Help Please, Sacked by Large Insurance Company for no reason.

[Captain Wesker]

Hi there,

 

Just over 3 months ago I was employed by a large insurance company.

 

Today, I sit at my desk and am asked by the Big Manager if she can have a word.

 

I am called into the office and informed that my employment is being terminated as its company policy not to rehire people who have been previously dismissed and as I have had unsatisfactory references.

 

I was given the all clear to re-apply for this job by the head of HR, and have it in writing so thats number one reason out the window.

 

As for number 2, i know exactly who has given me a bad reference, and I will be dealing with him separately(He has given me a bad reference as I filed a grievance against him and won, my performance was top notch in that job) And I have told the company about this previously and they were fine with it.

 

I was told i was being given no notice. I asked who had given me the bad reference, they refused to show it to me, tell me what it said or who it was from.

 

I asked for the reason i was being dismissed in writing, they refused. I refused to leave until I had something in writing, at which point they said they would send me an "e-mail" and if I didnt leave security would escort me from the premises.

 

I left.

 

I know they have screwed up royally over the way they have sacked me as my attendance has been exemplary and my work has been top notch. What do i do?

 

Please help, I really want this job back.

[zoet15]

If you are a member of a union i would consult them or contact Acas for advice as i always find them very helful and give free advice.

[Captain Wesker]

Im not a member of a union.

 

Hasnt anyone got any advice on this one?

Edited May 1, 2009 by Captain Wesker

[Captain Wesker]

Its been a week now and nothing. So far i have been dismissed, but thye dismissal has not been done by the books, and I have had nothing in writing as to my present state of employment, notice period or appeals process.

 

Where's my next step.

[BeauBrummie]

Hi,

 

I think you will find it very difficult to be reinstated and my suggestion would be to look for alternative employment.

 

You have however got some amunition to throw at them but this depends on what you know and what you may still be able to get access to.

 

Your notice period should be paid unless the reason for dismissal is Gross Misconduct which they should be asked to prove with a meeting and chance for you to appeal their decision.

 

Did the employer give you a "Statement of Terms & Conditions of Employment"?

 

Can you get or have you got access to the Company Disciplinary or Greivance procedures most commonly sited in the employee handbook?

 

Have they sent ou your P45 yet or P60 for the close of the last Tax year?

 

All of the questions above give you reasons to write to the company who should within a reasonable time frame, say 7 days provide you with answers.

 

So your next step as you have already waited a week is put your points in writing to the most senior person in the Company as soon as possible.

 

Beau

[Captain Wesker]

Hi, this is the letter i am sending, any comments?

 

Dear Big Boss,

I write further to my dismissal on 30/04/2009. It has now been over a week, and I still do not have the reasons for my dismissal in writing, as eventually promised by yourself. As part of my contract of employment I am entitled to one weeks notice in writing. You specifically stated that I was not being fired for gross misconduct, and gave the reasons of:

1. It is not company policy to rehire previously dismissed staff.

This issue was resolved before I started employment, and I have this in writing from the head of HR.

2. Unsatisfactory references.

You have refused to state who the reference is from or how it is unsatisfactory, however I have previously discussed the matter of a possible bad reference from Previous Manager with Current Manager, and she informed me not to worry about it. I therefore request a copy of the reference you consider to be unsatisfactory and the reasons for it.

Your refusal to give me any form of notice is a breach of my contract of employment, and as such I am still employed by the company and expect to be paid until the date I receive one weeks notice in writing.

I wish to raise a grievance against you due to the manner I was dismissed and your refusal to discuss it, or provide me with anything in writing. An e-mail is not considered acceptable, and you refused to give me any notice period or anything in writing, nor was I informed of my rights before or after the meeting with yourself.

I also require a full copy of the companies grievance, dismissal and appeal procedures, as I am no longer able to view them on the Intranet. I intend to follow company procedures as far as possible before taking my case to an employment tribunal, and I have already taken advice from a solicitor on this matter.

I would also like to raise the fact that personal possessions of mine were not returned and I have since been informed they were thrown away. These included personal stationary, and my diary which detailed all working hours, including flex time owed to myself.

I look forward to your response within 7 days.

Yours Sincerely

Captain Wesker

[BeauBrummie]

I think this is claiming a few more rights than you really have just now and you really need to pull back from going in all guns blazing.

 

Try this

 

Dear Big Boss,

 

 

I write further to my dismissal on 30/04/2009. It has now been over a week, and I still do not have the reasons for my dismissal in writing, as eventually promised by yourself. As part of my contract of employment I am entitled to one weeks notice in writing. You specifically stated that I was not being fired for gross misconduct, and gave the reasons of:

 

 

1. It is not company policy to rehire previously dismissed staff.

 

 

This issue was resolved before I started employment, and I have this in writing from the head of HR.

 

 

2. Unsatisfactory references.

 

 

You have refused to state who the reference is from or how it is unsatisfactory, however I have previously discussed the matter of a possible bad reference from Previous Manager with Current Manager, and she informed me not to worry about it. I therefore request a copy of the reference you consider to be unsatisfactory and the reasons for it.

 

 

Your refusal to give me any form of notice is a breach of my contract of employment, and as such I am still employed by the company and expect to be paid until the date I receive one weeks notice in writing.

 

 

I believe I have reason to raise a greivance with your procedure regarding the manner of my dismissal. To date I have not been given a satisfactory reason and neither have you given any proof of Gross Mis-Conduct which can be the only reason for dismissal without notice.

 

 

Furthermore I have not been given the right of appeal which again should be accorded to me if the reason is anything other than Gross Mis-Conduct.

 

I would also like to raise the fact that personal possessions of mine were not returned and I have since been informed they were thrown away. These included personal stationary, and my diary which detailed all working hours, including flex time owed to myself.

 

 

I look forward to your response within 7 days.

 

 

Yours Sincerely

 

 

Captain Wesker

 

I think that would be better at this stage as you do not have all the rights that you were trying to state. As I said in my first post to you, it is very unlikely that you will be re-instated, but you should at least get a weeks pay as a notice period.

[Captain Wesker]

Hi there, Can anyone point me to some information about employment tribunals, how i go about starting one, what my rights are at them etc.

 

Thanks

[BeauBrummie]

Hi there, Can anyone point me to some information about employment tribunals, how i go about starting one, what my rights are at them etc.

 

Thanks

 

You can get info from this website

 

Employment Tribunal

 

Can I ask is it in connection with your recent dismissal that you require the info? If so can you tell me on what is the basis of your claim?

 

Beau

[Captain Wesker]

Ok, they seem to be ignoring me.

 

I saw a solicitor and she looked at everything and said I had a case for wrongful dismissal and breach of contract. She said I could go to tribunal on those grounds, but if she was to represent me it would cost me. Therefore if they do ignore me, I will have to go to a tribunal.

[BeauBrummie]

I think you will not get to an ET with this, but another avenue may to ask the solicitor to write on your behalf.

 

You need to way up the financial implications of the case :

 

As I see it you are only entitled to a period of notice payment that would be not less than 1 week and any holiday pay you have accrued.

 

If you look at the way you have been dismissed while not strictly by the book, it was within employment law as you have less than 12 months service.

 

If you wish to make a claim for unfair dismissal you would have to prove that there is was a deliberate decision to remove you from your post due to discrimination as yet unknown to you, which then leads your employer to (you assume) dismiss you for a gross mis conduct.

 

I agree that the employer should reply to your letters and should pay you a notice period but that is as far as I can go with it.

 

Beau

[Hebweezle]

Hi Captain

 

Sorry to hear about what's been going on.

 

When you were taken back on, were you given a probationary period? if so, were you still in this probation period?

 

If you were on probation, then your employer can stop your employement forthwith. This does need to be addressed first.

 

In respect of your reference - no one can give a bad reference, that is libel and is quoted under employment law. However, as you state, you've been told by your then current manager that it wouldn't matter.

 

Without going into too much detail, I'm concerned about the grievance that you had before with a previous manager and that although you won, you were dismissed and had to re-apply for the position (have I read this right?) As I don't know the details as to why you were dismissed and had to re-apply for the (same?) position this could have a bearing on any case.

 

However, you yourself can apply to a tribunal at no cost to yourself if you are unemployed and are currently receiving benefits. A job centre representative can help you there. Additionally, as you are not a member of a union (which I always strongly suggest that everyone is), you must get advice from the CAB. I know the queues are quite long there but there are good people there and they can help you with your tribunal by representing you if need be.

 

I would definately recommend that the letter from Beau is sent to your employer and again, when you receive a response (send your letter by special delivery) again take that to the CAB.

 

I do send my very best to you and let me know how you get on.

 

Heb

[patdavies]

In respect of your reference - no one can give a bad reference, that is libel and is quoted under employment law.

 

 

It can only be libellous if it is untrue.

[Hebweezle]

Hi Pat

 

Captain has stated that its untrue in his comments.

 

Heb

[Captain Wesker]

I do not have any probationary period in my contract, I have already sent the other letter but as Yet have had no response.

 

If the reference in question is the one I am thinking of, it can not be anything but libelous,as my Ex manager holds a grudge against me.

[Captain Wesker]

I have had no response, So I will send them a letter stating that If no response in 7 days I will take things further.

 

I have since had a letter from Big Boss Lady that has no relation to the letter I sent in. It states I am sacked for gross misconduct on 30/04(she specifically stated it was not gross misconduct). However it took 3 weeks to arrive, and I have proof it was sent after my other letter arrived(thank you recorded delivery). It also asks me to sign an account of the "meeting" to state it is true(which it is not) and states that due to my actions I will be added to a national fraud prevention database.

 

The last part is an accusation of commiting fruad, which I am sure must be a serious offence. Can I make a seperate case for libel or defamation of character beased on this accusation?

 

Thanks.

[Captain Wesker]

Righto, I am sending the following letter tomorrow, can you guys have a look at it and make sure its ok?

 

Thanks

 

 

 

Dear HR Lady,

I have been informed that you are currently dealing with my case. If this is not the case, I would appreciate it if you would pass my letter on to the correct party, and inform myself who is dealing with it.

It has now been 3 weeks since my letter dated 11/05/2009 and I have received no response.

I have however received a letter from Big Boss Lady regarding my dismissal which arrived 20/05/2009, which is 3 weeks after my dismissal. I can only assume that this was sent in response to my letter. The letter bears no relation to the events that happened.

There was no formal disciplinary hearing held, and I know the manner in which my dismissal was conducted is against The Companys HR policy and employment law.

She states she fully considered the evidence, yet no evidence was presented and she refused to discuss any matters of the case with me, nor was I allowed to see the references when I requested to.

She also makes mention of an employment screening process oversight, yet does not go into what relation that bears to the case and my supposed gross misconduct, and she previously stated I was not being dismissed for gross misconduct when I specifically asked if that was the case.

She has asked me to sign a copy of the notes and send them back to confirm they are a true copy of what happened. They are not a true copy and will not be returned.

Lastly, and most seriously she states that as result of my actions and previous notifications(of which I have had none) details relating to my conduct will be recorded on a fraud prevention database. This allegation of supposed fraud is a very serious, and has not been backed up by any evidence. I consider this to be libellous and am deeply offended by this.

Having consulted with my solicitor, If I have not had a response to this letter within 7 days, I will have no choice but to take matters further. I have tried to go through proper company channels and have had no response.

I look forward to your response within the next 7 days.

Yours Sincerely

Captain Wesker

[Captain Wesker]

Any comments at all on the letter?

[Captain Wesker]

I really want to get this sent on monday, any comments at all?

[Captain Wesker]

Hi, after over 2 months I have finally received a response.

 

They are upholding my dismissal due to unsatisfactory references, ignoring the majority of points in my letter, and refusing to state who the reference is from. They have given the reason that a reference states I was dismissed from previous employment(which I have not been).

 

What law can I quote to force them to show me the reference.

 

Thanks

 

John

[callumsgran]

Mate i'm sorry to say you're on a hiding to nothing

 

These people will get away with what they've done because we cant fight back

 

Unless you are pregnant, coloured, disabled or gay we have no rights as far as discrimination goes and thats what has happened (i know, ive been there)

 

Someone somewhere dont like you and theres nothing you can do about it except bite your tongue and move on, find another job

[Elenathion]

Start the Employment Tribunal process now as you only have 3 months to start it and their actions could be considered to be delaying actions in order to stop you from pursuing this avenue. If you can't afford the solicitor then don't use one, represent yourself and go to the CAB for help drafting the ET1 etc. It is a daunting process but I am representing myself in an ET and the ET staff and the ET judge have been incredibly helpful and courteous as they recognise I do not have law experience.

 

As for the previous post, ignore it as you will not be claiming discrimination but rather unfair dismissal and victimisation.

 

Victimisation is defined here: your rights: What is victimisation? - from workSMART.org.uk

 

From what I've read that you have written, they are basing the dismissal on a bad reference which is a direct result of you filing and winning a grievance. This is clearly victimisation from the writer of the reference. I'm a bit confised about whether the employer is the same on both occasions though. If the employer is the same for both occasions then I would file an ET1 for both unfair dismissal on the grounds of failing to follow correct procedures etc, and victimisation on the grounds of the reference. If the employer that provided the reference is different to the most recent employer then I would just file an ET1 for unfair dismissal but as soon as you see a copy of the offending reference then you could file a second ET1 against that empoyer for victimisation.

 

As part of the ET, they would have to provide you with copies of anything they intended to rely on as evidence, so you would get copies of the reference etc then.

 

I would also consider sending them a Subject Access Request in order to get copies of everthing that they hold regarding yourself.

 

Hope this has been of help.

[callumsgran]

Best of luck to both of you, i think you'll both need it :-|

[Captain Wesker]

Hey there, im filing a tribunal, but im trying one last letter to the big man at the company.

 

Can you have a read and give me any advice on it?

 

Dear Big Boss Ladies Boss,

I am writing to you, as I was told you are the correct person to send my letter to by HR Lady.

I was dismissed from the company on 30/04/2009. I have been attempting to appeal since but have had no joy at going through the company procedures, and was told on the 30/06/2009 by HR Lady over the phone that I have no right of appeal, nor any right to raise a grievance against Big Boss Lady for the way she handled my dismissal.

I will be filing a claim with the employment tribunals service for wrongful dismissal and breach on contract on 20/07/2009. Enclosed are copies of the letters I have sent to the company and those I have received. You will notice that HR Ladies letter does not mention many of the things that I enquired about.

Also, both Big Boss Lady and HR Lady refused to provide copies of the references which my dismissal was based upon, nor elaborate on why they were unsatisfactory. I have since confirmed that neither reference states that I was dismissed as HR Ladies letter on 29/06/2009 claims.

I apologise that I have not given you much time to respond, but it took nearly 7 weeks to get a response from the company, and I only have a limited time to file a tribunal.

 

I look forward to your response within 7 days.

 

Yours Sincerely

Wesker

[Captain Wesker]

Any comments please? I want to post it tomorrow.