Urgent Request For Help

[kevin glancy]

you might also consider an e mail to tony hetherington at the mail on sunday (you will get his e mail addy from their website)

 

he will take this up without identifying you and expose these guys he is very good

 

 

nice one, ill do that, dont suppose you have his email?

[diddydicky]

not on me |( new computer other one died)

 

go onto the mail on sunday website and youll find him there or get his e mail from their

 

in the meantime get statements together from the bank showing the dates of all the payments

 

the court will need facts not opinions

[diddydicky]

i can use it against them i agree, but the law states there is nothing stopping them doing it again and again again and again and again, that i do know, i feel they will get their knuckles rapped and hey ho, off they trot and 6 months time they will do it again, what i want to do is find a way to STOP them and hurt them where it hurts most IN THE POCKET but there doesnt seem to be a way to do that as i cannot claim costs at the april hearing as i dont have any to claim, theyre paying.

Thats the problem i have! yes its harrasement and contempt but that doesnt mean any judge in the court will do anything apart from dismiss their claim for a charging order and thats why i am so keen to press for compensation or sue them, i just dont know how and neither does the court as they tell me i need to get the correct form doc and they dont know what it is, as they dont owe me money i cant sue them for money they dont owe me! DILEMAS!!

 

there IS a law that can stop them - if you prove them wrong this second time it is a dead cert that the judge will, on application grant an order against them as vexatious litigants which will mean that they will have to apply to the court for permission BEFORE they can make any further claims against you

[kevin glancy]

I have all the statements DOH! and a letter from the bank confirming payments were made, thats the FIRST thing i did

[cab1ne]

you quote: but the law states there is nothing stopping them doing it again and again again and again and again, that i do know,

 

The creditor can apply for a Charging Order if they have a County Court Judgment (CCJ) against you and you have not kept to the terms of the order. The County Court has no power at all to grant a charging order on instalment CCJs if there is no default.

 

 

The High Court has the discretionary power to grant a charging order when there is an instalment order agreed and the debtor is NOT in default.

 

cab

Edited February 28, 2010 by cab1ne

[cab1ne]

"oh" and if your installments are in tact and not in default a high court ruling will cost them a lot of money not you

 

cab

[Echodale]

Even though you have complied with the instalment order the claimant can ask the courts for a forthwith judgement in my experience. Below is how it happened to me.

 

Claimant feels instalments are not adequate, even though they accepted them when the CCJ was set. They go for a forthwith redetermination this gets reviewed by a "proper officer" and as there is no hearing the defendant does not know about it or get involved until the forthwith judgement arrives in the post.

 

Defendant contacts the court (within 7 days) and asks for a hearing, the court set the hearing to be heard at the same time as the CO. The judge on the day hears the CO first and the other side argue that they are happy to accept the instalments if the CO is agreed, judge sets CO and hears no more.

[kevin glancy]

Even though you have complied with the instalment order the claimant can ask the courts for a forthwith judgement in my experience. Below is how it happened to me.

 

Claimant feels instalments are not adequate, even though they accepted them when the CCJ was set. They go for a forthwith redetermination this gets reviewed by a "proper officer" and as there is no hearing the defendant does not know about it or get involved until the forthwith judgement arrives in the post.

 

Defendant contacts the court (within 7 days) and asks for a hearing, the court set the hearing to be heard at the same time as the CO. The judge on the day hears the CO first and the other side argue that they are happy to accept the instalments if the CO is agreed, judge sets CO and hears no more.

 

They NEVER accepted the initial offer, it was forced upon them by a Judge

[kevin glancy]

you quote: but the law states there is nothing stopping them doing it again and again again and again and again, that i do know,

 

The creditor can apply for a Charging Order if they have a County Court Judgment (CCJ) against you and you have not kept to the terms of the order. The County Court has no power at all to grant a charging order on instalment CCJs if there is no default.

 

 

The High Court has the discretionary power to grant a charging order when there is an instalment order agreed and the debtor is NOT in default.

 

cab

 

I agree, mercantile and credit case stopped the county court doing that, as far as the high court goes, it would cost them more to go there for what the debt is worth

[cab1ne]

if the debt aint worth that much, and there is nothing stopping them doing it again and again, then just go with the flow. its there money they are wasting. its down to a judge to tell them they need a high court order not you, they only get one shot in a high court.

 

cab

[kevin glancy]

if the debt aint worth that much, and there is nothing stopping them doing it again and again, then just go with the flow. its there money they are wasting. its down to a judge to tell them they need a high court order not you, they only get one shot in a high court.

 

cab

 

whats this nonsense about the high court, no-one even suggested a high court, this is a county court issue.

 

Anyway, tell you what, ill take you to court, try and continually get a charging on your property, drag you into court every couple of months and then forget the fact you have a disability and then when you ask advice, ill reply "just go with the flow"

[Echodale]

They NEVER accepted the initial offer, it was forced upon them by a Judge

Hi Kevin - I was quoting what happened to me, they accepted my offer then changed their mind and got the forthwith. I guess if the instalments were set by a judge they are even more likely to be chucking their toys out of the pram.

[kevin glancy]

Hi Kevin - I was quoting what happened to me, they accepted my offer then changed their mind and got the forthwith. I guess if the instalments were set by a judge they are even more likely to be chucking their toys out of the pram.

 

Hi yes they are really in a bad mood over it, but as ive stuck with the payment imposed by the judge initially and already had 1 case they took toward me thrown out, i wish there was a way i could really just take them to court and sue them for harrasement but the law appears to be on their side as there is nothing in place for me other than to bring it to the judges attention contempt and harrasement and hope they do something, bit i wont hold my breathe.

[diddydicky]

"oh" and if your installments are in tact and not in default a high court ruling will cost them a lot of money not you

 

cab

 

Your advice is slightly ammis

 

Where a CCJ is obtained for a large debt (say for example £10,000) and the payments ordered by the court at the outset are low due to the debtors financial position- lets say £50 per month.

 

It has and will continue to be the case that where, say after a year or so there is no improvement in the monthly repayments due to the debtors continuing difficulties that a creditor will make an application to the court for a charging order in order to secure the debt

 

the average person moves home every 7 and half years therefore a creditor faced with a ccj of £10,000 being repaid at £50 per month is likely to take over 16 years to get repaid, during which time the debtor may sell up and not advise the creditor or make provision from the proceeds tio clear the debt

 

in these circumstances the creditor WILL in all likelyhood get a charging order even though payments are being maintained

 

i know this from personal experience with two lenders around 20 years ago and from what i see around me now

 

furthermore- in those circumstances i think the creditors actions are reasonable!!

[kevin glancy]

Your advice is slightly ammis

 

Where a CCJ is obtained for a large debt (say for example £10,000) and the payments ordered by the court at the outset are low due to the debtors financial position- lets say £50 per month.

 

It has and will continue to be the case that where, say after a year or so there is no improvement in the monthly repayments due to the debtors continuing difficulties that a creditor will make an application to the court for a charging order in order to secure the debt

 

the average person moves home every 7 and half years therefore a creditor faced with a ccj of £10,000 being repaid at £50 per month is likely to take over 16 years to get repaid, during which time the debtor may sell up and not advise the creditor or make provision from the proceeds tio clear the debt

 

in these circumstances the creditor WILL in all likelyhood get a charging order even though payments are being maintained

 

i know this from personal experience with two lenders around 20 years ago and from what i see around me now

 

furthermore- in those circumstances i think the creditors actions are reasonable!!

 

It doesnt matter if a debt is £10'000 or £100'000 the THERE ARE 2 FACTS OF MATTER AND BOTH WHICH ARE LAW, the FIRST is, if a judge orders £20 a month then the creditor cannot pursue for more unless the financial circumstances of the debtor changes, (thats the chance they took when providing credit) and SECOND the law clearly states that where a judgement has been given and IS BEING MAINTAINED and NOT been defaulted on, the county court CANNOT BY LAW OF THE HIGH COURT grant a charging order, my point, your statement that says "furthermore- in those circumstances i think the creditors actions are reasonable!!" is nonsense. LAW IS LAW, i think that you forget, a CCJ is there to protect the debtor as much as it is for the creditor, the law also says that a CCJ is security as well on unsecured debts, Not my opinion, FACT

[cab1ne]

Your advice is slightly ammis

 

Where a CCJ is obtained for a large debt (say for example £10,000) and the payments ordered by the court at the outset are low due to the debtors financial position- lets say £50 per month.

 

It has and will continue to be the case that where, say after a year or so there is no improvement in the monthly repayments due to the debtors continuing difficulties that a creditor will make an application to the court for a charging order in order to secure the debt

 

the average person moves home every 7 and half years therefore a creditor faced with a ccj of £10,000 being repaid at £50 per month is likely to take over 16 years to get repaid, during which time the debtor may sell up and not advise the creditor or make provision from the proceeds tio clear the debt

 

in these circumstances the creditor WILL in all likelyhood get a charging order even though payments are being maintained

 

i know this from personal experience with two lenders around 20 years ago and from what i see around me now

 

furthermore- in those circumstances i think the creditors actions are reasonable!!

 

reasonable i 100% agree. (but nothing to do with what i have posted).

 

i shall elaborate,

 

The creditor can apply for a Charging Order if they have a County Court Judgment (CCJ) against you and you have not kept to the terms of the order.

 

The County Court has no power at all to grant a charging order on instalment CCJs if there is no default.

 

The High Court has the discretionary power to grant a charging order when there is an instalment order agreed and the debtor is NOT in default.

 

cab

[diddydicky]

well we agree to disagree in that case! i think you will find that the wording in the judgement is that the court SHOULD NOT make an order

 

this is not the same as MUST NOT or SHALL NOT

[diddydicky]

reasonable i 100% agree. (but nothing to do with what i have posted).

 

i shall elaborate,

 

The creditor can apply for a Charging Order if they have a County Court Judgment (CCJ) against you and you have not kept to the terms of the order.

 

The County Court has no power at all to grant a charging order on instalment CCJs if there is no default.

 

The High Court has the discretionary power to grant a charging order when there is an instalment order agreed and the debtor is NOT in default.

 

cab

 

what you are quoting is ADVICE not law

[diddydicky]

It doesnt matter if a debt is £10'000 or £100'000 the THERE ARE 2 FACTS OF MATTER AND BOTH WHICH ARE LAW, the FIRST is, if a judge orders £20 a month then the creditor cannot pursue for more unless the financial circumstances of the debtor changes, (thats the chance they took when providing credit) and SECOND the law clearly states that where a judgement has been given and IS BEING MAINTAINED and NOT been defaulted on, the county court CANNOT BY LAW OF THE HIGH COURT grant a charging order, my point, your statement that says "furthermore- in those circumstances i think the creditors actions are reasonable!!" is nonsense. LAW IS LAW, i think that you forget, a CCJ is there to protect the debtor as much as it is for the creditor, the law also says that a CCJ is security as well on unsecured debts, Not my opinion, FACT

 

there is no basis for your proposition that a CCJ is "there to protect the debtor"

 

the sole purpose of a CCJ is to enforce a judgement in favour of the claimant

 

by the time the judgement is given the debtor has lost his case and equity does not come into it

 

the court may be mindful of the debtors circumstances but its DUTY is to enforce the debt that it has adjudged to be payable

[cab1ne]

whats this nonsense about the high court, no-one even suggested a high court, this is a county court issue.

"i know that" but to get a charging order on a non-defaulted ccj they would have to take it to a high court because a county court does not have the power to do so. "nonesense" i dont think so

 

Anyway, tell you what, (dont tell me anything we are only offering you friendly advice)

 

ill take you to court, try and continually get a charging on your property, (which you could do, as i cant find anything in case law, precedent, or the court system that says you could'nt)

 

drag you into court every couple of months and then forget the fact you have a disability (is your disabilty of a mental or physical nature "answer via PM please") and then when you ask advice, ill reply "just go with the flow" (if they are allowed to take you back to county court as many times as they like what choices do we have)

 

if they can keep taking you to county court 50,000 times a year for a charging order and as you are disabled, it is obvious these **** bags dont give a toss (we do because we are caring people)

 

cab

[cab1ne]

what you are quoting is ADVICE not law

 

 

its fact

 

cab

[diddydicky]

anyway to get back to the original post and just to confirm that you CAN apply for an order to prevent these people from continuing to make vexatious court actions against you despite what others tell you

 

and IMO after this second instance, and given the judges remarks in the first case it is highly probable that your application will suceed if, as you say payments have been maintained