Evans GF vs Lloyds

[evanesco]

We've recieved an AQ today, despite the fact that Lloyds have paid the charges, just not the interst/S.A.R. fee, does this means Lloyds are disputing the interest/S.A.R. fee?

 

Evans. xox

[evanesco]

Just bumping because I need a bit of help with this.

 

Evans. xox

[Guest Mumofthreeboys]

This might sound like a stupid question, but on your N1 did you add a request for interest pursuant to section 69 County Courts Act?

[evanesco]

I used the template, so this was in the value section:

 

Charges £xxx.xx

Overdraft Interest £xxx.xx

Interest under s.69 County Courts Act 1984 £xxx.xx

Court Fee £xx.xx

 

TOTAL £ xx.xx

 

Plus interest pursuant to S.69 County Courts Act 1984 from date of issue to date of judgement/settlement at £xx.xx per day {(enter daily rate here - (CHARGES+OD interest)x 0.00022 = pence per day) }OR at such rate and for such periods as the court deems just.

 

And this in the particulars of claim section:

 

b) Court costs;

 

c) Interest pursuant to section 69 County Courts Act as set out on the attached list of charges or at such rate and for such periods as the court deems just.

 

6. Alternatively, if the charges are a fee for a service, then they must be reasonable under S.15 of the Supply of Goods and Services Act (1982).

 

Evans. xox

 

[Guest Mumofthreeboys]

In that case, I would write to Lloyds and say that you are unable to write to the court informing them your case is settled as they have not paid the full amount i.e. s69 interest.

 

I would also add that you require the outstanding amount within 7 days from the date of your letter.

[evanesco]

In that case, I would write to Lloyds and say that you are unable to write to the court informing them your case is settled as they have not paid the full amount i.e. s69 interest.

 

I would also add that you require the outstanding amount within 7 days from the date of your letter.

 

But, they've obviously pased the case onto their solicitors. What should I do with the AQ?

 

Evans. xox

[evanesco]

Just bumping again...

[Guest Mumofthreeboys]

Do what I said in post #30, but maybe ring them instead of writing. Tell them it will save a lot of time and effort and that they should settle the full amount now.

[evanesco]

They haven't asked me to inform the courts that the case has been settled....

[evanesco]

I've contacted S, C & M by telephone and informed them that Lloyds have actually paid the £440.00 charges and that what they are now defending in court is the charges and S.A.R fee. I was asked to write to S, C & M informing them of this, with details of the charges repaid and outstanding interest now due. Can anyone help compose a letter to send to them?

 

Evans. xox

[evanesco]

Bumping....

[GuidoT]

You can write a letter to Lloyds / SCM but they will probably ignore it, like they do will just about all correspondence.

 

It would be more effective to just carry on with your claim and file the AQ (if you have not done so already) they will pay the balance eventually.

[evanesco]

I don't want to appear rude but S, C & M have specifically asked me to write to them stating what has been paid and the outstanding balance, since as previously said all they are now defending is the interest and S.A.R. fee.

 

If I do complete the AQ, what is the point....

 

Evans. xox

[GuidoT]

You do not appear to be not rude, I would just take no notice of what SCM say, they are full of nonsense and half truths. They just want to put you to more trouble and maybe get you not to file your AQ.

 

File your AQ anyway. The point of completing it is so that you get the balance of your money through continuing with the court process.

[evanesco]

Thanks, I'll get it sorted tomorrow. Do I need to include anything about the fact that Lloyds have already paid the charges?

[evanesco]

Bumping...

[skbuncks]

Hi Evanesco,

 

As you say it looks like you filed your claim just as they were about to offer settlement, the result being lLloyds were a couple of days late in refunding your charges. Its not clear (or im blind) from your thread whether you've sent them the rejection/accept as partial payment letter yet, if you havent then get it in the post. Would be worthwhile stating in your letter that you filed a claim days before their offer so the amount owed now stands at £xxx plus 8% interst at £xxx and fees of £xxx.

You also need to press on with your AQ, a guide for completing it is here

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/11644-allocation-questionnaires-guide-completion.html

 

There is no need at this point to state that a partial settlement has been received as the AQ is merely to determine which 'Track' your case is to be heard in (in your case small claims). You can then write to the court once your AQ has been filed stating that a partial settlement has been received, asking for the letter to be added to your case notes.

 

I think in your case it would be well worthwhile writing to [problem] to brief them on the situation

Something along the lines of

 

Date

Ref#

Claim No.

 

Following our recent telephone converstion I am writing to inform you of the status of my recent litigation with your client (LloydsTSB) with a view to early settlement.

I wrote to lloyds on xxxxx requesting repayment of bank charges debited from my account giving 14 days for a reply. When no reply was forthcoming I submitted a County Court Claim on the xxxxx which was deemed served on xxxxx. On the xxxx I received a letter from Lloyds offering to refund all my charges to the sum of xxxx. Obviously by this point a County Court claim had already been filed resulting in a further cost to myself of xxx in court fees. Additionally as allowed by section 69 of the county courts act (1984) 8 % interest had been added to the claim.

In this instance I believe it is both our best interests to avoid further litigative procedures by reaching early settlement by means of payment of the oustanding amount of the claim (£xxx interest + £xx fees, totalling £xxx).

 

Given the above I would be obliged if you arrange to refund amount of these fees and interest

 

Yours sincerely

 

 

 

skb

[skbuncks]

You can fax SCM on 01273 745356 and save yourself some postage

 

skb

 

 

post edited , potentially libelous

[evanesco]

You are an absolute star!!!

 

Thank you very much, I'll get those 3 things done today.

 

Evans. xox

[evanesco]

Just checked our online banking after sending the letters on Monday, and they've paid the interest & S.A.R. fee................... and the charges again:rolleyes: Don't they read anything? How completely incompetent! I've now got to ring them and tell them they've paid us our charges twice!

 

Anyway, WE WON!!!!

 

Evans. xox

[GuidoT]

Do not tell them they have paid you twice, think of it as payment for all the time you have expended obtaining money that they should not have taken in the first place.

 

If you have a moral issue with this then donate the money to your favourite charity or CAG.

 

 

 

edit by moderator: CAG will not condone posts of this nature. We always strive to take the moral highground and uphold our site reputation of being honest fair and true.

 

thank you.

[evanesco]

Nice work.

 

EDIT

 

Ooooo, I don't know if I'd dare, it would come back and bite me on my butt. Lloyds would take me to court instead!!

 

Evans. xox

[GuidoT]

They can only take you to court if you refuse to pay it back - not sure how you can refuse though given they will just take it anyway, just like the charges.

 

I have seen this happen several times and it has not been picked up by Lloyds.

 

If you want to be safe leave it the money for a month untouched. Think of how difficult they made it for you to get your money back.

 

 

 

edit by moderator: CAG will not condone posts of this nature. We always strive to take the moral highground and uphold our site reputation of being honest fair and true.

 

thank you.

[hagenuk]

I would not recommend that you keep this money under any circumstances.

 

This is money paid under a mistake of fact and Lloyds are entitled to recover it. There is caselaw going back over 160 years, one of the earliest is Kelly v. Solari (1841) 152 E.R. 24 at 26 where Baron Parke stated,

 

"I think that where money is paid to another under the influence of a mistake, that is, upon the supposition that a specific fact is true, which would entitle the other to the money, but which fact is untrue, and the money would not have been paid if it had been known to the payer that it was untrue, an action will lie to recover it back, and it is against conscience to retain it."

 

The law on the recovery of money paid by a banker under a mistake of fact was reviewed by Robert Goff J in the case of Barclays Bank Ltd v. WJ Simms & Cooke (Southern) Ltd & Anor [1980] 1 QB 677.

 

Goff J after a detailed analysis of the law deduced the following principles that:

 

(1) If a person pays money to another under a mistake of fact which causes him to make the payment, he is prima facie entitled to recover it as money paid under a mistake of fact.

 

Notwithstanding the above, if you keep quiet about it you are behaving in exactly the same way as the bank you have just made a claim against for unlawfully removing money that was not theirs to take...

 

You should alert them to the fact that this money has been paid twice and allow them the opportunity to remove it from your account. Put simply, it is not yours.

[evanesco]

While I thank you for the above post, can I just state that nowhere did I say I intended to keep the money. I am well aware of the fact that the money is not mine, but infact the banks. Your post implies that I intended to keep it and I find it deeply offensive that you have implied this. If you read the post before it, I actually said I was contacting the bank to inform them of their incompetence. I also said in the post that followed that I wouldn't dare keep the money as it would, and I quote "come back and bite me on my butt, and Lloyds would end up taking me to court". I can't believe how utterly offended I am right now.