£50k CC/loan debt and job loss

[consumerchicken]

any advice please?

[IdaInFife]

hiya,

 

read this about the egg agreements:

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/188093-egg-credit-agreements-what.html

 

the others that have snet the t and c's you can send the letter in post#22.

 

and if you are happy to go the cpr route then yes. using this was will at least make them show if they do have a valid cca or not

 

ida x

[consumerchicken]

 

and if you are happy to go the cpr route then yes. using this was will at least make them show if they do have a valid cca or not

 

 

Ida, please can you explain what you mean by this? I have read some of PT's CPR thread but I'm a bit confused. If I've already CCA'd them can you then ask for the the CCA via CPR as well?

 

Also what do you recommend I send the ones that haven't sent a CCA?

 

Thanks

[IdaInFife]

hiya,

 

ok, you can request a cca freom any of your creditors but there are some loopholes with this and they could keep providing you an appliaction form saying that is the agreement, if they take you to court then they would need to produce the original agreement.

 

using cpr this is basically forcing their hand by going through the stages then actually applying for the court for the cvourt to tell them to produce one so if they do have one at this stage you would know for deffinate rather than sending account in dipute letters back and forth.

 

 

and yes you can ask both ways

 

let me know if i have explained it better?

 

Ida x

[IdaInFife]

for the ones that have provided nothing you can send them:

 

 

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/86-debt-collectors/571-failiure-to-provide-a-copy-of-the-agreement-within-the-prescribed-timescale

 

Ida x

[consumerchicken]

Thankyou Ida that makes a lot of sense.

 

I've been reading a lot of egg threads and I keep finding out about debts passed to DCAs then back to egg then to other DCAs then back to egg and so on!

 

After reading the first post in PT's CPR thread above I thought I'd messed up as I'd asked for the CCA under CCA act.

 

In a nutshell - If I send letter from post 22 and then don't get an enforcable CCA I should use the CPR route?

[IdaInFife]

yes if you want

 

ida x

[consumerchicken]

Can anybody take a look at my natwest CCA and let me know where I stand?

 

I think there may be a problem with the split loan? and also it's non cancellable (I think that's a problem as well?) But is it unenforceable?

 

They sent me some standard terms and a card carrier for my credit card, hopefully they have'nt got the original!!

 

Thanks

http://i938.photobucket.com/albums/a...oan-cca-p1.jpg

 

http://i938.photobucket.com/albums/a...oan-cca-p2.jpg

[IdaInFife]

are the two links front and back?

 

 

the repayment of your loan would come under restricted use:

 

11.—(I) A restricted-use credit agreement is a regulated consumer credit agreement—

(a) to finance a transaction between the debtor and the creditor, whether forming

part of that agreement or not, or

(b) to finance a transaction between the debtor and a person (the " supplier") other

than the creditor, or

© to refinance any existing indebtedness of the debtor's, whether to the creditor or

another person,

and " restricted-use credit" shall be construed accordingly

 

 

and the cash for you would be unrestrcited use,

 

 

so it would be a mutilple agreement

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/171037-multiple-agreements-falling-within.html

 

So, s.18 CCA comes into play thus:

18. Multiple agreements.—

(1) This section applies to an agreement (a "multiple agreement ") if its terms are such as—

(a) to place a part of it within one category of agreement mentioned in this Act, and another part of it within a different category of agreement so mentioned, or within a category of agreement not so mentioned, or

(b) to place it, or a part of it, within two or more categories of agreement so mentioned.

(2) Where a part of an agreement falls within subsection (1), that part shall be treated for the purposes of this Act as a separate agreement,

So, because all items haven't been separated out agreement is unenforceable.

 

 

Your claim/defence is on the basis that the Loan Agreement, is the subject matter of this claim herein is regulated by the Act and is irredeemably unenforceable as follows -

(1) The Agreement is a multiple Agreement within section 18(1)(a) of the Act.

(2) The parts of the Agreement must be treated as separate Agreements.

(3) The regulated parts of the Agreement are improperly executed and irredeemably unenforceable

Ida x

[consumerchicken]

Thanks Ida!!

[nuke em]

Read This first ,

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/211974-what-do-when-debt.html

Then

You might want to send them this ( only to debt collectors/solicitors though) not to a "Principal" "creditor" though. There is another letter i have available you would need to send to them

 

 

 

in Care of:

Your address

Your address

Near: Your post code

 

Name

Address

post code

Of the DCA

 

 

Today’s date

Notice of Request to Cease Harassment

 

Your Reference Number: 123456789

 

Dear ???????,

 

Please read the following notice thoroughly and carefully before responding. It is a notice. It informs you. It means what it says.

 

I refer to your letter dated (date)

 

I feel this matter is serious and wish to deal with it in writing.

As you are a third party intervener in this matter acting without authority, I DO NOT give you permission to interfere in my commercial affairs as you have no legal standing. I do not have a contract with you and any permission that you believe you may have from me is hereby withdrawn. If you believe that you have power of attorney to act on my behalf you are hereby fired, and any consent that you believe you may have, tacit or otherwise, is hereby withdrawn.

 

I am familiar with the terms of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970, and the Protection from Harassment Act 1997. And I believe, should you continue in contacting me after my request for you to cease your activity, that you will be guilty of harassment and blackmail, and you will be in breach of these acts, and you will be reported to the relevant bodies.

 

I am well aware of Section 40, sub-section (3) which you may consider entitles you to proceed. However upon full commercial liability and penalty of perjury you will need to supply the following Proofs of Claims:

 

1. Proof of Claim that your actions are reasonable.

 

2. Proof of Claim that any obligation on my part is due, or believed by you to be due to you, and not to some other party.

 

3a. Proof of Claim that any obligation on my part is to yourself by providing sight of the appropriate contract, or

 

3b. Proof of Claim that any obligation on my part to persons for whom you act by providing sight of the appropriate contract.

 

4. Proof of Claim that any obligation on my part protects you from any future loss.

 

5. Proof of Claim that any obligation on my part is enforcement of a legal process on a Human Being under Common Law jurisdiction, who cannot possibly have such liability under said jurisdiction.

 

6. A hand signed invoice in accordance with The Bills of Exchange Act 1882

 

You would of course need to provide these Proofs, including showing full accounting, if you choose to go to law.

 

Please provide sufficient evidence within ten (10) days from the above date,

Should you provide that I owe your organisation or your client any outstanding amount and that you can provide proof that they have assigned you agency, I should be happy to pay any verified claim in full.

 

Your said failure to provide verification of your claim constitutes your agreement to the following terms: that you are a third party interloper; you have no legal standing; no first-hand knowledge of this matter; your claim is fraudulent; any damages I suffer, you will be held culpable; that any negative remarks made to a credit reference agency will be removed and that you will no longer pursue this matter any further.

 

You will be deemed to have been served notice of my request and I will deem it served three(3) days from the date of this letter. This has been sent by recorded delivery. I am advising you that any communications from you including but not limited to letter, phone calls and text messages received after this date will be recorded/noted with the intention of them being used as evidence.

 

Sincerely and without ill will, vexation or frivolity

 

 

By: XXX-YYY :of the ZZZZ family

 

Authorised Representative All Natural Inalienable Rights Reserved.

 

-----------

notes on this Doc... the bits in red are important to you, send exactly as is, read below

 

Do Not sign this letter, there is no need to sign anything that is not a contract

 

 

At the bottom of the document if your name is John Smith

You print John:of the Smith family

 

if your name is John Martin Smith

Your print John-Martin: of the Smith Family

 

Use uppercase/lowercase exactly as on the document for the RED sections.

 

also look at the address section in RED

 

the "In Care of:" your address

 

"Near" your postcode

are important also

[consumerchicken]

Thanks for that nuke em- definitely an interesting read

 

None of my debts are with DCAs (yet)!

[nuke em]

Thanks for that nuke em- definitely an interesting read

 

None of my debts are with DCAs (yet)!

 

oh i have another that you send to the Original Creditor, i'll sub this thread and post it up later

[nuke em]

here you go.. letter to Original Creditor ( the OC )

 

In Care of:

Address

Address

Near:Post code

 

The CEO ( always send it to the current CEO)

Bank / card co Name

Address ( send to their registered office)

Post code

 

CC: whoever, Collections Department ( send another original with the stamp as below to their collections address as well)

 

Today’s date

 

Re: Account no 123456789

 

Dear CEO,

 

I would be happy to settle any financial obligation I might lawfully owe, as soon as I have received the following documentation from you:

 

1. Validation of the debt (the actual accounting);

2. Verification of your claim against me (a sworn affidavit or a hand signed invoice in accordance with The Bills of Exchange Act 1882);

3. A copy of the contract signed by both parties and therefore binding both parties.

 

I hereby give you ten (10) days to reply to this notice from the above date with a notice sent using recorded post and signed under full commercial liability and penalties of perjury, assuring and promising me that all of the replies and details given to the above requests are true and without deception, fraud or mischief. This notice has been sent by recorded delivery.Your said failure to provide the aforementioned documentation within ten (10) days, from the above date, to validate the debt, will constitute your agreement to the following terms:

 

1. That the debt did not exist in the first place;

OR

2. It has already been paid in full;

AND

3. That any damages I suffer, you will be held culpable;

4. That any negative remarks made to a credit reference agency will be removed;

5. You will no longer pursue this matter any further.

 

 

 

 

Please Note: I wish to deal with this matter in writing and I do not give your organisation permission to contact me by telephone. Should it do so, I must warn you that the calls could constitute ‘harassment’ and I may take action under Section 1 of The Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

 

Sincerely and without ill will, vexation or frivolity

 

sign here, put a unused Stamp here ( any value) and sign through it with blue ink/ blue pen

 

By: XXX: YYYY; Authorised Representative

 

No assured value, No liability. All Rights Reserved.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Notes on this Doc... the bits in red are important to you, send exactly as is, read below

 

re the "XXX: YYYY;"

At the bottom of the document if your name is John Smith

You print John:of the Smith family

 

if your name is John Martin Smith

Your print John-Martin: of the Smith Family

 

Use uppercase/lowercase exactly as on the document for the RED sections.

 

also look at the address section in RED

 

the "In Care of:" your address

 

"Near" your postcode

are important also

 

Finally , send recorded delivery

Edited July 29, 2009 by nuke em

[GhostDebt]

Hello Nuke em,

Like the letters, especially the bit about signing across a stamp.

 

Hello Consumerchicken,

As the need arises, it would be worth starting individual threads in each creditors forum area so you will get input from people who have experience with the particular companies as well.

The methods of dealing with them tend to be the same but different companies will respond in seperate ways.

 

Good luck.

Regards

[consumerchicken]

thanks ghost - I think I need to do that ASAP as this thread is a bit messy...