old MBNA loan, was paying equidebt, now cabot have it - help

[Anne59]

I sent the above letter to Cabot. I did not acknowledge the debt and disputed it and asked them to provide evidence. It has taken them well over 60 days to send me this reply:

 

Unfortunately Cabot has not been able to provide you with the requested information within the relevant time period.

 

We shall continue o request the information from the original lender to assist you with your request. In the meantime, we would like to inform you that your account shall remain on hold with the Customer Assurance Department until such time as we can comply with your request.

 

Your credit agreement is currently unenforceable, which means we are not permitted to obtain judgement or decree against you in Court. However, you are still obliged to repay the outstanding balance as confirmed in this letter and therefore we recommend that your contact us as soon as possible to set up a repayment arrangement or continue with your existing payment plan.

 

Blah... blah... usual stuff about where to go for advice...

 

What do I do now?

[andrew1]

I sent the above letter to Cabot. I did not acknowledge the debt and disputed it and asked them to provide evidence. It has taken them well over 60 days to send me this reply:

 

Unfortunately Cabot has not been able to provide you with the requested information within the relevant time period.

 

We shall continue o request the information from the original lender to assist you with your request. In the meantime, we would like to inform you that your account shall remain on hold with the Customer Assurance Department until such time as we can comply with your request.

 

Your credit agreement is currently unenforceable, which means we are not permitted to obtain judgement or decree against you in Court. However, you are still obliged to repay the outstanding balance as confirmed in this letter and therefore we recommend that your contact us as soon as possible to set up a repayment arrangement or continue with your existing payment plan.

 

Blah... blah... usual stuff about where to go for advice...

 

What do I do now?

 

Oh wow, the system still works then

 

Well done. You put them to the test and they failed....Now if you've got any sense you'll take the money you usually paid them and stick it in a tin and keep it out of the way until these feckers come up with the 'enforceable' documentation.

 

What this say's is they cannot, as yet enforce the debt - you may have a moral obligation to pay, but as Cabot have no morals, why should you?

 

However, that said, IF they do come up with it they will come looking for your money and enforce it so you need to keep yourself in a position where you can pay it when/if they do as you do not want to put yourself in a vulnerable position legally. Why not stick the money in an account where it gains interest while you are waiting.

 

These situations are down to self control though and only you will know how much of that you have, so if you prefer to keep paying then that will be your decision, but keep the money aside for as long as it takes. Make sure they are not adding charges for interest or anything else though before doing this, get it in writing too.

 

Hope that helps?

 

A1

[Anne59]

Thank you for replying so quickly... I appreciate it, but...

 

If I still have to pay what's the point? I may as well just keep paying what I was paying Equidebt. They froze the interest and I would hope that Cabot would adhere to the agreement I had with Equidebt? I dispute the amount Cabot say I owe though, which is less that the outstanding figure to Equidebt.

 

Also, just before Equidebt went into liquidation, they made me an offer that if I paid a certain sum of money to them it would clear the debt. It was 20% of the total sum owed, but I just didn't have it. Had I known they were going bust, I would have tried to borrow the money from a friend or something to get this off my back.

 

I wouldn't mind, but I am in this mess because my bank were negligent and my solicitor committed fraud, all of which I can prove. This has been going on for over 6 years now. It's like a huge black cloud hanging over me all of the time. There is no way I can afford to increase payments to Cabot and the rate I was paying Equidebt, it will take me 30 years to repay it all.

[andrew1]

If you can prove fraud, that, I am told, negates all contracts which it was subject to...so I'd look deeper into that if I were you.

 

As for your comments in the first sentence about paying Cabot, then first things first...

 

Whilst it's always a nice thought to rid yourself of debts by thinking there is a way out (and we all do it) there is an underlying moral theme we have on here that we help people with their debt, not trying to help them get out of it....subtle difference, but it would be irresponsible of us to say 'just don't pay'.

 

You could end up in court with a bigger debt than you began with once they'd added legal costs and believe me when I say I know what that means.... so, take your situation and analyse it properly by doing what you are doing asking questions and ensure you cover yourself for any eventuality. The prime one, their ability to enforce the debt...

 

Now, if you are faced with a situation where the lender has abused it's position, or an agent like a debt collection agency is abusing the laws which they use against you, then you are entitled to use those same laws to make sure they abide by the same rules.

 

That's what bought me to take on Cabot in the first place.

 

So, that said, you now have a situation where Cabot are admitting, for the time-being, that they are unable to enforce the debt which is good news for you.

 

Can you say what type of debt this was and when the last payment was made against it as there is a 6yr limitation period on most debt, but that's from the time you last acknowledged the debt..ie. paid..

 

also, why did you dispute the debt and what notice did you provide of that dispute...all this will help make suggestions.

 

Bear in mind these debt collection companies buy debt for as little as 3p in the £ and if they bought Equidebt's portfolio then they may have even paid less than that so there's plenty of scope for negotiating a settlement once they come up with their enforceable documentation. Anything over what they paid is bunce for them...

 

If you are in no position to make any payments, then you are safe from litigation for the time being I'd suggest unless it's secured and that's another ball game altogether. Is this a secured debt on your home for example?

 

I'd go looking into the fraud issue, but it is a difficult situation to pursue....

 

Good luck

 

A1

[Anne59]

Wow... that's a long reply...

 

Just to clarify.... I ended up in a debt situation in the first place because my solicitor committed fraud and my bank were negligent, not Cabot. The two things together although separate incidents put me into debt in the first place. I ended up losing my business and my income because of this.

 

The original loan was with MBNA, who sold the debt to Equidebt. I have always made a payment every month without fail, but only for a regular amount that I can afford. My income as an employee is a third of what it was when I had my business.

 

When I got the initial letter from Cabot out of the blue I wrote to them using the letter on this thread but stated:

Irefer to your letter dated 5th August 2013, the details of which containedtherein are incorrect.

I do not agree with the total amount they say I owe. NOTE: I initially wrote to them on the 5th August and the first reply I received was yesterday 7th November.

The debt was an unsecured loan taken out with MBNA. My last payment to MBNA was in 2007, but my last payment to Equidebt was 13th August 2013; until I received the letter from Cabot out of the blue informing me Equidebt had gone into administration and they were now the owner of the debt.

What really annoys me is the way these companies who loan you the money in the first place, absolve their responsibility and pass the debts on to these sharks. I understand that they expect a certain percentage of loans to default, but why not give the customer the opportunity to clear their debts at pennies in the pound. If you can prove difficulty through no fault of your own I think they should give people a break. I wish the politicians would step up and do something about it.

Anne

[theoldrouge]

who was the original creditor? It would help to identify the likelihood of an agreement turning up and what was the original debt for? eg credit card ,loan etc?To use the word "obliged" is probably rather strong on cabots part,requested would probably be more suitable:wink:

[theoldrouge]

probably best to start your own thread

[andrew1]

who was the original creditor? It would help to identify the likelihood of an agreement turning up and what was the original debt for? eg credit card ,loan etc?To use the word "obliged" is probably rather strong on cabots part,requested would probably be more suitable:wink:

 

That's just been answered, it was MBNA and MBNA had a big fire some years ago and lost a whole swathe of agreements.

 

Let's see if they come up with the agreement first then we'll go onto other things like when MBNA sold the debt and to whom...some went to Cabot with Southern Irish CCA regulation which they tried to enforce in UK courts until the fan club sussed it and brought it to the attention of a Judge..

 

I have copies of the MBNA/cabot sales agreement between them both, but lets see if they come up with the agreement first and we'll take it from there.

 

MBNA were all a part of the dumping of cheap money into the UK credit market by Bank of America creating this debt mountain, so to lose a bit here and there won't exactly break many hearts.

 

Well done.

 

A1

[dx100uk]

own thread created.

 

looks like EQ have cash cowed you for years.

 

i'd send crapbot a CCa request.

[andrew1]

Don't be surprised if you don't get much back from cabot...We found they take just name, address, telephone number and the debt balance - it all gets passed over on a CD to them with little else and to ask for an agreement freaks them out as they had to pay the original creditor to retrieve it. Now my experience is a few years old because I've been sent to different pastures since we hit cabot, but I doubt much has changed - they send out an initial ' we bought the debt' notice (or should have done - did they?) Notice of Assignment they called it. Lets us know if they didn't.

 

They then get on the phone and drive you mad with calls asking you to pay the debt but give little else, so when you ask for a copy of the agreement they are stumped, if you send a DSAR they have to apply to MBNA and they are stumped.

You have to stop the phone calls by going here: (thanks to citizenB.... http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?387367-Harassment-by-Telephone&p=4317586&viewfull=1#post4317586

 

and then sit back and wait....

 

A1

[Anne59]

Thank you so much.... you are so helpful. Cabot are not harassing me by phone as they do not have my phone number.

 

In any event, I never answer any phone call unless I know who's calling me, and even then I wouldn't answer or get into a verbal dialogue with Cabot. Experience has taught me to only deal with any company in writing, which includes banks and building societies! They are all inept... the left hand tells you one thing and the right hand will do another.

 

How long shall I wait for Cabot to come up with a copy of my original agreement and/or proof that they own the debt? What if they never produce it?

 

Anne

[dx100uk]

they have 12+2 working days after you send the cca request.

 

dx

[andrew1]

Well, a debt is always there until they write it off or it's paid off, whatever price they agree with you. All the time it is unenforceable they cannot take action against you but they can still continue to 'ask' you to pay. That's a moral question only you can answer, but they can continue to ask. They may come to you with an offer to settle and again they will try to get you to acknowledge the debt which you want to avoid like the plague. All you can do is choose your words carefully if ever you do write back so as not to fall into acknowledging it.

 

A chum of mine who ran a business had a unique situation where he was given an overdraft of 30k on his account by his bank and he didn't know it until he went in and asked for a 5k loan and they told him about the 30k facility already there. His business needed cash-flow so he took the 30k and used it, but it was unsecured, he had no actual agreement and he fell into trouble. The bank took him to court and got him unwittingly to admit he took the 30k and he said it was more like 20k verbally just as a side comment, but the court took that as acknowledging the debt of 20k and slapped a judgement on him which he is still paying off some 4 yrs later.

 

He had a moral responsibility to pay it back and accepts that, but no legally binding agreement they could have enforced and had I known about it at the time would have sat with him and negotiated some kind of settlement with them - now they can take his home if he doesn't pay it - so be careful. That's all I'm saying.

 

As for how long you wait - well, you could just sit the 6 years out until it is statute barred, but pay so much as one penny or acknowledge the debt and the clock begins all over again. Otherwise, how long's a piece of string?

 

Just sit back and wait or grasp at any opportunity that arises to negotiate a settlement to kill it off. It will always sit on your credit file and be shown as you in default though and that will vanish in 6yrs also.

 

A1