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    • I'm not sure on the best option here, I'm happy to go with Tomlin, however I can afford to pay this one in full if needed and wonder whether I should be trying to get a reduced amount, perhaps in the court hallway before going in? that would require submitting a WS of some sort. What I 'like' (strong word) about TO in this instance, is that it allows me to keep my savings to hand for further accounts needing attention in the near future and I would hope gives me some control over the pcm amount.. I've read a number of TO threads now (fell to sleep at the keyboard last night ) but have a few questions please: - Do I specify the payment arrangement in a TO or the claimant? I'm thinking 20% lump upfront plus 96 months of circa 60 squid. - Who decides repayment amounts if CCJ is granted? if the judge, then do I submit I&E at any point? Given the amount of total debt across all my claims, I need to ensure anything I commit to is future proofed. I wouldn't want all my disposable income sent to this one debt, only to have another one in a month or two.
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    • Few tweaks as the run order was completely messed up and the main point of your defence (reconstituted agreement) pushed to the bottom of the statement.   I, XXXXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim and further to my set aside application dated 1 November 2022. 1.The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts in person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act. 2.  I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimants witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. 3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights.  This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information).  The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 4.  I became aware of original Judgement following a routine credit check on or around 14th September 2020. 5. The alleged letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 was served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018, no effort was made to ascertain my correct address.  I have attached a copy of my tenancy agreement which is marked ‘Appendix 1’ and shows I was residing at a difference address as of 11 December 2018 and was therefore not at the service address at the time the proceedings were served.  I have also attached an email from my solicitors to the Claimants solicitors dated 14 July 2022 which was sent to them requesting that they disclose the trace of evidence they utilised prior to issuing the proceedings against me.  This is marked ‘Appendix 2’. The claimants solicitors did not provide me with these documents. 6. Under The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 a Debt Buyer must undertake all reasonable enquiries to ensure the correct address of a debtor, this can be as simple as a credit file search. The Claimant failed to carry out such basic checks. Subsequently all letters prior to and including ,The Pre action Protocol letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 and the claim form dated 14th February 2020 were all served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018. 7. Upon the discovery of the Judgement debt, I made immediate contact with the Court and the Claimant Solicitors, putting them on notice that I was making investigations in relation to the Judgement debt as it was not familiar to me.  I asked them to provide me with a copy of the original loan agreement but this was not provided to me.   The correspondence to the Claimant Solicitor's is attached and marked ‘Appendix 3’ 8. On (insert date) I successfully made application to set a side the judgment. The claim proceeded to allocation, 9. The claimant failed to comply with the additional directions ordered by District Judge Davis on the 2 February 2024 'The Claim shall be automatically struck out at 4pm on 3 April 2024 unless the Claimant delivers to the Court and to the Defendant the following documents.' None of these documents were received by the court nor the defendant by that date. (insert date you did receive the documents) I then sent a Data Subject Access Request to Barclays but no agreement was provided. Details the timeline of communication between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 4’and the copies of correspondence between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 5’. Remove irrelevant 10.The claimant relies upon and has exhibited a reconstituted version of the alleged agreement. It is again denied that I have ever entered into an agreement with Barclaycard on or around 2000.  It is admitted that I did hold other credit agreements with other creditors and as such should this be a debt that was assigned to Barclaycard from another brand therefore the reconstituted agreement disclosed is invalid being pre April 2007 and not legally enforceable pursuant to HHJ Judge Waksman in Carey v HSBC 2009 EWHC3417.  Details of this are attached and marked ‘Appendix 6’. The original credit agreement must be provided along with any reconstituted version on a modified credit agreement and must contain the names and address of debtor and creditor, agreement number and cancelation clause. 11. Therefore the claimant is put to strict proof to disclose a true executed legible agreement on which its claim relies upon and not mislead the court. 12. It is denied I have ever received a default Notice pursuant to sec 87(1) CCA1974.The claimant is put to strict proof to evidence from the original creditors internal document software the trigger of said notice.  13.   As per CPR 1.4(2)(a) the court encourages parties to cooperate with each other in the conduct of proceedings in order to try and save time and costs for the parties and to also save the time and resources of the court however, despite vast attempts at mediation the claimants have been most unreasonable and have remained unwilling to mediate. 14. Until such time the claimant can comply and disclose a true executed copy of the original assigned agreement they refer to within the particulars of this claim they are not entitled while the default continues, to enforce the agreement pursuant to section 78.6 (a) of the Credit Consumer Act 1974. I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.  I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. Signed                 ………………………………………………….. Name                  XXXX Date                     30 April 2024   Run 3 copies Court /Claimants Sol/File
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Santander SAR information


dazza12
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Hi all,

 

I'm having a bit of a battle with Santander over a number of accounts I've held over many years under their various guises. I've got a Santander current account that I've only had for a few months, an A&L Cashplus account I've had since the mid 1990s (but not accessed for a few years), and a number of various store cards with different companies that have ultimately been taken over by Satan's bank.

 

I put in a SAR about 3 months ago. Santander sent an illegible copy of some T&Cs and a poorly scanned copy of the agreement for one storecard, and a good copy of another agreement but T&Cs that were clearly out of date (it's a Burton account from the early 1990s but Santander are listed as the bank, not 1st Personal Bank who owned it at the time).

 

I let them know on expiry that they'd not supplied sufficient data and that they were in breach of my SAR as they'd not complied in time.

 

Today I got another letter back, with just one agreement (the same one they sent last time) and another copy of the Santander T&Cs. Nothing regarding the accounts that are still open, however they've advised me that they've passed my request onto the banking department.

 

They've stated that there is not a legal requirement to retain data over 6 years, however I've not hinted at this. I believe in one of my replies I stated that they are to supply ALL data they hold on me, but it seems that they've decided that they can interpret this to only supplying data within the 6 years. However, I have them on this as nothing has been sent regarding my Santander current account.

 

I note on here and on MSE Santander normally end up sending the missing data once they get court papers, one of my work colleagues being one of them. I was wondering if anyone who has had success with them could advise how far back they hold data for. I've got a feeling they're using the 6 year advice to get out of supplying any data that would ultimately cost them.

 

Alternatively is it better to send a SAR to Genworth, as it appears that in PPI cases they've been the ones to pay out?

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Yes, Santander are pretty bad at providing Data for SARs.. According to tax and money laundering laws they are supposed to retain data for 5/7 years AFTER the financial relationship has ended.

 

Unfortunately the Information commissioner has told banks they only need to retain data for as "long as is necessary".

 

Presumably they would be relying on reconstructions and witness statements if they were taking you to court for something !.

 

So is the requirement of data for PPI purposes ?

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I'm aiming to use the information for a PPI complaint, however if necessary I do have a number of charges that were incurred as well on several of the accounts. Them and their DCAs made my life hell in the late 90s and early 2000s and it would feel like it was worth it if I manage to get as much as I could back from them.

 

I've SAR'ed a number of banks, all of who I remember having accounts with, and I'm fighting individual battles with them with varying levels of success, but not one of them has been as stubborn as Santander.

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I am not sure how you are going to be able to force Santander to provide this information if it is older than 6 years.. because the Information Commissioner is as I already said.. quite wishy-washy.

 

I will keep my eyes open for any other threads that might advise they have obtained information older than 2007.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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I'm quite happy to fight them (and others) regarding this, but as you say it can be difficult due to the inaction of the ICO.

 

I've only known of one bank to comply with an SAR, this being MBNA (surprisingly). Most of the banks seems to be flouting the law, and get away with it. Meanwhile a small business that makes a genuine error in their DPA responsibilities will get punished and fined. Still a serious offence, but the banks avoid any comeback.

 

We all know that most of them hold data much longer than they say. I have contacts that work for Iron Mountain (a document storage/scanning company) who have indicated that may of their big bank customers have files going back to the first half of the 20th century, some even further back.

 

Are there any plans for a campaign to get the ICO to grow some balls or for the banks to be forced to comply? If there is I'd be happy to be a part of this, arranging letter writing to MPs, getting press interest etc., anything that might help. Despite everything that has happened over the past few years, the bully banks still have the balance of power and they need to be reminded that the laws of the land are in all of or favour, not solely for them.

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I am also fighting with SATAN to get my SAR after being passed form Santander to GE then back to Santander and also MBNA after a slight fight gave me all info back to 1995

 

From what I've seen on both here and other forums, it does sound like MBNA do only hold information back to the mid 1990s. You may get lucky with older information, but it may be worth writing back to them to get them to confirm that data prior to this has been destroyed.

 

Regarding Satan's bank, they tripped up on my request as they failed to send any information regarding my open Santander current account and an Alliance and Leicester cashplus account that's still open. The response that I got from them seemed to indicate that they weren't going to search any further than they already had, but all that's done is spurred me to take them on. Abbey hold information back as far as 1923, and prior to the takeover by Satan the various parts of the bank (Alliance and Leicester, GE Capital etc) were known to retain historical information, so unless they can prove they've done a mass shredding exercise of old data then they're telling porkies.

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Dazza12 I have asked them this.....I am loosing hope.....has anyone chas a successful PPi claim from this bunch?

" Where any previous information or records held have been deleted or disposed of, you have a duty to provide descriptions of the methods used to do so, including dates, reason for deletion, certificates or references confirming details of destruction. Where you are unable to provide such certificates, please provide a declaration, signed by an authorised officer of your company, confirming the dates and methods of destruction of this data.

May I remind you that a lot of banks are also wrongly interpreting the Data Protection Act (DPA) 1998 as a requirement to only disclose six years worth of personal data, and this is also wholly wrong. The DPA clearly states that all information held must be disclosed and it has no correlation to the Limitation act 1980 at all.

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If a PPI claim against Santander refers to a former GE Capital / First Personal / Welbeck account, Satan will refuse to uphold it as GE weren't FSA regulated at the time.

 

However, you then have the option of taking it to FOS. FOS will write back a short while later giving you the underwriter details (normally Genworth). You can then refer the complaint to the underwriter - many people are getting successes via this method.

 

Satan appear to be sticking to their guns, still insisting they hold nothing beyond six years. It looks like I may have to initiate this magic trick of theirs where they suddenly find some data round the back of a filing cabinet once a court claim passes to a hearing date being allocated.

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Hi dazza12 I am just trying to get my SAR... with no hope I have had knock backs and excuses from other banks but persevered and finally got my SAR but with Satan’s bank this is proving more difficult, I am just getting standard knock back after knock back, passed form dept. to dept. I feel like giving up with this one.....?? I have also asked for the underwrites and just been ignored. This is chasing a car loan from Foods of Windsford 1996 GE were the finance house, I know it had PPI I remember the salesman telling me I wouldn't get the car if i didn't take the PPI I was in my early 20's and he took advantage, any ideas?

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