Car auctioned whilst on holiday for PCN

[Guest Happy Contrails]

You need to speak to a parking tickets expert on this.

 

I would go with transferring to a local court if you are confortable making representation in person. You might just prefer to make a written statelemt and file that as your represnentation.

 

Your original post says your driveway was damaged, you can also ask for your builders invoice for the repaid to be remunerated to you. this is settled by the bailiffs liability insurer but the council will need to do this. You only need ask the council to pay you the invoice and any interest if you have filed a claim at court.

 

I do find it rather odd the bailiff used 192.com to trace you and unlilaterally levied on your goods without giving the council an opportunity to re-send a charge certificate to your new address. The bailiff has landed the council a large bill by enforcing a parking ticket knowing you have not received the charge certificate at your current address.

[sutton6344]

It may be best to send a SAR to the council first and get confirmation that everything matches the bailiffs reply to the SAR.

 

Any suggestions ?

[Guest Happy Contrails]

Yes, but keep the letter VERY simple.

[tomtubby]

The car wasn't sold, however I had to pay storage costs to get it back.

 

I have recieved a reply to the SAR, the original statatory declaration went against me and I am now completing an N244 appealing.

 

Am i better to opt to pay the £45 without a hearing or £75 transferred to a local court fees?

 

If this were me, I would not hesitate in paying the increased amount of £75 to go before a District Judge at my local County Court.

 

I have sent you PM.

[sutton6344]

If this were me, I would not hesitate in paying the increased amount of £75 to go before a District Judge at my local County Court.

 

I have sent you PM.

 

 

 

I have sent you an email.

Edited October 30, 2009 by sutton6344
correction

[sutton6344]

I have now recieved replies to SAR's from the bailiff's and the local authority involved and have spoken to Northampton County Court and can confirm the following.

 

Jan 2007 - Moved house.

July 2007 - Recieved PCN's whilst working away despite having residents permit from B&B.

Feb 2008 - PCN's registered with Northampton Court at my previous address.

July 2008 - PCN's re-registered with Northampton Court at my new address.

Sept 2008 - Bailliff's attend boarded up property (not my address).

Jan 2009 - Case reopened, bailiff confirmed with my local council my address and letter allegedly sent.

Jan 2009 - Bailiff confirmed my address with 192.com, bailiff visited property, bailiff confirmed with neighbour I had been on holiday since before Christmas, bailiff organised for my car to be removed.

 

Not really sure what to do next now, if I need to appeal and as there are 3 PCN's then would I need to pay the fee 3 times ?

Edited November 30, 2009 by sutton6344

[Nintendo Pü]

Sept 2008 - Bailliff's attend boarded up property (not my address).

Jan 2009 - Case reopened,

Jan 2009 - Bailiff confirmed my address with 192.com, bailiff visited

 

You should have received a CHARGE CERTIFICATE for each PCN when it was discovered you had a new address, as they did not send you one, enforement action is unlawful

 

Section 66 of the Road Traffic Act 1991:

 

Where a charge certificate has been served on any person and the increased penalty charge provided for in the certificate is not paid before the end of the period of 14 days beginning with the date on which the certificate is served, the authority concerned may, if a county court so orders, recover the increased charge as if it were payable under a county court order

 

Section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978

 

Where an Act authorises or requires any document to be served by post (whether the expression “serve” or the expression “give” or “send” or any other expression is used) then, unless the contrary intention appears, the service is deemed to be effected by properly addressing, pre-paying and posting a letter containing the document and, unless the contrary is proved, to have been effected at the time at which the letter would be delivered in the ordinary course of post.

 

Contrary intention appears because the bailiff found a boarded up house, then sucessfully traced you using 192.com. This Act can be used to decide enforcement action is unlawful and you now have a right to reclaim your car and all your disbursements as suggested in the post above from both the bailiff and council as joint defendants in a civl claim.

Edited November 30, 2009 by Nintendo Pü

[sutton6344]

You should have received a CHARGE CERTIFICATE for each PCN when it was discovered you had a new address, as they did not send you one, enforement action is unlawful

 

 

 

I've just checked the councils SAR and there appears to be a charge certificate dated April 2008 and May 2008. This is obviously between Feb and July when it was registered for my previous and then current address.

 

Contrary intention appears because the bailiff found a boarded up house, then sucessfully traced you using 192.com. This Act can be used to decide enforcement action is unlawful and you now have a right to reclaim your car and all your disbursements as suggested in the post above from both the bailiff and council as joint defendants in a civl claim.

 

 

Why would the bailiff attend the wrong house in September and presumably close the case and then confirm my address with my local council, reopen the case and then confirm with 192.com ?

 

I have also been sent a photo of the windscreen with the 'Visitors Parking Permit' inside my windscreen, there is a note underneath the photo stating "visitor permit not completed with the date and vehicle it was being used in".

 

Am I best now contacting the bailiff and/or the council hoping for a quicker solution and to give them another chance before court ?

Edited November 30, 2009 by sutton6344

[Nintendo Pü]

Contact the council. The bailiff is only the councils contractor.

 

Bailiffs are only interested in money - hence the trace and quickly swiping your car behind your back. It makes the most money for them. They are not interested in procedure because the council is responsible for complying with legal process when administrating parking tickets. A DVLA trace on your car will probably reveal the current keeper is a bailiff or one that is moonlighting as a work-from-home motor trader. There is never any bona-fide auction and its a way to make money via the back-door. Do a DVLA look-up and see if the RK is on the public register of certificated bailiffs.

 

Simple letter to council, tell them how much you want them to pay and set a deadline. No money by deadline then file the N1 at court. Dont be fobbed off with contact the bailiiffs, they are the councils responsibility.

 

Remember, on court paperwork, the council is always addressed as - the mayor and burgesses of the borough of...

[RaeUK]

I'd follow the advice you're getting, Sutton, it sounds pretty good. Why give anyone 'another chance' this has been going on since January! Plenty of chances given...

Good luck.

Rae

[sutton6344]

I'd follow the advice you're getting, Sutton, it sounds pretty good. Why give anyone 'another chance' this has been going on since January! Plenty of chances given...

Good luck.

Rae

 

Yeah fairpoint, I just thought this would be a quicker way of being refunded and if they refuse it's more evidence for me.

 

I was also unsure who to file the case against, the council or the bailiff ?and whether to file a statatory declaration, a N244 or an N1 or even a Form 4 against the bailiff ?

 

PS I got my car back from storage but had to pay storage costs for nearly a month.

[RaeUK]

Lol, I'd forget 'quick' you're about to celebrate this cases first anniversary! What you want is your storage charges back, your over the odds bailiffs charges back and the kudos of giving the b*ggers a bloody nose. Well worth a few more weeks...

Rae

[tomtubby]

SUTTON

 

Your Out of Time Declaration was rejected nearly 6 months ago!!

 

A short while after, I did post advice to immediately file N244's to appeal the refusal.

 

The subject access request is useful but you could have simply telephoned TEC to get them to confirm the address of the warrant. A lot of time has been wasted and there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in taking any action against the council or the bailiff company by way of an N1 Claim as this will be thrown out of court because AT THIS PRESENT TIME the bailiff company have done nothing wrong.

 

The ONLY way of getting all of your money back is to have the warrant of execution REVOKED and this CAN ONLY be done by completing the N244 and in particular as you now have proof that all statutory notices going to your previous address.

 

If the warrant is revoked all action taken under the warrant is then null and void and a copy of the revoking order must be sent to the council and they in turn are responsible for refunding the £1,500 that you have had to pay.

 

I personally would pay the £75 as opposed to the cheaper route of £40. HOWEVER...it is the case that you need to pay this fee for each PCN. This is wrong and has been the subject of much correspondence to MOJ but so far the cost is as stated.

 

If you do pay the cheaper amount the case is heard in your absence at Northampton and you are not permitted to attend. However, IF your application is rejected we are assured that you can pay £75 to appear at court. As stated above it is much better to pay the £75.

 

When paying the £75 we always ask the court to order that the local authority refund this fee if the application is accepted.

 

If you want help in completing the N244 please PM.

[Nintendo Pü]

I have also been sent a photo of the windscreen with the 'Visitors Parking Permit' inside my windscreen, there is a note underneath the photo stating "visitor permit not completed with the date and vehicle it was being used in".

 

Were you handed a PCN, or does that photo show a one fixed to your vehicle?

 

Section 66 of the Road Traffic Act comes to mind.

 

Does the photo show the visitor permit not completed?

[sutton6344]

Were you handed a PCN, or does that photo show a one fixed to your vehicle?

 

Section 66 of the Road Traffic Act comes to mind.

 

Does the photo show the visitor permit not completed?

 

 

The photo shows a PCN on the windscreen with a "Residents visitor parking permit" on the dashboard, even though the date and vehicle registration weren't completed, it does show an expiry date for 9 months in advance.

[tomtubby]

SUTTON

 

Your Out of Time Declaration was rejected nearly 6 months ago!!

 

A short while after, I did post advice to immediately file N244's to appeal the refusal.

 

The subject access request is useful but you could have simply telephoned TEC to get them to confirm the address of the warrant. A lot of time has been wasted and there is NO POINT WHATSOEVER in taking any action against the council or the bailiff company by way of an N1 Claim as this will be thrown out of court because AT THIS PRESENT TIME the bailiff company have done nothing wrong.

 

The ONLY way of getting all of your money back is to have the warrant of execution REVOKED and this CAN ONLY be done by completing the N244 and in particular as you now have proof that all statutory notices going to your previous address.

 

If the warrant is revoked all action taken under the warrant is then null and void and a copy of the revoking order must be sent to the council and they in turn are responsible for refunding the £1,500 that you have had to pay.

 

I personally would pay the £75 as opposed to the cheaper route of £40. HOWEVER...it is the case that you need to pay this fee for each PCN. This is wrong and has been the subject of much correspondence to MOJ but so far the cost is as stated.

 

If you do pay the cheaper amount the case is heard in your absence at Northampton and you are not permitted to attend. However, IF your application is rejected we are assured that you can pay £75 to appear at court. As stated above it is much better to pay the £75.

 

When paying the £75 we always ask the court to order that the local authority refund this fee if the application is accepted.

 

If you want help in completing the N244 please PM.

 

See above

[sutton6344]

Hi Tomtubby I have sent you a PM

[sutton6344]

Thank you to everyone for the help provided especially to TomTubby.

 

It's taken longer than it should have due to emails not arriving at the TEC leading for me to wait for a reply that never came. I also felt a bit intimidated (unecessarily) about appearing in the County Court before a judge.

 

There were 3 PCN's and the cost of the hearing was £80 per PCN, due to cost I applied for one of them to be revoked as the evidence I produced in my defence was identical for all 3.

 

This application was successfull, hopefully common sence will now prevail and I receive a full refund for all 3 PCN's.

[seanamarts]

good news, keep us informed

[brassnecked]

Excellent, but it took 3 years. Why does it not surprise me that the bailiffs were Jacobs?

[sutton6344]

 

Excellent, but it took 3 years. Why does it not surprise me that the bailiffs

were Jacobs?

 

 

I've not got any money back yet lol

[ploddertom]

I've not got any money back yet lol

 

When did you have your hearing & what did the terms of the Order say?

[sutton6344]

When did you have your hearing & what did the terms of the Order

say?

 

 

The hearing was 1st May and the court order stated

 

1. Leave to the defendant to file a statutory declaration out of time setting out the reason for the setting aside of the penalty notice

2. Warrant set aside.

 

The TEC have now confirmed "it is ordered that the order for recoveryof unpaid penalty charge be revoked".

 

I have sent both orders to the local authority and requested full refund plus interest within 14 days.

[Fair-Parking]

The local authority isn't named and that might have a bearing as to whether or not they will hide behind the London Local Authorities and Transport for London Act 2003 to avoid returning your money

[sutton6344]

The local authority is in Cumbria.