Wingnutta vs NatWest**WON**

[hedgey06]

I'd be inclined to say that for £2........... leave it for cobbetts to pick up on!!!! However, if you really do want to be completely spot on, you could ask the court if you could re-submit your schedule of charges - phone them tomorrow and ask (copy to cobbetts if they agree). They may want you to fill in an amendment form to do so though (but for £2, they'd be splitting hairs!)

[Michael Browne]

Its only a matter of £2 in their favour but i guess they can manipulate that mistake... question is - what do i do now????..

Nothing, it's a tiny error and in their favour. Don't worry about it.

[wingnutta]

ok, i will take the advice and sit tight. Thanku very much for settling my nerves. Was just worried that they can render my claim void as there is a minor mistake. Thanks again.

Now i have the paperwork back to the original figures i sent to natwest, shall i send the letter stickied by ed to the court along with another copy of the charges to cobbetts or not??? Am i doing anything wrong by not responding to cobbetts per the cpr18 request???

[hedgey06]

You're not doing anything wrong - you only have to respond to the CPR18 if the courts order you to do so.

 

If you do want to respond, send them the letter along with another copy of your schedule of charges - plus the letter to the court re: CPR18.

 

Don't worry, you'll be fine!

[wingnutta]

excellent - thanku all very very much.

[hedgey06]

Keep at them mate........... you're doing a grand job! x;)

[wingnutta]

ok, firstly hope everyone is well.. its been a couple of weeks and i have heard nothing till tody. I received a letter from my county court at hitchin where my case has been transferred to with the following statement:

 

"Upon reading the court file

 

It is ordered that

 

1. The claim be stayed as it makes no serious attempt to comply with CPR16.4(1) by setting out a concise statement of the facts.(stylised particulars do not constitute compliance.) The claimant must amend or substitute the particulars of the claim by setting out the case and by including details of the charges complained of, how they are calculated and in what circumstances they wer incurred. The claimant should note that sending copy correspondence and/or copies of bank statements will not suffice.

Claiment has until 4pm 25th july 2007 to comply with this order. In default the claim be struck out without further notice."

 

johnee had same problem here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/abbey-bank/103207-cpr-16-4-1-a.html?highlight=concise+statement

 

No solution there though.

 

Please help as i too am getting quite down beat about this - i dont mind the work to put in, i am just fed up with being given the runaround really . After the cpr 18 request i sent another copy of my charges apreadsheet to both the court and cobblers along with a letter about as its small claims no need for cpr part 18 etcc.. (the one by ed).

 

What is the judge (Judge Willers) asking for????... Help!!!

[Parkvale]

wingnutta, This is what the judge has ordered you to comply with,

16.4 (1)Particulars of claim must include –

(a)a concise statement of the facts on which the claimant relies;

(b)if the claimant is seeking interest, a statement to that effect and the details set out in paragraph (2);

©if the claimant is seeking aggravated damages or exemplary damages , a statement to that effect and his grounds for claiming them;

(d)if the claimant is seeking provisional damages, a statement to that effect and his grounds for claiming them; and

(e)such other matters as may be set out in a practice direction.

So what have you submitted in your POC ? Obviously c, d, & e do not apply. So the problem is with your POC. Can you post it on the site so we can have a look ?

[wingnutta]

ah ok - i did mine on MCOL so i think there lies the problem. I used the template for it from this site but i guess the judge wants more, Below is what i put in my POC online:

 

Particulars of claim 9/5/2007

 

1.The Claimant has 2 accounts xxxxxxx / xxxxxxx with the Defendant, opened Nov 2000 2.Since xx/xx/xx the defendant debited charges and interest in respect of purported breaches of contract. 3.Defendant is aware of all details as a list of charges has already been supplied. Another copy will be sent. 4.Claimant contends:(a) The charges exceed the Defendant's losses caused by the breaches;(b) The Term permitting the Defendant to levy such charges is unenforceable under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999, Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and at Common Law. 5.Claimant claims:(a)return of the amounts debited of £1092;(b)Interest per S.69 County Courts Act 1984 of 8% - £304.68 (29/03/01 - 09/05/07)continuing at 8% until judgment or settlement at a daily rate of £0.30; 6.Alternatively,if the charges are a fee for a service, then they must be reasonable under S.15 of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982. 7.Costs allowed by the Court.

How do i change this then????

[Parkvale]

Just to be on the safe side i shall get a mod to advise. We must get your reply exactly right.

[wingnutta]

ok.. thankyou VERY much

[steven4064]

Wingnutta

 

I think you are right - MCOL is the problem - I have seen several like this and worse. Some have had threats to strike out their claim. The MCOL form just doesn't have enough space to put in everything you need.

 

What you need to do is to produce a new PoC based on the one for an N1 in the templates library. Ring the court and ask whether you can just send it in or whether you need to fill in (and pay for) a N244 as well.

 

(PS for any mod that is watching - as this sort of problem is quite common shouldn't we be advising people to use the N1 route rather than MCOL?)

 

[Parkvale]

I agree with steven, but let a mod have a look before you commit yourself.

[alanfromderby]

You will need to issue a revised particulars of claim, along the lines of those on the N1 template. This will need to be done on an N244, and you will need to provide the court with three copies - one which will be forwarded by the court to the banks solicitors.

 

The judge has also asked for a full list of the charges incurred, and the reason why they were incurred - this is basically the description on the statement (again three copies). He has specifically said he does not want the statements - he wants a list of the charges.

[steven4064]

Hi Alan (from derby that is)

 

N255? is inflation really high in Derby?

 

Steven

 

If this post is helpful, please click the scales

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability.

Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site

[Parkvale]

There you are Wingnutta. Onwards and upwards. Good luck. i think as steven has noticed it is an N244 http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/41901-form-n244-application-notice.html Not an N255 which is default costs certificate.

[hedgey06]

This thead should be helpful for the amendment wingnutta The "Claim Too vague" defence and guide to amending a claim

 

Best of luck

[HSBCrusher]

 

(PS for any mod that is watching - as this sort of problem is quite common shouldn't we be advising people to use the N1 route rather than MCOL?)

 

 

YES

[hagenuk]

You must refile your claim using an N1 form and the Particulars of Claim from the library.

 

There is no reason to be downbeat about this. Simply file an N1 at the court where you got that order with new Particulars on it.

[wingnutta]

ok, thats sounds great and i really appreciate all the help!! Just to get this absolutely right - i will ring the court tomorrow and see of they just want a new set of POC's, but if they want it officially am i right in saying that i fill in a N244 form BASED on the N1 form (i know about the £35 fee) or do i send a N1 form ALONG with the N244 aswell??? ( 3 copies of each aswell! ). Really cant stress the gratitude for helping me out on this - thanks again all!

[steven4064]

Yes you send a form N1 with the N244. The court may allow you to just submit a revised PoC since it is response to their order. The revised PoC will be the same in either case. 3 copies either way as well.

 

Ring them and ask as you suggested above.

 

Steven

 

If this post is helpful, please click the scales

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability.

Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site

[alanfromderby]

I have now received further advice on this, and actually you don't even need a form N244, as the judge has asked you to amend the claim - therefore you od not need to get permission to do so.

 

On that basis you simply need to submit an amended particulars, along with the other information, to the court and the defendant.

[steven4064]

Alan

 

That's useful clarification.

 

Steven

 

If this post is helpful, please click the scales

Any opinions are without prejudice & without liability.

Almost everything I know concerning the law I learned from this site

[wingnutta]

ok thats great, i will use the not-cut-down version of the POC in the template part and send it off immediately. Is it my responsibility to send it to cobblers or do i still send 3 copies to the court???

[hagenuk]

So post #69 is invisible to all but me then?