IR - Wrong name on Small Claims Form

[AnimalMagic]

I have a small claims from the IR which is addressed to a different first name, same surname. Does this make it invalid? Can I just respond with 'no such person?'

[MondeoST24]

Is it definitely small claims court form, usually tax matters are magistrates court summons?

[AnimalMagic]

Definately small claims

[MondeoST24]

If you just ignore it it will progress to judgement, then warrant of execution, ultimately the bailiff will come but he can only touch propery belonging to the defendant, you could just say no-one here by that name and there wouldn't be much he could do.

 

Sooner or later though they will probably realise the mistake and re-serve you, is it worth the hassle? How much is the claim?

[AnimalMagic]

Can one claim compensation from the IR if one can show a loss due to their incompetence? I had heard somewhere that they were protected from compensation claims...

[BANKRIPOFF77]

I'm currently involved in a dispute with them. I've withheld tax payments due to them whilst my dispute for compensation is running through their Adjudicator. However, they wouldn't wait for this to be concluded and have just issued a summons to me - after threatening me with bailiff's and distraint for the last year. This stopped when I told them I would issue an injunction to prevent distraint - but they changed tactic and issued the summons, arguing that sums theoretically due to them should be paid in any event - I disagree on the grounds of equal treatment. I am going to fight this all the way; there may also be human rights issues.

What is interesting is that I have already been successful in claiming costs etc from the Customs and Excise for previously wasting my time and other reasons at the rate of £54 per hour. Now that the Customs are part of the IR, I am claiming that I am entitled to the same as a precedent was set previously and that as the two departments are amalgamated, then I am entitled to the same treatment. I will keep you posted with interest. Perhaps another forum should be set up?

[AnimalMagic]

This may be straying away from the original intent of this website, but you do have an NHS forum... I wondered if an Inland Revenue forum would be useful. I have been treated appallingly by these people and almost everyone I know has a sob* story regarding the IR. If you think that dealing with the banks is a brick wall you should try the IR!

 

 

*SOB - Son of a Bitch? :D

[smogz45]

I`d second that for a IR forum. I'm about to deal with them over my £2600 tax bill (which I'm going to post about) and I know lots of people have had dealings with in the past.

[AnimalMagic]

I seem to remember there is a law somewhere that basically says you cannot be taxed if you have no income. Anyone point me to this?

 

I've checked the Human Rights Act and it's not there...

[bram stoker]

Please explain further. If you have no income then you won't be taxed is what I see, but you may need to clarify what you mean.

[AnimalMagic]

Two situations:

 

1. I informed the IR that I had no income, but they kept sending Self Assessment forms. They then got a default CCJ against me for assessed tax (I didn't get the court papers). We then had a meeting in which they agreed I owed no tax (I have this in writing), but wanted me to pay for their prosecution of me!

 

2. At the meeting it was agreed that I shouldn't have to fillout self assessment forms (I don't have this in writing) and subsequently I didn't receive any. I then started getting threats of further prosecution because I wasn't filling out the SA forms. They got another default CCJ against me (again I didn't get the court papers).

 

I complained to the area director, who wrote back claiming I had been sent forms, but had not returned them. Soon afterwards I received a letter from the IR saying they NOW believed I should be filling out SA forms...

 

Anyway I'm in the process of applying to get both these set aside, so I was looking for the legislation or something that says you can't be taxed on no income as part of defence.

[bram stoker]

To my knowledge if a SA return has been raised it must be completed and returned even if it states nil income. The SA was raised because HMRC thought you might have had taxable income (or someone didn't tick a box), and you should have effectively returned it stating that there was no income liable to tax, or state any employed earnings and tax deducted at source.

 

Once the system has raised the SA, it needs some kind of respone, i.e. the filed signed return.

 

I am not aware of the legislation that states you can't be taxed on no income, but there is plenty of it stating that income that you have received is taxable, and the rules governing it.

 

Sorry if that's not much help.

[AnimalMagic]

Thanks oh daughter of dracula

 

Sorry been tied up in court case so haven't been back for a while to say thanks...

 

I'm about to go to court on Mon over this issue. The IR have said they won't oppose the set aside.

 

To reiterate, I had a 5 year period in which I had no income. After the first CCJ, I had a meeting with the IR in which I was told I didn't have to fill out any more SA forms. Subsequently, they got another CCJ for tax owing when they knew I had no income, claiming I did have to fill out the forms. Last year I returned to work and submitted a tax return.

 

I have been trying to establish exactly the requirements for filling out a tax return. Last week I asked the IR to state why they felt I must fill out a tax return. This week I received a letter - unsigned - from the IR saying they have looked at my last Tax Return and that I no longer have to fill out tax returns!

 

So they feel I must fill out income tax returns when I have no income, but I don't have to when I do have income? Give me strength!

[dori2o]

There is a criteria list that if people match they have to complete a tax return. However, HMRC can request a tax return from anyione at any time.

 

If the tax return is issued, the individual that it is issued to has a legal obligation to complete the tax return and send it back before the due dates.

[AnimalMagic]

Are you able to point to the specific legislation for this?

[dori2o]

Will find it for you when I go into work tomorrow. but it's the same advice we give to all taxpayers who call up with the same query.

[AnimalMagic]

Dori2o,

 

Are you an IR employee then?

[robbond55]

HI there. I can confirm that the case is if an SA return is issued, as it is a Crown document it has to be returned. I can confirm this as a IR employee that it is the law.

[AnimalMagic]

So quote the legislation... ?

[make them aktiv runners]

Taxes Management Act 1970

[AnimalMagic]

The Taxes Management Act 1970 specifically states that a declaration of no income is sufficient. Where does it say that a SA must be returned?

[dori2o]

Try reading the front of the tax return. It clearly states

This Notice requires you, by law, to send us a Tax Return containing details of your income and capital gains, together with any documents asked for, for the year 6 April 2006 to 5 April 2007

.

It is sufficient to declare no income, if you have no income, but to declare no income under Self Assessment you have to file the issued return, simply by signing it at the decleration and returning it.

 

 

Were you by any chance self employed as a contractor under the CIS scheme prior to the period where you had no income.

[AnimalMagic]

What the IR claims and what the statutes say are not necessarily the same. If it is required by law, which specific statute?

 

From what I have read, a declaration is all that is required. I will happily be corrected if you can refer me to the specific statute.

 

I suggest you re-read my postings, esp #3.

 

A data protection request and two subsequent reminders were totally ignored. You people seem to think you can make up your own rules to suit. Have you ever considered the distress you cause your 'customers' (and isn't that the biggest joke...)

[dori2o]

From the Taxes Management Act 1970:

 

2:

(1) For the purpose of establishing the amounts in which a person is chargeable to income tax and capital gains tax for a year of assessment, [and the amount payable by him by way of income tax for that year,] he may be required by a notice given to him by an officer of the board . . .

(a) to make and deliver to the officer, on or before the day mentioned in sub-section (1A) below, a return containing such information as may reasonably be required in pursuance of the notice, and
(b) to deliver with the return such accounts, statements and documents, relating to information contained in the return, as may reasonably be so required. . . .


(2) Every return under this section shall include a declaration by the person making the return to the effect that the return is to the best of his knowledge correct and complete.

[AnimalMagic]

I applied to have a CCJ set aside.

The claimant (IR) issued a letter to me saying they would not oppose it and no money was owing.

I received a letter saying the case was being transfered to my local court.

 

Then I received a judgement saying my application had been refused as I hadn't attended the hearing and having heard representations from the claimant.

I did not receive any notification of any hearing.

 

In addition I understood that the claimant was supposed to supply me with any information prior to a hearing.

 

Can I demand a re-hearing or do I have to pay another fee?