask for acknowledgement of the letter, failed to ask for a written response within a reasonable period of time, and did not draw attention to the courts powers

to force all parties to comply with the practice direction.

I intend to provide you with a full written response, but as yet I have not got adequate information to investigate your claim.

To enable me to investigate this claim I require specific information regarding the account to be provided forthwith. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

If you fail to disclose this information, I may apply to the court under Part 18 and part 31 of the civil procedure rules.

I will be unable to respond to your claim without this information, and by failing to supply it before starting legal action you would breach the overriding objective of the Civil Procedure Rules.

 

Request for disclosure;

I request that you send me information vital to investigating your claims, including:

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

a. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to it the account.

b. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor.

c. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual

intervention in relation to my account formerly held with ** CREDITOR **.

d. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

e. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

f. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

g. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

h. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.

i. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

j. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

3. Any other documents you will seek to rely upon in court.

4. A copy of your complaints procedure, as required by the Consumer Credit Act 2006.

5. Clarification of the date you acquired the debt, what organisation you acquired it from, their registered office, their company number (if any) and what legal title they had to this debt, and what credit license number they had at the time that the debt was purchased or entered into.

 

Please note, I will respond to your claim in full within 14 days of your providing this information. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, or if you start proceedings without furnishing this information, it will be reported to the Court that you are denying me the opportunity to settle this matter amicably.

[karel]

O.k Citezan thank you very much, much appreciated.

 

I will be as honest as possible and wont bend on anything. In answer to your questions earlier.

 

Here is the press report of the story of the little boy

 

BBC NEWS | England | West Yorkshire | Boy's gas death prompts campaign

 

Ok, so no default notice, final demand, letter before action (prior to issuing the claim form).

 

They sent nothing apart from the letter before action, but this came to me and not my ex, she never received this, they just sent the claim form to me, I told them she did not live here, they found her and then just scribbled out the address and put hers in, she received nothing but a claim form after 4 years of nothing.

 

One point on the draft you set up, we only phoned them once to sort it out, this came after numerous standing order forms where sent back. I have in my possesion 2 standing order forms filled out correctly, signed and with all bank details correct. They sent these back to me when I reqeuseted the information, I did save copies as i said if they ever come back we have proof. They never once said why money was not taken and the proof is in front of me that they were filled out and sent. One dated 3/05/06 and the other 6/10/05, if you wish to add that to any draft.

 

Answer to your other question

 

The correct thread for the embarrased defence/letter to the DCA is post 117 and 118

 

Thanks Godmother, more the merrier, just want to get it right.

 

Thanks both for helping

[karel]

By the way Godmother I think you may have missed an earlier post, the C18 was sent in, check posts 117/118

 

Here is the post later saying exactly what they sent back, my request at the top, half way down the page their reply and what they sent, hope that helps.

 

O.k don't know if your still there to help Postjj or if anyone else can advice, the letter below was posted to incasso as given to me by a member, I have also added what was actually sent at the bottom of the page.

 

Dear XXX

 

CPR 18 - REQUEST FOR INFORMATION

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence

and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions

that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

1.1 If copies of any of the above documents are to be relied on in court rather than originals, a copy of the Notice of proposal to adduce hearsay evidence required under s2(1) of the Civil Evidence Act 1995 together with proof of the authenticity of the document(s) as required under s8(1)(b) of the Act, including but not limited to:

 

(a) a copy of the procedure(s) used for copying, storing and retrieving documents

(b) a copy of the relevant log entry showing the time and date of the scan or copy, the name of the member of staff making the copy, the method used for copying, storage and retrieval and time and date of destruction of the original document(s)

© copies of internal and external audit reports covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedures have been complied with

(d) copies of Quality Assurance accreditation certificates covering the entire period from the date of the copy to the present to demonstrate that the procedure(s) and audit process(es) comply with the appropriate quality standards

 

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention.

c. .Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

d. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial

Breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

e. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

f. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998

g. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

h. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence

and counter claim.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

Firstly there reply is

 

Please find enclosed our clients spreadsheet which details notes of all telephone conversations split across 3 pages. We trust you will now file your defence by return and look forward to recieving the same.

 

Then enclosed is the orginal copy of the credit agreement for £2250 and an administration fee of £135, total £2385 signed by my ex and dated 6-10-2005

 

Then there is a copy of a standing order form that is filled in by them but not signed and then a copy of 2 that are filled in and signed by my partner that they never acted on, one dated 6-10-05 and the other 3-5-06, they have the standing orders filled out, signed and have never taken a penny, proof again that we filled in the paper work, signed it and sent it off more than once.

 

Then a letter saying basically 'There have been no payments on this loan, we urgently need some payments on this loan, we maybe able to help with the amount, this letter is dated 2 years after the original loan was taken out, after we had tried numerous times to pay it. I actually can't ever remember recieving this letter, but it may have come and been ignored as we had tried paying it through filling in form after form and ringing them to sort it out, no money was ever taken.

 

There is also a loan assessment form, a copy of a bank staement of ours, a joint one that was never used and would not have been where the payments would have come from, the account numbers dont match up to the agreement forms, no idea when they got this, may have been i.d purposes?

 

A letter from TM gas with the details of the work to be carried out and the total amount £2250

 

A copy of an old electric bill of ours, again i.d, copy of an old wage slip of my partners.

 

Then finally a page of the balance and at the side

 

letter sent 11/04/06 re missing payments, called 3/5/06 sending another standing order mandate, letter sent on 18/11/08 with new s/o 23/12/2008 sara called, have sent new s/o , never received s/o back per orginal agreement, 1st payment £135.11

 

There are a few letters missing due to end of page, but basically admiting we sent s/o forms back and we did ring them, I remember the call, explaing we keep filling these forms out and you ignore them and send more back, ok this time it will be sorted, we filled them in, sent them back and nothing and that was the last we heard for 5 years until now.

 

So they seem to have missed quite a lot out there, no breakdown of interest charges of £900 or court and solicitor fees of £180, not an expert and totally unsure of the next step, could anyone please advise, be very grateful, if you need anymore info from me please ask.

 

Thanks Paul

[The GodMother]

sorry they seem to have missed a lot out.

 

to save ur self money u can with the AQ submitted a draft order of directions which is the CPR mpart 18 request advise u have asked for this info b4 but they have replied inadequately and lots of missing info.

 

Tell them you want them tp prove they have the right to charge interest and at what rate and a few other things

[citizenB]

Hi Godmother. pt updated the CPR18 and 31.14 requests in his thread..

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/255329-cpr-18-cpr-31-a.html

 

So I think in this instance as we are so unsure perhaps we must leave that alone.

 

Karel.

 

I would suggest you amend the letter where necessary , then repost it so we can fine tune it further.

 

I also suggest you print off that press report and keep it in the file so that it can be used if necessary to bolster your Witness statement. The fact is that you would not have voluntarily taken out this loan at that time without having had this brought to your attention.

 

HTH

[gh2008]

Hi,

 

Would it be possible to post up the POC, the agreement and the Defence please - or just post links to the relevant posts.

 

Have you been receiving regular statements?

Have you made an s.77 request? did you receive a 'statement of account' which should include payments due etc etc.

 

I've had a rough timeline/outline of the story from cB - just need to see some docs really.

 

If you want to pay under the original terms, you can always apply for a S.129 Time Order. Not used very often but powerful and binding.

 

Last question for now - was it a Standing Order Mandate or a Direct Debit mandate?

 

gh

[citizenB]

Hi,

 

Would it be possible to post up the POC, the agreement and the Defence please - or just post links to the relevant posts.

 

Have you been receiving regular statements?

Have you made an s.77 request? did you receive a 'statement of account' which should include payments due etc etc.

 

I've had a rough timeline/outline of the story from cB - just need to see some docs really.

 

If you want to pay under the original terms, you can always apply for a S.129 Time Order. Not used very often but powerful and binding.

 

Last question for now - was it a Standing Order Mandate or a Direct Debit mandate?

 

gh

 

Thanks for looking in gh.. all the docs are listed in the following pdf.

 

 

 

Paul documents.pdf

 

 

It was a standing order mandate and no correspondence including statements has been received after April 2006 when a further Mandate was enclosed .. letter in the pdf file above. It specifically requests Karel to return the mandate in the freepost envelope.

 

It is my understanding that no payments hvae been made as the mandate was never presented to the bank.

[gh2008]

hmmmmm, interesting

 

Ok, so they do not need a DN as all the payments are in arrears

 

BUT they cannot have the S.69 interest as that is specifically excluded from CCA claims.

 

The one thing that strikes me are cancellation rights.

 

I will need to look into them further (or PM AngryCat) the lack of them could render the agreement unenforceable.

 

The other issue is that of an APR quote. I will have to look up when that was mandatory to include as although it is a 0% loan with the admin fee the APR is 3% and the Total Charge for Credit is £135.

 

5 guests !!!!

[gh2008]

worth a read I think

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/217001-cancellation-rights-plus-discussion.html

[sickboy]

Hi GM:D

 

Clause 1 of the agreement allows for interest to be added to defaulted payments. However, in this instance, the default is none of the OP's making.. if the company couldnt be bothered to set up at least one of 5 bliddy standing orders.. then that is down to them IMHO.

 

I will investigate the CPR18 and draft one up if necessary.

 

Hey CB!

 

Aren't they also in default of section 87(B).

 

S 86B applies applies to agreements whenever made, subject to the transitional provisions of CCA 2006, Sch 3, para 6 where the remaining provisions of that particular section came into effect since 1 Oct 2008 in SI 2007/3300 Sch 3.

86B Notice of sums in arrears under fixed-sum credit agreements etc.

 

(1) This section applies where at any time the following conditions are satisfied—

(a) that the debtor or hirer under an applicable agreement is required to have made at least two payments under the agreement before that time;

(b) that the total sum paid under the agreement by him is less than the total sum which he is required to have paid before that time;

© that the amount of the shortfall is no less than the sum of the last two payments which he is required to have made before that time;

(d) that the creditor or owner is not already under a duty to give him notices under this section in relation to the agreement; and

(e) if a judgment has been given in relation to the agreement before that time, that there is no sum still to be paid under the judgment by the debtor or hirer.

(2) The creditor or owner—

(a) shall, within the period of 14 days beginning with the day on which the conditions mentioned in subsection (1) are satisfied, give the debtor or hirer a notice under this section; and

(b) after the giving of that notice, shall give him further notices under this section at intervals of not more than six months.

(3) The duty of the creditor or owner to give the debtor or hirer notices under this section shall cease when either of the conditions mentioned in subsection (4) is satisfied; but if either of those conditions is satisfied before the notice required by subsection (2)(a) is given, the duty shall not cease until that notice is given.

(4) The conditions referred to in subsection (3) are—

(a) that the debtor or hirer ceases to be in arrears;

(b) that a judgment is given in relation to the agreement under which a sum is required to be paid by the debtor or hirer.

(5) For the purposes of subsection (4)(a) the debtor or hirer ceases to be in arrears when—

(a) no sum, which he has ever failed to pay under the agreement when required, is still owing;

(b) no default sum, which has ever become payable under the agreement in connection with his failure to pay any sum under the agreement when required, is still owing;

© no sum of interest, which has ever become payable under the agreement in connection with such a default sum, is still owing; and

(d) no other sum of interest, which has ever become payable under the agreement in connection with his failure to pay any sum under the agreement when required, is still owing.

(6) A notice under this section shall include a copy of the current arrears information sheet under section 86A.

(7) The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay any sum in connection with the preparation or the giving to him of a notice under this section.

(8) Regulations may make provision about the form and content of notices under this section.

(9) In the case of an applicable agreement under which the debtor or hirer must make all payments he is required to make at intervals of one week or less, this section shall have effect as if in subsection (1)(a) and © for ‘two’ there were substituted ‘four’.

(10) If an agreement mentioned in subsection (9) was made before the beginning of the relevant period, only amounts resulting from failures by the debtor or hirer to make payments he is required to have made during that period shall be taken into account in determining any shortfall for the purposes of subsection (1)©.

(11) In subsection (10) ‘relevant period’ means the period of 20 weeks ending with the day on which the debtor or hirer is required to have made the most recent payment under the agreement.

(12) In this section ‘applicable agreement’ means an agreement which—

(a) is a regulated agreement for fixed-sum credit or a regulated consumer hire agreement; and

(b) is neither a non-commercial agreement nor a small agreement.”

Therefore they are in default of the 14 day period of the payment due on 6th October 2008? and as a result;

 

“86D Failure to give notice of sums in arrears

 

(1) This section applies where the creditor or owner under an agreement is under a duty to give the debtor or hirer notices under section 86B but fails to give him such a notice—

(a) within the period mentioned in subsection (2)(a) of that section; or

(b) within the period of six months beginning with the day after the day on which such a notice was last given to him.

(2) This section also applies where the creditor under an agreement is under a duty to give the debtor a notice under section 86C but fails to do so before the end of the period mentioned in subsection (2) of that section.

(3) The creditor or owner shall not be entitled to enforce the agreement during the period of non-compliance.

(4) The debtor or hirer shall have no liability to pay—

(a) any sum of interest to the extent calculated by reference to the period of non-compliance or to any part of it; or

(b) any default sum which (apart from this paragraph)—

(i) would have become payable during the period of non-compliance; or

(ii) would have become payable after the end of that period in connection with a breach of the agreement which occurs during that period (whether or not the breach continues after the end of that period).

(5) In this section ‘the period of non-compliance’ means, in relation to a failure to give a notice under section 86B or 86C to the debtor or hirer, the period which—

(a) begins immediately after the end of the period mentioned in (as the case may be) subsection (1)(a) or (b) or (2); and

(b) ends at the end of the day mentioned in subsection (6).

(6) That day is—

(a) in the case of a failure to give a notice under section 86B as mentioned in subsection (1)(a) of this section, the day on which the notice is given to the debtor or hirer;

(b) in the case of a failure to give a notice under that section as mentioned in subsection (1)(b) of this section, the earlier of the following—

(i) the day on which the notice is given to the debtor or hirer;

(ii) the day on which the condition mentioned in subsection (4)(a) of that section is satisfied;

© in the case of a failure to give a notice under section 86C, the day on which the notice is given to the debtor.”

[citizenB]

sickboy, you are, I believe correct. I think that came into affect around October 2008. So there should have been at least 2 statements sent out:) Well spotted.

[karel]

worth a read I think

Cancellation rights plus - Discussion

 

On the PDF document posted above on the 3rd document there is a black box in the bottom left hand corner where you can hardly see any writing

, but it says Right to cancel. Not sure if this is what you are meaning.

 

Thanks for all the help everyone, probably best for me to stand back and let you come to what is best between you as most of it is going over my head

[citizenB]

 

Thanks for all the help everyone, probably best for me to stand back and let you come to what is best between you as most of it is going over my head

 

I think we are coming to the conclusion that you have more weapons in your armoury than was first believed. This could make it easier for you to either stand and fight back or if you are still so inclined to offer a compromise to the creditor.

 

I am sure it will all become clearer as the discussion moves forward.. I think some of it has gone over my head as well:D

[gingermaralade]

Just had a thought and I think its relevant.

 

Standing Orders are controlled by you, the other person sent the forms back to you for YOU to set them up, they are not like a Direct Debit which the other person controls.

 

Sorry, but my conclusion on this is that you owe the money as its your fault for not doing this.

Edited June 29, 2010 by gingermaralade

[The GodMother]

Just had a thought and I think its relevant.

 

Standing Orders are controlled by you, the other person sent the forms back to you for YOU to set them up, they are not like a Direct Debit which the other person controls.

 

Sorry, but my conclusion on this is that you owe the money as its your fault for not doing this.

 

 

This may be so but a lot of company as you to send the standing order form to them the likes of councils and provident. I dont know why but my council has always asked for the standing order forms for rents and council tax to be sent to them then they present it.

 

Also further to this as the company have requested the form is sent back to them then they are responsible for the mistake.

I have been told so they can check u have filled it in correctly but then most of the details are alredy filled out for you and all you have to do is add bank details bank name and sign it. Everything else is filled out for you like your name and address name and bank for the council the councils name and adress etc.

[karel]

If this is the case with S.O forms, then it's news to me and all I did was do as they asked and sent them back to them filled in, thinking they would sort it out their end, I would think for a minute I had to fill it in, send them back to them and they send them back, would seem a total waste of time. They certainly did not send them straight back, sometimes it was weeks after with another letter asking to fill out some more. Even when we phoned them asking what was going on they said we will sort it and send some more forms out, just send them back to us. Why would they need them filled out? The address is filled out where to send them (barclays) nothing at all on the forms or in a letter to us tells us we need to take it into the bank.

 

Exactly what they said is in the first part of the pdf docment.

Why wait 4 years to send claim forms to my ex, she recieved no default notice, letter before action or anything, even court and solicitor fees were added, she did not have a chance to sort it out or reply.

Edited June 29, 2010 by karel

[gingermaralade]

I have had problems with standing orders in the past that is why I keep control of them myself. I've brought up the question too about them being returned to companies and my bank at that time said that many didn't process them or inconveniently lost them and problems like this one arrives

 

Even things that say should be paid by DD I pay by SO and then I am in control, had spats with them too about it, but you will find that companies are understanding.

 

On their ping=pong systems, I would have got in touch with them when it arrived back again and asked them what they were playing at.

[karel]

On their ping=pong systems, I would have got in touch with them when it arrived back again and asked them what they were playing at.

 

We did but you just get someone who has no clue and the answer was sorry, we will send some more out and just send them back to us and it will be sorted, no 'We send them back and you sort it'

[citizenB]

I think you are well covered with this issue, Karel. The letter dated April.. specifically requests that you return the standing order in the Freepost envelope. You cant argue with that:)

[The GodMother]

I have checked with my bank. LTSB and they have said that then get requests from the companys for SO as they like to have them sent back.