Wrong settlement quote given on PCP.

[axil23]

I bought a car on PCP in May last year but had to sell it September 23.

I went through a finance broker who had told me that when I came to sell my car I would pay the interest on the time kept  + a little extra.

However Santander told me to pay 50% of the finance amount over the term of the loan.

Over 4 years my Interest amount was 16k and their settlement figure is the balance owing on loan plus 8k finance charges for the 2 years. 

Cut a long story short

I had applied under my personal name and the finance was rejected.

Then I reapplied under my business and it was accepted.

I was never advised by my broker that this would be a business loan which doesn't come under any consumer laws and they can charge me what they want. 

I had emails off me asking the broker if I sell the car will I only pay interest to the point of sale + is it 30 days extra that they can charge?

He confirmed it via email that was correct. 

I set up a customer complaint with Santander which was investigated and although it wasn't found in my favour the broker admitted it and it was noted on my file with the following remarks. "The supplying dealership have accepted that you were not made aware of this when you applied as a limited company so they have authorised a lower settlement figure based on a private individual."

I did not end up selling that time as I lost the customer due to the time this took (almost 2-3 months) but I did email Santander CS team and got a reply to say that going forward my settlement figure would be the lower one.  

Called up on the 15th of March for a settlement figure and was quoted the higher amount. The CS rep said that was the discounted figure. Later that day I did my calculations and saw they were charging me 5-6k extra. I then called up the next day and asked for another accurate quote only to be given the same one. 

Called up on the 18th and asked them to look into this as I believed the figure was wrong. Was told that the person in charge was off sick and I can sell the car and pay off the full amount. Any excess would be refunded. Sold my car to a dealer who paid off the finance in full and a week later Santander are still saying the person in charge of my complaint is off sick. 

I need the extra funds.

Is there anything I can do to hurry them along.

Was reading online and it suggested they have 12 days to provide me with a settlement figure.

I know they have done this but it's not accurate and I have made them aware of that. 

Would appreciate your help on this matter CAG team.

I don't want to take any further steps without your guidance. 

Sent an email to Customer services for an update yesterday and had a reply back from them to say that the case is now closed and if I am not happy I should take it up with the FCA. 

[dx100uk]

if satans bank deemed it a private sale the CCA applies

thus you could have VT'd for free and handed the car back owing nothing more.

5 hours ago, axil23 said:

Sold my car to a dealer who paid off the finance

that was a seriously silly thing to do without asking here FIRST.

dx

 

[axil23]

Oh dear.

Never even thought of that.

Although in their final response letter they did say they were unable to uphold my complaint and it was the supplying dealership who have agreed to authorise a lower settlement.

So aren’t they wishing their hands off it and simply declining my complaint. 

Anyway to get them to get my excess money back from them now? 

[dx100uk]

complaint to the FOS?

when did all this happen?

your dates are confusing

dx

[axil23]

May 23 - Bought car

Aug 23 - Decided to sell car but due to Interest applied as a business had to get Santander to investigate via their customer complaints

Sep 23 - Got email confirmation from broker that they would talk to Santander and get lower interest charges applied.

Sep 23 - Got final response letter from Santander to say they were unable to uphold complaint but supplying dealer has authorised lower Interest charges. In the meanwhile the guy interested in my car bought another car. 

Sep 23 - Got email confirmation from Santander that in the future the lower interest costs will be applied if I sell the car. 

March 24 - Sold car and have had to pay the higher Interest charges. 

Santander CS has been nothing but rude and abrupt. All they keep saying is that their computer is never wrong. 

 

[dx100uk]

good within 6mts 

off to the FOS .

dx

 

[axil23]

How accurate does the 6 months need to be? 

11th Sep 23 - Got final response letter and replied with question if the lower rate was applicable if I decide to sell car later

21st Sep 23 - Got reply that it would be applicable if I sold my car in the future

15th of March 24 - contacted Santander for settlement figure which was provided but inaccurate. 

So if we take 6 months from 11th Sep that is 11th of March 24. 

But if we take 6 months from 21st Sep 23 which is when they provided me clarification then that is 21st of March 24. So within 6 months. 

So how exactly do they decide on the 6 months. Also should I issue Santander with a LBA? 

But my main question is - Am I in the right? Can they just simply refuse to refund me the 6k extra. 

Edited March 26 by axil23

[dx100uk]

why not simply start a investigation with the FOS.

they'll soon tell you if its out of time.

though i warn you, unless you are lucky, they are not quick.

dx

[axil23]

They have 6k of mine.

Can I not do any sort of legal case?

I can’t afford for this to take 6-9 months with the FOS.

Is this not something I can take them to MCOL with? 

Spoke with Santander this morning

their stance now is that the adjusted figure given to me last September is correct and even though it’s gone up this time by 3k more it’s still right.

I told her in the meanwhile I have paid £10k in instalment's how can the figure be higher than it was in September but her answer was it just is. 

They just don’t want to listen and investigate this. 

[dx100uk]

ofcourse not

they did you out of VT and got £+£6k they should not have 

contact the FOS.

any court claim against a bank about this is a bit dodgy IMHO.

 

[axil23]

Spoke with a very nice lady at FOS. 

She understood the situation and said the previous case is resolved as they provided a resolution to my last complaint. At that time they agreed via writing to treat my case as a consumer finance and not business. 

Now the FOS are saying that I need to set up a new case that I don't agree with the settlement figure advised. 

I can see the FOS's logic that it should be a new complaint as the previous complaints resolution I agree with.

My complaint now is that I don't agree with the settlement figure provided. 

Just spent 1hr10 mins on the phone with Customer services at Santander and they are flat out refusing to set up a new case. Spoke to 3 people and they all claim it's the same case and they won't set up a new one. 

One of their complaints team even read the redemption figure I was quoted on their system by THEM and said it was "mumbo jumbo" and they have no idea how someone came up with that figure. 

Honestly it seems that the people working there haven't even done year 10 Maths never mind GCSE's. 

Any suggestions on how I can force them to open a new complaint?

Or what my next step should be? 

 

[dx100uk]

start an FOS case then.

[axil23]

I was reading on FOS website that you need to make a complaint first and allow time for a final response letter or 8 weeks. The 6 months on my initial complaint expired on the 11th of March. So technically Santander can just tell the FOS that they won't entertain them as its been over 6 months. 

Secondly it's not the same complaint as I was happy with the offer that they made to me which I have in writing. (is this a legal contract?) That offer was that I would be treated as a Private consumer when I came to sell my car and not a business. 

So now they are refusing to treat me as a private customer so they have broken that contract which I agreed with them at the conclusion of the last complaint. 

As far as I am concerned this is a new customer complaint. 

I want to make sure I get all the boxes ticked so they can't turn me away due to a technicality. 

Since they won't accept my new complaint over the phone I can email and send them a recorded delivery letter to start a new one. Give them 8 weeks to get back to me with a final response. Should I point out that the FOS has asked me to do this? 

What are your thoughts on this dx100uk and others? 

[dx100uk]

yes.

no need for recorded ever. use a 1st class stamp get free proof of posting at any PO counter.

this is the problem with you keep ringing them.

writing ONLY.

as soon as they reject you...off to the FOS.

dx

 

[axil23]

Understood! Thank you for your assistance once again. Drafting them a new complaint today.

Just out of interest if they make an offer to me via email and on their letter head can they back track on it? Or is it legally binding? 

As they have clearly stated that I will be treated as a consumer and not business for interest rate calculations. 

[axil23]

Can anyone advise on the above? Google seems to suggest an email is contractual. So technically they have agreed on email and via letter. 

[dx100uk]

not your problem.

let the FOS sort that out later.

[axil23]

Sent off a written complaint today to Santander customer services. Will keep you posted. 

BTW - I have asked them twice now over 14 days to supply me with a breakdown of what interest they have charged me which they haven't provided. This was over the phone. If I send them a letter is there any legal requirement for them to provide me this? Google suggests they need to provide this within 12 days? 

Obviously they will argue that it's unregulated but I would like this in writing that they are going against their commitment in the final response letter. 

97 Duty to give information.

(1)The creditor under a regulated consumer credit agreement, within the prescribed period after he has received a request to that effect from the debtor, shall give the debtor a statement in the prescribed form indicating, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer, the amount of the payment required to discharge the debtor’s indebtedness under the agreement, together with the prescribed particulars showing how the amount is arrived at.

(2)Subsection (1) does not apply to a request made less than one month after a previous request under that subsection relating to the same agreement was complied with.

A request under subsection (1) need not be in writing unless the agreement is secured on land.

Consumer Credit Act 1974
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/section/97

Edited April 2 by axil23

[dx100uk]

well sent them an SAR a CCA request is no use.

dx

 

[axil23]

Would a SAR show up the interest they have charged me?

Or should I specifically ask for that under a SAR request.

Also noticed there is a more specific DSAR which I can request. Is that better? 

Also CAG team. What are your thoughts on this? 

In the final response letter from Santander it says - 

Quote

"The supplying dealership have accepted that you were not made aware of this when you applied as a limited company so they have authorised a lower settlement figure based on a private individual"

After a full review and investigation into the points you have raised, I am unable to uphold your complaint on this occasion.

"The reason for this is the dealership have confirmed you were provided the correct information at the time as you had applied as a private individual however they have agreed to authorise a lower settlement figure due to the confusion caused"

Shall I serve a SAR request onto the Forza finance too? See what the communication between them and Santander was from my original complaint? 

Will they have to supply me all emails on this matter between them? 

[dx100uk]

Just send our std sar. 

No good to the other lot either as you won't get them. Not your data

Dx

[axil23]

1. You mean what Santander and Forza discuss between them about me is not available via a SAR? 
2. Since it's Forza who misadvised me is it worth setting up a customer complaint with them as they might get in touch with Santander and push them along to do the right thing. ?

BTW...thank you so much for your help on this so far.

You were very helpful in my last thread too and I showed my appreciation then and will do on this too.

I really feel you guys are doing a fantastic job helping out consumers.

[dx100uk]

1... its not 'your' data - its B2B data and might well be covered by confidentiality clauses of either business sadly.

2. cant hurt any.

dx

 

[axil23]

Arghhh.

Just ran across a hurdle.

I bought the car under my company, is it able to make a SAR request? 

They could hold the information under the company name?

The letters came addressed to me c/o of the company

 

Quote

*Please note that a limited company or a representative of a limited company acting on behalf of the company, or other such entity (or its representative acting on its behalf) required to register with Companies House or similar register cannot make a Subject Access Request.

Any information requested for a company would normally constitute a D&B Business Information Report or other similar report, to which normal fees and terms and conditions apply.

If a director, officer or other company representative requests data about him or herself specifically, it may be treated as a SAR.

 

[dx100uk]

did you sign a personal guarantee associated with the car loan?

i bet you did!!