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    • Thank-you dx, What you have written is certainly helpful to my understanding. The only thing I would say, what I found to be most worrying and led me to start this discussion is, I believe the judge did not merely admonish the defendant in the case in question, but used that point to dismiss the case in the claimants favour. To me, and I don't have your experience or knowledge, that is somewhat troubling. Again, the caveat being that we don't know exactly what went on but I think we can infer the reason for the judgement. Thank-you for your feedback. EDIT: I guess that the case I refer to is only one case and it may never happen again and the strategy not to appeal is still the best strategy even in this event, but I really did find the outcome of that case, not only extremely annoying but also worrying. Let's hope other judges are not quite so narrow minded and don't get fixated on one particular issue as FTMDave alluded to.
    • Indians, traditionally known as avid savers, are now stashing away less money and borrowing more.View the full article
    • the claimant in their WS can refer to whatever previous CC judgements they like, as we do in our WS's, but CC judgements do not set a legal precedence. however, they do often refer to judgements like Bevis, those cases do created a precedence as they were court of appeal rulings. as for if the defendant, prior to the raising of a claim, dobbed themselves in as the driver in writing during any appeal to the PPC, i don't think we've seen one case whereby the claimant referred to such in their WS.. ?? but they certainly typically include said appeal letters in their exhibits. i certainly dont think it's a good idea to 'remind' them of such at the defence stage, even if the defendant did admit such in a written appeal. i would further go as far to say, that could be even more damaging to the whole case than a judge admonishing a defendant for not appealing to the PPC in the 1st place. it sort of blows the defendant out the water before the judge reads anything else. dx  
    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. I'm not sure that I agree the reason why a barrister would say that, only to get new customers, I'm sure he must have had professional experience in this area that qualifies him to make that point. 🙂 In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Is it possible that a PPC (claimant) could refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
    • Well barristers would say that in the hope that motorists would go to them for advice -obviously paid advice.  The problem with appealing is at least twofold. 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver.  And in a lot of cases the last thing the keeper wants when they are also the driver is that the parking company knows that. It makes it so much easier for them as the majority  of Judges do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person for obvious reasons. Often they are not the same person especially when it is a family car where the husband, wife and children are all insured to drive the same car. On top of that  just about every person who has a valid insurance policy is able to drive another person's vehicle. So there are many possibilities and it should be up to the parking company to prove it to some extent.  Most parking company's do not accept appeals under virtually any circumstances. But insist that you carry on and appeal to their so called impartial jury who are often anything but impartial. By turning down that second appeal, many motorists pay up because they don't know enough about PoFA to argue with those decisions which brings us to the second problem. 2] the major parking companies are mostly unscrupulous, lying cheating scrotes. So when you appeal and your reasons look as if they would have merit in Court, they then go about  concocting a Witness Statement to debunk that challenge. We feel that by leaving what we think are the strongest arguments to our Member's Witness Statements, it leaves insufficient time to be thwarted with their lies etc. And when the motorists defence is good enough to win, it should win regardless of when it is first produced.   
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Motor Insurance and the Ombudsman


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I have submitted a complaint to the FOS regarding cancelled motor insurance and the adjudicator seems completely biased towards the insurance company (Royal & SunAlliance).

 

The basic facts are that the company (Broker Network) which owns my broker (Wyndale) moved all its motor business to a branch in Scotland (Denny). When Denny wrote to me about renewal they initially tried to sell me a policy with their 'chosen insurance partner', Norwich Union. This on its own is in breach of FSA regulations (they HAVE to offer an alternative quote).

 

It looked like tyical junk mail, so I ignored it (mainly because I hadn't been told about the new broker and the fact that they were trying to move me away from R&SA, with whom I was quite happy).

 

Denny did write again but by this time I was convinced their letter was junk and ignored it once more. Denny got in touch with R&SA, cancelled my policy and, you might guess, about four months later my wife had an accident in my car.

 

R&SA refused to honour the policy, saying it had been cancelled. I had been paying by DD and had been previously assured by Wyndale that my policy, because it was being paid by DD, would be renewed without me having to do anything.

 

It took a few weeks sifting through all the paperwork but I eventually found the following printed in R&SA's terms and conditions (and they still form a part of them online):

 

"If you pay by direct debit we will renew the policy automatically and continue collecting premiums unless you notify us that you wish to cancel the policy." (my bold emphasis)

 

When I sent a copy of this to R&SA they contacted me, saying they would reinstate the policy. However, this was eleven weeks after the accident and I had had to make alternative arrangements for transport in order to work.

 

R&SA refused to reimburse my additional expenses, which I considered were incurred solely because they had not renewed the policy as indicated in their terms and conditions.

 

I decided to make a complaint to the FOS. This has taken almost 12 months to near completion. However, the assigned adjudicator is totally biased towards R&SA and, if I didn't know better, might expect such a response from R&SA's legal department, not a body which is supposed to be impartial.

 

Essentially, the adjudicator holds me responsible for the policy cancellation because I did not check my bank statements. The fact that I had been lulled into a false sense of security by indications from both Wyndale and R&SA (with promises of automatic renewal) and simply didn't see the need to check anything on my statement doesn't matter to her.

 

As a matter of further interest, a friend of mine had a similar experience about ten years ago when her policy hadn't been renewed automatically and she faced a charge of not producing valid documents when asked to by the police. The FOS found in her favour (even though she admitted ignoring the renewal letter)!

 

The adjudicator seems more interested in protecting insurance companies from claims which might increase premiums (she admits as much) rather than protecting me (a consumer) from their breach of their own terms and conditions.

 

I am preparing a formal complaint against the adjudicator. Does anyone have any comments they can make as to the best course of action? Or has anyone had similar experiences?

 

Chris

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Guest Old_andrew2018

I think you are doing the right thing, the adjudicator should be impartial and we as members of the public have a right to expect it.

I also expect FOS have a process to be followed when they investigate claims against any of their staff.

You could also write to your Member of Parliament, I am sure they will help after all they must be bored to tears during their 77 day recess.

I must add my post is in support of your action, although I have no experience of the process.

 

Regards

 

Andy

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Many thanks for your comments and encouragement, Andy and Jon.

 

I didn't realise courts could overturn FOS decisions. Can anybody quote examples and/or relevant website links?

 

I'm particularly interested in hearing from anyone who has had their policy reinstated or received compensation when an automtically renewable policy is cancelled by the insurers or broker.

 

Chris

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Courts all to frequently overturn so-called regulators decisions. You simply issue in the civil courts in much the same way that you do a money claim citing the evidence you have already supplied to the FSO

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I have taken 2 matters to the FOS for a buildings insurance claim.

 

Whilst clearly the FOS rulings have been in my favour, the Insurers are playing every possible game not to abide. The FOS are pretty powerless to enforce their own adjudication unless I wait about 9 months for a final decision.

 

In a nutshell, the FOS service sounds fantastic but in reality, it is pretty useless.

 

I suggest you might be better to issue proceedings against your Insurers. However, Courts tend to abide by FOS rulings so having gone through the FOS process, you might now find yourself in tough position in Court.

 

Take it from someone who is now litigating against an Insurer. Fortunately, the FOS rulings have been in our favour.

 

Good luck

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Thanks for the advice.

 

I do realise I may end up in court but I'm hoping a complaint (about the adjudicator) to someone higher up at the FOS will help. Basically, this woman went out of her way to attack every point I made, except those which she didn't have an answer for, which she completely ignored.

 

I suggested she was biased in my original post and acting more like R&SA's defence counsel. Someone else said she might even be an ex-R&SA employee. I wouldn't be surprised by that at all.

 

Just can't quite get my head round how I can be held responsible - in any way - for the insurer failing to renew what they stated (in B&W) would be automatically renewed - unless I cancelled.

 

There's no natural justice in that and I hope a real judge might see that as well...

 

Chris

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Have you thought of calling up the Adjudicator and having a chat with her.

 

This may help you put your concerns to her. I did so in my case.

 

Making a complaint about the Adjudicator I doubt will achieve much and may take another 6 months before you receive a reply. Trust me, the FOS procedure is very slow and tiresome. I strongly suggest you call her. You have nothing to lose by doing so!

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I'm only too well aware of the slow pace the FOS operates; probably the result of the workload imposed on them by our rip-off society. I'm also aware that any further complaint is going to take at least six months.

 

However, I have talked to the adjudicator and she just will not move. Her argument seems to be she is not there to award punitive damages against insurance companies because doing so might drive up premiums. That's a bit like a judge refusing to jail guilty offenders because it will add to the cost of the prison service and end up raising taxes!

 

The adjudicator's analysis of my case is SO one-sided I'm reasonably confident I can call her judgement into doubt. As an example, there was an eleven week delay between the accident and the insurance company finally agreeing to reinstate the policy. As the car wasn't roadworthy I had to make alternative transport arrangements, as I can't work without a car (self-employed photographer).

 

The adjudicator stated that eleven weeks isn't an unreasonable time for a claim to be settled and that, therefore, I wasn't entitled to any costs or compensation.

 

However, I'd taken the car (an X-Type) to a Jaguar dealer quite a few miles away because they had their own bodyshop and provided a free courtesy car. So, I'd probably have had my car repaired in a week and wouldn't have been without one at all. She just didn't take that possibility into account - period.

 

I think a formal complaint is the only way to go whilst I can still show she has been unreasonable. Any dialogue with her would just result in more excuses - and delays.

 

Chris

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Hi Lemon Twist

 

Denny certainly played their part, as did Wyndale, my original broker, who failed to tell me the motor business was being transferred (to Denny).

 

As a result, I treated the Denny letters as junk. This was aided by the fact that Denny's first letter simply invited me to go with 'their chosen motor insurance partner', Norwich Union. There was no mention of renewing the R&SA policy, which added to my belief it was junk. In fact, by not offering an alternative quote, Denny were in breach of FSA regulations.

 

I had the option of complaining about Denny or R&SA. I chose the latter because I couldn't see how they could get out of the fact that their terms & conditions included the bit about DD-paid policies being automatically renewed unless the policy holder cancelled.

 

The adjudicator can't seem to grasp this pretty basic, printed in black & white fact. At least, she's chosen not to grasp it...

 

Chris

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I am currently with the FSO in a complaint about R&SA, the FSO tell me they have a massive backlog at the moment and it may take some time to address my complaint.

They just don't seem to keen to take on complaints agaisnt the R&SA!!

Best of luck

Please remember our troops, fighting and dying in our name. God protect them.

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