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    • Hi T911 and welcome to CAG. As you say, an interesting screw up. So much for quality control! Anyway, our regular advice is to ignore all of their increasingly threatening missives... UNLESS you get a letter of claim, then come back here and we'll help you write a "snotty letter" to help them decide whether to take it any further with their stoopid pics. If you get mail you're unsure of, just upload it for the team to have a look.
    • Thanks @lolerzthat's an extremely helpful post. There is no mention of a permit scheme in the lease and likewise, no variation was made to bring this system in. I recall seeing something like a quiet enjoyment clause, but will need to re-read it and confirm. VERY interesting point on the 1987 Act. There hasn't been an AGM in years and I've tried to get one to start to no avail. However, I'll aim to find out more about how the PPC was brought in and revert. Can I test with you and others on the logic of not parking for a few months? I'm ready to fight OPS, so if they go nuclear on me then surely it doesn't matter? I assume that I will keep getting PCNs as long as I live here, so it doesn't make sense for me to change the way that I park?  Unless... You are suggesting that having 5 or so outstanding PCNs, will negatively affect any court case e.g. through bad optics? Or are we trying to force their hand to go to court with only 2 outstanding PCNs?
    • That is so very tempting.   They are doing my annual review as we speak and I'm waiting for their response once I have it I will consider my next steps.    The debt camel website mentioned above is amzing and helping to. Education me alot    
    • Sending you a big hug. I’m sorry your going through this. The letters they send sound aweful, and the waiting game for them to stop. But these guys seem so knowledgable and these letters should stop. Hang in there, and keep in touch. Don’t feel alone 
    • In my time I've never seen a payout/commission from a PPC to a landlord/MA. Normally the installation of all the cameras/payment of warden patrols etc is free but PPCs keep 100% of the ticket revenue. Not saying it doesn't happen mind. I've done some more digging on this: Remember, what your lease doesn't say is just as important as what it does say. If your lease doesn't mention a parking scheme/employment of a PPC/Paying PCNs etc you're under no legal obligation to play along to the PPC's or the MA's "Terms and conditions". I highly doubt your lease had a variation in place to bring in this permit system. Your lease will likely have a "quiet enjoyment" clause for your demised space and the common areas and having to fight a PPC/MA just to park would breach that. Your lease has supremacy of contract, but I do agree it's worth keeping cool and not parking there (and hence getting PCNs) for a couple months just so that the PPC doesn't get blinded by greed and go nuclear on you if you have 4 or 5 PCNs outstanding. At your next AGM, bring it up that the parking controls need to be removed and mention the legal reasons why. One reason is that under S37(5b) Landlord and Tenant Act 1987,  more than 75% of leaseholders and/or the landlord would have needed to agree, and less than 10% opposed, for the variation to take place. I highly doubt a ballot even happened before the PPC was bought in so OPS even being there is unlawful, breaching the terms of your lease. In this legal sense,  the communal vote of the "directors" of the freehold company would have counted for ONE vote of however many flats there are (leases/tenants) + 1 (landlord). It's going to be interesting to see where this goes.  
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Welcome Finance Unenforceable Loan ??


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Regarding the charge on your house have a read of this it might be useful

 

105. Form and content of securities.

— (1) Any security provided in relation to a regulated agreement shall be expressed in writing.

(2) Regulations may prescribe the form and content of documents ( “security instruments ”) to be made in compliance with subsection (1).

(3) Regulations under subsection (2) may in particular— (a)

require specified information to be included in the pre-scribed manner in documents, and other specified material to be excluded;

 

(b)

contain requirements to ensure that specified information is clearly brought to the attention of the surety, and that one part of a document is not given insufficient or excessive prominence compared with another.

 

 

(4) A security instrument is not properly executed unless— (a)

a document in the prescribed form, itself containing all the prescribed terms and conforming to regulations under subsection (2), is signed in the prescribed manner by or on behalf of the surety, and

 

(b)

the document embodies all the terms of the security, other than implied terms, and

 

©

the document, when presented or sent for the purpose of being signed by or on behalf of the surety, is in such state that its terms are readily legible, and

 

(d)

when the document is presented or sent for the purpose of being signed by or on behalf of the surety there is also presented or sent a copy of the document.

 

 

(5) A security instrument is not properly executed unless— (a)

where the security is provided after, or at the time when, the regulated agreement is made, a copy of the executed agreement, together with a copy of any other document referred to in it, is given to the surety at the time the security is provided, or

 

(b)

where the security is provided before the regulated agreement is made, a copy of the executed agreement, together with a copy of any other document referred to in it, is given to the surety within seven days after the regulated agreement is made.

 

Reading this I take it that if there is no PROPERLY executed agreement or in your case no agreement at all they cannot hold a charge over your property.

What do others think?

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just had a look at my credit report and strangely enough welcome have updated it on 3/11/09 with an upto date status, they really are thick, bloody hell i have a good few months arrears and i stopped paying in October!!!!!!!!!!!

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  • 7 months later...

hi guys, i'm back and my problem is still ongoing!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

my case is still with FOS but TBH i'm not sure there moving forward with it enough for my liking...

 

i'm fighting welcome for :-

 

unenforceable loan (as they can't provide a true copy)

 

extorniate charges/interest

 

missold PPI (approx £4000)

 

very bad customer service (threats etc..)

 

incorrect figures on cca's/statements

 

bloody ell need i go on......

 

there's prob loads more but can't rmember it all at the minute

 

THE ACTUAL LOAN STARTED IN 2004 FOR £3000 OVER 3 YEARS, WE RE-WROTE IT AND RECEIVED A FURTHER £2000 ON TOP OF THIS, £940 OF THIS WAS SENT DIRECT TO OUR MORTGAGE COMPANY TO PAY ARREARS ON OUR ACCOUNT, WELCOME SAID THIS WAS A CONDITION OF THE LOAN

 

WE RE-WROTE THIS LOAN TWO MORE TIMES BUT DID NOT RECEIVE ANY FURTHER MONIES (SO WE HAVE ONLY EVER HAD £5000 FROM THEM)

 

I RECEIVED A STATEMENT LAST SUMMER FROM WELCOME SAYING MY BALANCE STOOD AT £14000 APPROX SO OBVIOUSLY SINCE THEN I HAVE BEEN QUERYING IT ALL

 

THEY OWE ME £4000 APPROX IN MISSOLD PPI & INTREST ACCRUED ON THIS, AND I HAVE ALREADY PAID TO THEM £8000 APPROX, SO I'LL BE DAMNED IF THERE GETTING ANOTHER £14000 FROM ME

 

The FOS have been involved for months now and don't seem to be doing too much to help, however i have had 3 offers for the PPI from welcome, 1st one £800, 2nd one £1700 and 3rd one, £900???? I have rejected them all as i want the £4500.

 

However, i've come to thinkin that if they do offer it all to me i still apparently owe them approx £9500, which i do not agree with.....

 

Anyway i am at the end of my tether with it all and sought some free legal advice yesterday from UNITE my union at work

 

He advised that it is very likely they are just dragging their heels and will eventually offer the full amount of £4000 that i'm asking for, with regards to the other amount, he says i should stop paying totally (which i did a while ago) and just let them take me to court...

 

I have been on here last night and noticed that Postgg mentioned there was a court case today about welcome, just wondered if anyone knew what the outcome of this was and also if anyone had any advice for me....

 

I informed the FOS that i had sought legal advice and she said she can't really get involved with this part of it, so god knows what to do next HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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hi dan

 

just caught up with your thread, dont be afraid to keep pm me

 

i have so many threads on the go its imposs to keep track

 

are you been given grief from welcome ref payments

 

are a dca called mkrr involved

 

when did the fos start there investigation

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FOS started investigation last year when i first started my thread (approx Oct 2009)

welcome have phoned me yesterday chasing monies but no other company are involved

i'm so frustrated with it all now just wondered if i should let em take me to court, no idea what to do

i feel the lady at FOS is being far too lenient with welcome i.e. keeps giving them time xtensions to reply etc.. and keeps saying she is waiting on their comments, she says as it's a complex case there are that many issues that need addressing it will take a long time before she can come to a decision (prob cause she hasn;t had answers from welcome re all of the issues raised)

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this is my 2nd case officer so far post!!!! the first guy was great and really understanding, i got the feeling as it is a massive casefile that he really got his teeth into it and understood every aspect of the complaint

however, i received a letter a couple of months back saying due to departmental changes within the FOS, i had been assigned a new case worker

i have nothign against this lady however, i do feel that she has no understanding of the situation at all (thats even if she's interested) as half the time she sounds so bloody fed up!!!!

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post, i am today going to do a complete breakdown of all my complaints in bullet proof letter. my main aim is to reduce the £14000 they say i still owe from an original loan of no more than £5000

 

i will now be going for charges back from loans dating back to 2004 in the hope that they refund these including interest and the 8% stat interest, plus all PPI and interest accrued, and i've got a funny feeling i can get this £14000 down to zilch!!!! after all i have already paid them £8000!!!!

 

what do you think??? is there anything else i need to add in there, don't forget my 4th and final re-write is the one that they can't provide a true CCA for....

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i've managed to put together a letter listing all complaints i have. I have then gone on to say i have sought legal advice and i have been told to cease all payments until they can offer a conclusion...

 

i've also said that i have put money away into a bank and proof of this can be shown to a judge if the case goes to court.

 

basically, i'm trying to let them know that i'm prepared to go to court over it and am ready for it.

 

Just wondered before i send this letter, if one of you experts can go over my loan figures one last time, as i seem to think loan number 3 is out by £300 approx. I have mentuioned this is my letter but just need it clarifying as i'm not great with the apr figures, don't want to show myself up lol....

 

Also, check the others in case i've missed anything......

 

LOAN 1

 

amount of credit: £3000.00

amount of credit for insurance premiums: £1374.37

Acceptance Fee: £235.00

Mortgage indemnity Fee: £330.00

Total amount of loan: £4939.37

 

Rate of Interest: 2.00% per month

APR: 38.93%

Monthly Repayment: £193.79

Number of payments: 36

 

 

LOAN 2

 

A; Total Amount of Credit: £7039.91

B: Amount of credit for cash advance: £5972.89

C: Amount of credit for insurances: £ 175.00

D: Duration of Agreement: 48 months

 

Amount of each monthly repayment: £227.19

Number of monthly payments: 48

APR (variable) 36.6%

 

E: Payment Protection Insurance: N/A

F: Lifecare 24 £175.00

G: Homecare 24 N/A

H: Other: Old Medicare N/A

I: Other N/A

J: Other N/A

L: Total charge for credit (M+N+O) £3865.21

M: Acceptance Fee £235.00

N: Mortgage Indemnity Fee £657.02

O: Interest Charge £2973.19

 

 

LOAN 3

 

Amount of Credit: £10000.00

Acceptance Fee: £235.00

Mortgage Indemnity Fee £1100.00

Total Amount of Loan: £11335.00

 

Rate of Interest 1.80% per month

APR: 31.70%

 

Amount of monthly payment: £310.49

Number of monthly payments: 60

 

 

 

LOAN 4

 

Total amount of credit: £10676.40

Amount of Credit for cash advance: £10676.40

Duration of agreement (months): 180

Amount of each monthly payment: £151.50

Number of monthly payments: 180

APR (Variable): 16.40%

 

Total charge for credit: £16594.36

Acceptance Fee; £0.00

Mortgage indemnity fee: £1174.40

Interest Charge: £15419.96

Rate of Interest per annum: 14.00%

 

Just wondered if anyone else can find any underpayments or overpayments in the above figures please so i can add that in my letter also.

 

thanks again guys for all your help

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well, well, well

 

i've just had a call from FOS saying she doesn't feel there is much more they can do for me if i am contemplating going down the legal route...

 

she basically said as i've been advised legally to cease payments etc... and let them take me to court, she feels the FOS can't get involved in that, they can only help me with the PPI stuff and if i accept that part of an offer (if they were to make one) then i can't carry the claim on for other issues (incorrect CCA, non compliance of CCA)...

 

she did ask that if i choose to go down the legal route, if i could just keep her informed in case she is ever asked about any of it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

so guys, it looks like i'm on my own:confused:

 

can any help with the above figures pleeeeeease????????

 

i want to be sure they are incorrect (i.e. wrong repayments) before i go in all guns blazing

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got your message

 

realy do need to see the agreement so can you post it up minus personal details but leave in the figures

 

google photo bucket

 

ill have a go on the figures you have posted up

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when i said the CCA they had supplied had no signatures, dates etc... it was then they sent this one (above posts 89/90), you will note that this one has slightly different figures on it, (only pennies, but still)!!!!!

 

and this one also had hubbys's correct name/address on top left, and my married name and address on top right, only problem here is we took this loan out in nov 2005, i didn;t bloody get married til 2007 so how can this be a "true copy", never mind the fact it's slightly different from the one prevoulsy supplied...

 

i've had to do it in two halfs by the way so you can read the figures, hope this is ok

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sorry i've just realised, the figures i mentioned as being slightly out by pennies was on the exercise to settle early section and my pics above didn;t capture that bit so here you go:-

 

Photobucket

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you might not be able to read clearly but basically on CCA copy 1 (the one with no names, addresses, the details are:-

 

settle after a quarter of term £9864.99

settle after half the term £8189.87

settle after three quarters term £5230.37

 

these details read slightly different on copy CCA 2 (the one with my wrong name on)

 

settle after quarter term £9864.86

settle after half the term £8190.26

settle after three quarters term £5230.66

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Just a quick question about the MIF on each of my loans....

 

can anybody tell me whether i should have paid a MIF on loan 2, with the loan being only a small amount (£3000) basically it's supposed to be an insurance in case the repossession of my property does not cover their fees if i'm correct, so how on earth can they justify such a fee on a £3000 loan?????

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As far as I'm aware MIF can be charged on any amount, some say it it can only be charged on loans over 25k but I've yet to see anything to confirm this.

As always please check and double check what myself and other Caggers inform.

 

If you like my Post please dont be shy give my Scales a little tickle :-)

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