Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Thank-you dx, What you have written is certainly helpful to my understanding. The only thing I would say, what I found to be most worrying and led me to start this discussion is, I believe the judge did not merely admonish the defendant in the case in question, but used that point to dismiss the case in the claimants favour. To me, and I don't have your experience or knowledge, that is somewhat troubling. Again, the caveat being that we don't know exactly what went on but I think we can infer the reason for the judgement. Thank-you for your feedback. EDIT: I guess that the case I refer to is only one case and it may never happen again and the strategy not to appeal is still the best strategy even in this event, but I really did find the outcome of that case, not only extremely annoying but also worrying.
    • Indians, traditionally known as avid savers, are now stashing away less money and borrowing more.View the full article
    • the claimant in their WS can refer to whatever previous CC judgements they like, as we do in our WS's, but CC judgements do not set a legal precedence. however, they do often refer to judgements like Bevis, those cases do created a precedence as they were court of appeal rulings. as for if the defendant, prior to the raising of a claim, dobbed themselves in as the driver in writing during any appeal to the PPC, i don't think we've seen one case whereby the claimant referred to such in their WS.. ?? but they certainly typically include said appeal letters in their exhibits. i certainly dont think it's a good idea to 'remind' them of such at the defence stage, even if the defendant did admit such in a written appeal. i would further go as far to say, that could be even more damaging to the whole case than a judge admonishing a defendant for not appealing to the PPC in the 1st place. it sort of blows the defendant out the water before the judge reads anything else. dx  
    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. I'm not sure that I agree the reason why a barrister would say that, only to get new customers, I'm sure he must have had professional experience in this area that qualifies him to make that point. 🙂 In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Is it possible that a PPC (claimant) could refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
    • Well barristers would say that in the hope that motorists would go to them for advice -obviously paid advice.  The problem with appealing is at least twofold. 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver.  And in a lot of cases the last thing the keeper wants when they are also the driver is that the parking company knows that. It makes it so much easier for them as the majority  of Judges do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person for obvious reasons. Often they are not the same person especially when it is a family car where the husband, wife and children are all insured to drive the same car. On top of that  just about every person who has a valid insurance policy is able to drive another person's vehicle. So there are many possibilities and it should be up to the parking company to prove it to some extent.  Most parking company's do not accept appeals under virtually any circumstances. But insist that you carry on and appeal to their so called impartial jury who are often anything but impartial. By turning down that second appeal, many motorists pay up because they don't know enough about PoFA to argue with those decisions which brings us to the second problem. 2] the major parking companies are mostly unscrupulous, lying cheating scrotes. So when you appeal and your reasons look as if they would have merit in Court, they then go about  concocting a Witness Statement to debunk that challenge. We feel that by leaving what we think are the strongest arguments to our Member's Witness Statements, it leaves insufficient time to be thwarted with their lies etc. And when the motorists defence is good enough to win, it should win regardless of when it is first produced.   
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Bailiff enforcement: Setting up a payment arrangement and whether you can pay the court or the council direct


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 3131 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

The bailiff regulations (that came into force on 6th April 2014) provide a simplified fee scale that is the same for arrears of council tax, non domestic rates, local authority issued penalty charge notices and Magistrate court fines.

 

 

How much are the bailiff fees?

 

Compliance Fee: £75

This fee is added to the debt as soon as the account is passed to the enforcement company by either the local authority or the magistrate court and will appear on the Notice of Enforcement. The
‘amount oustanding’
will therefore include the Compliance fee of £75.

Enforcement Fee: £235 (plus 7.5% on amounts exceeding £1,500)

If full payment or a payment arrangement is not agreed during the ‘compliance stage’ the debt is passed to an individual bailiff/enforcement agent. When he makes a personal visit to the property, an ‘enforcement fee’ of £235 also becomes payable.

How is the ‘amount outstanding’ calculated?

 

The new regulations state clearly that the ‘amount outstanding’ includes the amount of the debt from the local authority or the Magistrate Court and the enforcement agent fees (and costs) calculated up until the dtae of payment.

 

 

Making a payment arrangement.

 

After the debt has been passed to the enforcement agency, a Notice of Enforcement will be sent and the ‘amount oustanding’ will include the Compliance fee of £75. The letter (NoE) must state a date and time by which payment (or a payment arrangement) can be set up. This is referred to as the ‘compliance stage’. All companies should be willing to accept a sensible payment arrangement during the ‘compliance stage’ and in most cases; will accept a payment plan over a period of 3 months and in some cases, 6 months. It is worthwhile providing a simple Income & Expenditure with the payment proposal. Due to the strict time frame, payment proposals should be set up either over the phone or by email to the enforcement company.

 

It is at the 'compliance stage' that any 'vulnerable' circumstances should be brought to the attention of the enforcement company and evidence provided.

 

 

Payments made will be split on a ‘pro rata’ basis.

 

As outlined above, once the debt has been passed to an enforcement agent, the ‘amount outstanding’ includes bailiff fees. Of significance is the fact that the regulations state that when a payment is made, it must be split on a ‘pro rata’ basis with the Compliance fee of £75 being deducted first, and the balance split between the debt to the either the local authority or the Magistrate Court (in respect of court fines) and the remaining bailiff fees.

 

 

Making payment direct to the council or the Magistrate Court.

 

As outlined above, once the debt has been passed to the enforcement agency, the ‘amount outstanding’ includes bailiff fees. Following a Notice of Enforcement or a personal visit, some debtors may decide to pay the council or the magistrate court direct in the belief that in doing so, they can avoid paying bailiff fees.

 

In the very early days of the regulations (April 2014) this method of trying to avoid bailiff fees may have worked but now, very rarely (if ever) succeeds. Generally, the local authority will immediately advise the enforcement company that a payment has been received by them, and the enforcement agency will allocate that payment in line with the following example:

 

 

Example of how payments are allocated:

Liability Order/Magistrates Court fine issued for:
£525.

 

Notice of Enforcement sent and with Compliance fee of £75 added, the ‘amount outstanding’ increases to:
£600

 

If full payment or a payment arrangement is not set up during the ‘compliance stage’ the account is referred to the enforcement agent/bailiff for a personal visit to the property. An Enforcement Fee of £235 is added and the ‘amount outstanding’ increases to:
£835

 

Payment is made direct to the local authority/magistrates court of
£525
(being the amount of the Liability Order /or court fine).

 

The Compliance stage fee of
£75
is deducted at source and the balance of
£450
is split on a ‘pro rata’ basis with approximately 70% being allocated towards reducing the debt to the creditor (ie: the local authority or magistrates court) and the remaining 30% allocated towards reducing the bailiff fees.

Can the bailiff take enforcement action to recover 'his fees'?

 

As outlined above, once a warrant has been passed to the enforcement agency, bailiff fees becomes legally due and the ‘amount outstanding’ includes bailiff fees.

 

The enforcement regulations have made it a statutory requirement that all payments should be split on a ‘pro rata’ basis. Accordingly, unless the ‘amount outstanding’ (which includes bailiff fees) is paid in full, the warrant has only been part satisfied and enforcement action can legally continue.

 

It needs to be made clear that paying the local authority or the magistrate court direct does not mean that the warrant has been satisfied. All that it means, is that a part payment has been made against the amount outstanding. It is as simple as that.

 

 

Note:

 

It is important to be aware that with magistrate court fines, if payment is made to the Magistrate Court (either in person or online) after a warrant of control has been issued, all courts now forward the entire payment to the relevant enforcement company so that the enforcement company (and not the court) can deduct their fees in accordance with the ‘pro rata’ provisions as outlined above and allocate the balance towards the court fine.

 

Setting up a payment arrangement and whether you can pay the court or the council direct -------.pdf

 

Before Printing the PDF TIP

 

If you DO NOT wish to print Page 1 (Cover Page) of the PDF, please ensure to do the following:

 

Ensure you go to your Printer Settings and set it to 'Print from Page 2' (this way Page 1 (Cover Page) should not print out).

 

Note: This will save you Ink & Paper

Edited by stu007
PDF Added
Link to post
Share on other sites

To further understand the reason why payments are to be allocated on a 'pro rata' basis it may help to read section 8.3 of the following document which is the Explanatory Memorandum supporting the Taking Control of Goods (Fees) Regulations 2014.

 

This Explanatory Memorandum has been prepared by the Ministry of Justice and laid before Parliament. It is therefore a statutory document and legally binding.

 

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/1/pdfs/uksiem_20140001_en.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites

style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 3131 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...