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    • Morning dx and thank you for your message.   With regards to your comment about them not needing to produce the deed, the additional directions ordered by the judge included 'a copy of any assignment o the debt or agreement relied upon'  so that is why I thought that point was relevant?
    • Sorry for the long post but I don't want to miss out any relevant information: My wife bought a car from Trade Centre UK and have been having nothing but trouble with it. Unfortunately we paid of the finance used to buy the car as we weren't expecting this much trouble with the car as we we though we would have protection as buying from a dealer. We are wondering if we can still reject the vehicle since the finance plan has been paid off. Timeline is as follows: 13/12/2023 -15/12/2023 Bought car from Trade Centre UK for £10548 £2000 deposit paid on credit card on 13/12/2023 £8548 on finance from Moneybarn (arranged through Trade Centre UK). picked up car on 15/12/2023 Also bought lifetime warranty for £50/month 25/12/2023 Engine Management Light comes on. The AA called out and diagnosed the following error codes: P0133 - Lambda sensor (bank 1, sensor 1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Slow reaction. Error sporadic P0135 - Lambda sensor heat. circ.(bank1,sensor1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Component defective Due to it being Christmas took a few days to get through to them but they booked me in for 28/12/2023 to run their own diagnostics. 28/12/2023 Took car in to Trade Centre so could check the car – They agreed it was the Oxygen Sensor and Booked me in for repair on 30/01/2024. I was told they had no earlier slots, and I would be fine to carry on driving car when I said I was afraid of problem worse. During diagnosing the problem, they reset the Engine Management Light. During drive home light comes back on. 29/12/2023 - 29/01/2024 I carry on driving the car but closer to the date, engine goes to reduced power every now and again – not being a mechanic I presumed that this was due to above fault. 20/01/2024 Not expecting any more problems paid off the finance on the car using personal loan from bank with lower interest rate. 30/01/2024 Trade Centre replace to O2 sensor (They also take it on a roughly 60mile road trip which seems a bit excessive to me – I can’t prove this as something prompted me take a picture of milage when I handed car in but I forgot take one on collection – only remembered next day.) 06/02/2024 Engine goes in reduced power mode again and engine management light comes on – Thinking the Trade centre’s 28 day warranty period was over I booked the car the into local garage for the next day to get problem fixed under the lifetime warranty package. Fault seems to clear after engine was switched off. 07/02/2024 In the Morning, I take it to local garage who say as the light gone off – the warranty company is unlikely to cover the cost of the repair or diagnostics and recommend I contact them when the light comes back on. In the evening the light comes back on and luckily I manage to get it back to the garage just before it shuts for the day. 08/02/2024 The Garage sends me a diagnostics video showing a lot error codes been picked up by their diagnostics machine including codes for Oxygen sensor and Nox Sensors, Accelerator pedal and several more. Video also shows EGR Hose not connected to the intake manifold properly, they believed this was confusing the onboard system as it is unlikely this many sensors would trigger at same the time but they couldn’t be certain until they repaired the hose. 13/02/2024 Finally get the car back as it took a while to get approval and payment for the repairs from the Warranty company. Garage told me to keep an eye the car as errors had cleared with the hose but couldn’t 100% certain that’s what caused the problem. 06/03/2024 Engine management light comes on again. Fed up I go into Trade Centre as I was just around the corner when it happened and asked them how to reject the car or have the problem fixed. They insist that as it’s over 28 days I need to get the car fixed under the warranty package I purchased and they could no longer fix the car as it was over 28 days. When I tried telling them it appeared to be the same or related problem they said they couldn’t help as I hadn’t contacted them earlier. I asked them if they were willing to connect the car to the diagnostics machine and tell me what the problem was, as a goodwill gesture, which he agreed to do and took the car to the back He came back around 30 minutes later and said they took a look at the sensor they replaced previously and there was nothing wrong with it and engine management light went off when they removed the sensor to check it. When I asked what the error code he couldn’t give me an exact fault but the said it one of the problems I told him earlier (Accelerator pedal). I have this visit audio recorded on my phone – I informed the reps I was recording several times. As the light wasn’t on, local garage couldn’t book me for a repair under warranty. 07/03/2024 Light came on so managed to book back into local garage for the 12/03/2024 Whilst waiting to take car into garage, I borrowed a OBD sensor and scanned for errors on the car. This showed the following errors: P11BE – Manufacturer specific code (Google showed this to be NOX sensor) P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow 12/03/2024 Took car to local garage and the confirmed the above errors. This leads me to believe that either Trade Centre UK reps lied and just reset the light or just didn’t check properly (Obviously I am unable to prove this) 22/03/2024 Finally got the car back as according to garage, the warranty company took a long to time to pay for the repairs 28/04/2024 Engine management Light has come back on. Using the borrowed OBD scanner I am getting the following codes: P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow P2138 - Accelerator Position Sensors (G79) / (G185): Implausible Correlation I have not yet booked into a garage as I wanted to see what my rights are in terms of rejecting the car as to me the faults seem related. I can’t keep using taxi or train to get to work every time the car goes into the garage as it is getting very expensive. Am I right in thinking that they have used up their chance to repair when they conducted the repair end of January or when they refused to repair it in February ? If I am still able to reject the vehicle could you point to any sample letters or emails I can use. Thankyou for your advice on my next steps.
    • Ok noted about the screenshot uploads. In terms of screwing up I had one previous ticket that defaulted and ended up in a CCJ from Southend airport because for some reason during COVID I didn't receive their claim form just a notice of default. This hospital ticket was the 2nd ticket that went to CCJ due to a lack of knowledge of the process. Maybe it's easier just to pay them in future I'm thinking though, I don't get them very often anyway
    • Car maker takes a hit from weakening demand and price war in the world's largest electric vehicle market.View the full article
    • please stop posting up unnecessary unnamed screenshot files  you've done it throughout your threads and we have to renamed them. RENAME THE FILE before you upload if its just text information like a defence or a claim history or a link to a previous post  type it here not by an unnamed screenshot attachment  . sorry NM but you've been here dealing with PPC claims since 2021 somehow you always manage to screw up.......or do totally the opposite of std repeated advice on 10'000 of PPC threads here you are your own worst enemy... dx  
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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The New Fuel Protest.


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CAMPAIGN FOR CHEAPER FUEL.

See what you think and pass it on if you agree with it

 

We are hitting 123.9 a litre in some areas now, soon we will be faced with paying 2.00 a ltr.

Philip Hollsworth offered this good idea:

 

This makes MUCH MORE SENSE than the 'don't buy petrol on a certain day campaign that was going around last April or May! The oil companies just laughed at that because they knew we wouldn't continue to hurt ourselves by refusing to buy petrol. It was more of an inconvenience to us than it was a problem for them. BUT, whoever thought of this idea, has come up with a plan that can really work.

 

Please read it and join in!

Now that the oil companies and the OPEC nations have conditioned us to think that the cost of a litre is CHEAP, we need to take aggressive action to teach them that BUYERS control the market place not sellers. With the price of petrol going up more each day, we consumers need to take action. The only way we are going to see the price of petrol come down is if we hit someone in the pocket by not purchasing their Petrol! And we can do that WITHOUT hurting ourselves.

 

Here's the idea:

For the rest of this year DON'T purchase ANY petrol from the two biggest oil companies (which now are one), ESSO and BP.

If they are not selling any petrol, they will be inclined to reduce their prices. If they reduce their prices, the other companies will have to follow suit. But to have an impact we need to reach literally millions of Esso and BP petrol buyers. It's really simple to do!!

 

Now, don't wimp out at this point.…… keep reading and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people!!

I am sending this note to a lot of people. If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300)... and those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) ... and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers! If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each, then 30 million people will have been contacted! If it goes one level further, you guessed it…..THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!!

 

Again, all You have to do is send this to 10 people. That's all, (and not buy at ESSO/BP). How long would all that take?

If each of us sends this email out to ten more people within one day of receipt, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably be contacted within the next 8 days!!! Acting together we can make a difference. If this makes sense to you, please pass this message on.

 

PLEASE HOLD OUT UNTIL THEY LOWER THEIR PRICES TO THE 69p a LITRE RANGE.

 

It's easy to make this happen. Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco, Sainsburys, Morrisons, Jet, etc.

i.e. boycott BP and Esso

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Don't like to be a damp squid, but this was tried in 2000 for just one day, and no one took part.

 

What we really really need, is a Frenchman to organise something.

 

Look at the problems on both sides of the channel created by the fishermen.

 

Todays protest by Welsh lorry drivers was as much use as a chocolate teapot. The police issued every driver with a breach of the piece leaflet and told them they must only use the inside lane and their speeds must not drop below 40mph.

 

So endeth another attempt and I can see Gordon Brown laughing over his cup of coffee (with whisky) at getting yet another one over the general public.

 

These rises are more government policy than fuel companies, remember that the government takes 70% so

when fuel was 50p per ltr Brown got 35p

at 75p - 52p

at £1 - 70p

and now at £125 - 87p

 

so there is greater scope for him to reduce the tax on it than the fuel companies. At present, he is still determined to add another 2p per ltr in October, plus the 70% of that 2p as well.

 

We need something and someone with power like the dustmans strike did. They had no choice than to back down over that.

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Don't like to be a damp squid, but this was tried in 2000 for just one day, and no one took part.

Precisely!

Inconvenience for the motorist. A Hiccup for the oil companies.

What we are talking about, here, is a long term embargo on the two biggest suppliers.

No inconvenience for the motorist. (Plenty of other garages the motorist can use). But a long term embargo on the "big two" will severely damage their profits.

We're not talking a couple of days, here, we're talking weeks or months!

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i used to work at a bp terminal as a contractor

there were bp tankers

mobil tankers

esso tankets

 

and a few more so most of the fule is from the same supplyers

so it wont affect them to much as pardon the french they all p1ss in the same pot

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Couple of things wrong with this ill thought out plan, which by the way has been doing the rounds for many years.

 

1) Esso & BP aren’t the same company to start with. Esso is owned by Exxon Mobil Corp. listed on the NYSE while BP plc is listed on the LSE.

 

2) From your £1/litre, 50.35p goes to the government in excise duty and a further 14.89p is VAT. To sell at 69p/litre the oil companies would require the garage to have a cost price of less than 10p/litre. The open-market price of crude oil is currently around 46p/litre, add the cost of refining and distributing the fuel and a small amount of profit for the service station operators and there’s very little room for any price reductions.

 

3) Esso & BP service stations don't necessarily sell fuel from Esso & BP refineries – it’s as likely to have been bought on the open market or by long term contract and shifted around the world in ships and shifted around the country in tankers and by underground pipes. The diesel in the BP truck you see delivering to the local service station is as likely to have started out in a Shell refinery as in a BP refinery.

 

4) There’s an overall shortage of diesel production in Europe (that’s why diesel prices have been higher than unleaded for the last few years) – any surplus would be quickly bought up on the open market. In the unlikely event that a boycott had any effect on the retail chain the same fuel would just end up in the same vehicles but sold through different garages. Esso and BP would continue to make their profits, as they do now, from extraction and refining.

 

The only way that fuel’s ever going to become much cheaper is if the Government (whichever party) cut their take of excise duty and VAT. If they did that they’d still have to raise the revenue from somewhere, so some other tax would have to go up.

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The only way that fuel’s ever going to become much cheaper is if the Government (whichever party) cut their take of excise duty and VAT. If they did that they’d still have to raise the revenue from somewhere, so some other tax would have to go up.

 

I don't see why they would have to raise anything. Since last year the petrol companies have increased the cost by 8p whereas the governments share has increased by 20p.

 

Using the governments own figures, they could cut the fuel tax (including both here) by 17.3p and still have had an increase above inflation.

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Guest Wild Billy
I don't see why they would have to raise anything. Since last year the petrol companies have increased the cost by 8p whereas the governments share has increased by 20p.

 

Could you share your source please?

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Don't shoot the messenger.

I have merely passed on an Email that I received, as I received it.

 

I have not yet heard a realistic plan to achieve lower prices.

 

I say, chaps, lets not buy any petrol on Thursday. That'll show them!

So we all go out on Wednesday and fill up the tank.

Net result.....Garages are busy on Wednesday and quiet on Thursday.

They've still taken the same amount of money.

What overall effect has it had? None!

 

Of course, we could all cowtow to the powers that be and look forward with excited anticipation to the £2.00 litre. It probably won't be too long, now.

I do not die quietly! From this moment, I WILL NOT drive on to another Esso or BP forecourt until such time as the price is drastically reduced!

 

It might not work or have any effect whatsoever on the pump prices....But then neither has anything else that's been suggested, so far.

 

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I don't think it is an ill thought plan, it's just getting the people to agree, if it didn't work for the one day I can't see it working for months. If I remember correctly it was a one day boycott of BP that was asked for in 2000 and as I drove past the BP station there were about a dozen cars there and yet the Jet station is only about 100 yds further on.

 

A national strike is what we want or find the cleaning company that services Downing St and get them to withdraw their services.

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I gave up a courier delivery business because of expensive fuel to do something else.

Why don't these truckers do that if they don't like it?:confused:

Nobody is owed a living.

 

And I think it's only the government that can/should be targeted in this cause as they are really the only ones who have dictated high prices with their huge cut of duty.

 

Also, I think Council Tax rises of the last 10 years are more scandlous and affect everybody and nobody has a choice.

 

Mine has gone up 400% in 10 years yet fuel has risen some 100% in that time.

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Guest Wild Billy

And I think it's only the government that can/should be targeted in this cause as they are really the only ones who have dictated high prices with their huge cut of duty.

 

The Government are the ONLY ones who have dictated high prices?:? So nothing to do with expanding demand for oil in expanding economies like China and India? Nothing to do with lower production rates? Nothing to do with the dollar being weak so traders are buying up commodities (like oil) instead? Nothing to do with political unrest in some oil producing countries?

 

Take a look at the history of fuel duty over the past 15 years and tell me it is ONLY the Government which has dictated high prices. Look at how many times it has deferred increases in fuel duty over that time because of oil prices.

 

So, respectfully, based on the facts, I disagree with you.

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Could you share your source please?

 

The AA brings out annual reports on fuel prices, if you google last years price and compare it with this years price, you can do the sums.

 

Last year petrol was 97.38p, this year it is 125p, if you remove the governments 70% tax this makes the cost 29.21p and 37.50p respectively.

If you now take 29.21 from 37.50 that is an increase of 8.29p.

(These aren't exact figures and both tax and vat have been added together to come to the 70%, it's not far off).

 

There is also one other thing that I should have mentioned and that even though we are not part of opec, Brent oil is kept at the same price as that produced by opec.

The government slaps a 50% tax onto the oil companies for every drop they extract from the seabed before it has even come ashore for refining, and then, of course, it adds duty (again) and vat after refinement.

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The AA brings out annual reports on fuel prices, if you google last years price and compare it with this years price, you can do the sums.

 

Last year petrol was 97.38p, this year it is 125p, if you remove the governments 70% tax this makes the cost 29.21p and 37.50p respectively.

If you now take 29.21 from 37.50 that is an increase of 8.29p.

(These aren't exact figures and both tax and vat have been added together to come to the 70%, it's not far off).

 

There is also one other thing that I should have mentioned and that even though we are not part of opec, Brent oil is kept at the same price as that produced by opec.

The government slaps a 50% tax onto the oil companies for every drop they extract from the seabed before it has even come ashore for refining, and then, of course, it adds duty (again) and vat after refinement.

 

Except we dont pay 70 % tax on fuel. What we do pay is 50.3p duty followed by 17.5 % VAT. The duty is a fixed amount so as the price of fuel goes up do to production costs etc the actual amount of tax we pay (as a percentage) goes down.

 

For example:

 

Fuel: 85p/l

VAT: 12.7p

Duty: 50.3p

Total tax: 63p or 74.1 % of the cost of fuel

 

Fuel: 97.4p/l

VAT: 14.5p

Duty: 50.3p

Total tax: 64.8p or 66.5 % of the cost of fuel

 

Fuel: 115p/l

VAT: 17.1p

Duty: 50.3p

Total tax: 67.4p or 58.6 % of the cost of fuel

 

So by the cost of fuel going up from 85p/l to 115p/l the government actually only gets an extra 4.3p/l (of course as Connif point out this is not taking into account any of the taxes they have levied prior to it getting to the pumps)

 

skb

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It doesn't matter what you call it, it is still a tax and has increased year upon year.

The combined 'tax' amounts to a staggering amount:

 

This fuel escalator forced prices up from one of the lowest in Europe to now one of the most expensive. When it was first added, fuel prices rose by 3 pence a litre and tax contributed to 72.8% of the total cost. By 1997 the escalator had added 11.1p to the cost of unleaded petrol and was at 75%. It didn't get any better when the conservatives left office and Gordon Brown took over, as the escalator increased and 3 pence was added per litre. This took tax up to an incredible 81.5% of the total price of fuel.

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Just forward this email, and buy your petrol at Shell, Asda, Tesco, Sainsburys, Morrisons, Jet, etc.

 

Where do Asda, Tesco, Sainsburys and Morrisons get their fuel?

 

I doubt they mine the oil themselves.

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It doesn't matter what you call it, it is still a tax and has increased year upon year.

The combined 'tax' amounts to a staggering amount:

 

This fuel escalator forced prices up from one of the lowest in Europe to now one of the most expensive. When it was first added, fuel prices rose by 3 pence a litre and tax contributed to 72.8% of the total cost. By 1997 the escalator had added 11.1p to the cost of unleaded petrol and was at 75%. It didn't get any better when the conservatives left office and Gordon Brown took over, as the escalator increased and 3 pence was added per litre. This took tax up to an incredible 81.5% of the total price of fuel.

 

Actually Gordi abolished the fuel tax escalator - which was heralded as a good thing when he did it - little did we know that it left him able to do what the hell he wanted to do with fuel tax.

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Actually Gordi abolished the fuel tax escalator - which was heralded as a good thing when he did it - little did we know that it left him able to do what the hell he wanted to do with fuel tax.

 

Not really he didn't, he just called it something else, but your right, it goes up more each year now than before.

 

I see he met with the oil industry today, asking what they could do, cheaky sod, he still wont admit that it is his taxes that have put prices where they are now, just like he wouldn't admit that the abolition of the 10p tax rate was a 100% increase to the lowest earning tax payers.

 

Why wont he see (or is it 'care') that bleeding everyone, especially the trucking business and public transport, is going against everything he is spouting and pushing the cost of everything on the shelf upwards.

 

I don't think bus companies should pay any tax whatsoever on their fuel, (but he is just too gready), and then maybe they would become a viable alternative to the car and people would actually think about using them.

 

The cost of our bus fares is to increase to £2 each way on 1st June, £20 per 5 day week, one hell of a lot of money to someone on minimum wages.

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Yeah, probably right....and THEN did what the hell he liked!

 

I believe you are right, but I do remember the news articles at the time saying "Fuel tax escalator abolished" etc... Found it quite hard to believe even before they fleeced us beyond belief.

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No tax on bus fuel would be a good start - and even the 'environmental' spin machine can't argue that one.

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I got that email too & did what I do with all unsolicited spam - ditched it. It sounds a great idea & helps vent everybody's fury & frustration but in reality it's ill conceived & wouldn't do any good at all. The men making the real profit out of this fiasco are sitting in No.10 & 11. Writing/emailing your MP will kick the powers that be more effectively & another well aimed boot at the next elections will bring the point home much more satisfactorily in the long term. And thank your lucky stars we live in a country where people power does (sometimes!) work....

Any knowledge I possess or advice I proffer is based solely on my experiences in the University of Life. Please make your own assessment of legality, risks & costs before taking any action.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
And thank your lucky stars we live in a country where people power does (sometimes!) work....

 

Worked with the Poll Tax.... people weren't quite as apathetic as the Government were hoping. Unfortunately, it doesn't happen often enough.... but I doubt that the Gov. can put any credible spin on this issue for too long without some kind of revolt, to be honest.

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Where do Asda, Tesco, Sainsburys and Morrisons get their fuel?

 

I doubt they mine the oil themselves.

 

 

Exactly!!!! This is what I was thikking.....they must get it from somewhere - I remember a while back reading something about it coming from Essso but who knows if there is any truth in that!

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They get it from the same tanks. It is usually just bland petrol and the different companies add their mixture of magic stuff to it so increasing the anti-wear, anti-knock etc etc:

 

The supermarkets don't mix much with theirs which is why it is cheaper.

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