Abbey Letter Sent

[traceyrmj]

id go with...

 

1. contrary to my direct instructions you appear fixated on paying this amount by cheque into an account i no longer have access to, should you choose to take that course of action i will consider the debt unpaid. only upon my receipt of a cheque for the full amount what i am able to bank elsewhere will the matter be settled.

 

2. some details of the charges i am owed by your clients are still msising and i will be issuing county court action against them for non compliance to DPA if the missing 15 months of statements are not made immediatly available to me. i will be ammending my court action to include any and all charges unlawfully applied during that time to my current claim.

 

3. i am happy to accept this sum as a part payment by cheque only but will be persuing your client in court for the remaining £XXX that is made up of interest at 28%. your client applied charges to my account and then charged me interest on them, if those charges were not applied the interest would also not have been applied. the interest therefore is also refundable under your clients current offer of "goodwill"

 

or words to that effect ( just my opinion BTW not a legal proffesional )

[BankFodder]

I haven't read through the entire thread. How much are you claiming? Does their offer satisfy your claim exactly? If it does, then you are bound to accept it and it is too late to amend your claim to include the contractual rate of interest. Even if there is simply an agreement in principle to settle your claim but merely a complication as to the correct calculation then I would say that you could not amend your claim to include contractual interest at this point.

 

I think that it is probably reasonable for you to write to them and say to them that you require to be paid by cheque and that you are not interested in having the money paid into your account -- particularly as you no longer have access to that account. I think also that you can say to them that a delay of two to three weeks is too uncertain and too long. Point out to them that once you have judgement that they will be ordered to pay forthwith.

 

On the matter of contractual rate of interest you consider the tell them that you disagree and that you consider that there is an implied term.

 

I think you can tell them that you note their comments that abbey is not entitled to borrow any money from you and that you are grateful to them for identifying and clarifying the issue between you so succinctly; it is precisely because they have borrowed your money without any entitlement to do so which invokes the implied term of mutuality and which has also caused you to begin a County Court claim to enforce your Right.

 

Finally you could point out to them that if they are in any doubt as to their legal position that they should join you at a full hearing of the matter before a District Judge of the County Court where the entire question can be settled once and for all.

[BankFodder]

By the way, you can also point out to them that the interest calculation continues until settlement or actual judgement. This means that interest calculator to the 22nd of September is not acceptable and that the longer they delay it a great the sum becomes. You can tell them that you will accept interest calculated to the date that they write the cheque.

[jannercobbler]

I am just composing my reply but.

 

I notice that they have not mentioned anything about removing default / status markers from my file, this is clearly asked for in the original court documents.

 

My original claim is

 

5. Accordingly the Claimant claims:

 

a) the return of the amounts debited in respect of charges in the sum of £3,055.54 and any interest charged thereon:

 

b) Court costs;

 

c) Complete removal of All default notices on claimants credit file

 

d) Interest pursuant to section 69 County Courts Act as set out on the attached list of charges or at such rate and for such periods as the court deems just. Could this be used for the contractual rate? i.e. at such a rate the court deems just??

[philip dempster]

Hi , been reading this thread with great interest and was wondering is there any outcome ??

[jannercobbler]

this is the current status as at today. I am currently reviewing my options and formulating my reply.

 

As Abbey have not stateed they will repair my credit record, I feel that I am entitled to alter my claim to include contractual interest.

 

This is due in court in the next 4 weeks and all documents have to be before the courts in just over 2 weeks.

 

My reply will be posted shortly.

[jannercobbler]

Ok this is my speculative reply any views/comments/alterations? before I email / Post this to them?

 

Also am I right that “Without Prejudice” means it can't be used in court?

 

 

“Without Prejudice”

 

Your ref xxx/xxx/xxxxx/xxxxxx/xxxxxxxx.x

 

I am in receipt of your letter dated 22nd September 2006, and note the contents; however the offer does not fully satisfy my claim against your client Abbey National PLC (“Abbey”) and as such is not acceptable.

 

On the matter of contractual interest I disagree with your hypothesis, as I consider that there is an implied term.

 

I have also noted your comments that Abbey is not entitled to borrow any money from me, and I am grateful to you for identifying and clarifying the issue between Abbey and myself so succinctly; it is precisely because Abbey has borrowed my money without any entitlement or consent to do so, which invokes the implied term of mutuality and reciprocity, and has caused me to begin a County Court claim against Abbey to enforce my rights.

 

I will be amending my claim to include Contractual Interest with the Courts, and I will also be requesting through the amendment order that the Courts order Abbey to disclose their true operating costs.

 

I am therefore advising you that my claim is £3,055.54 in charges, £2,628.71 interest at the Unauthorised Contractual Rate of 28.7% plus court costs £220, total £5904.25 as at 24th September 2006.

 

I would like to re-iterate that interest will continue to accrue on the charges at 28.7% until settlement or actual judgement. Therefore the longer Abbey delays the greater the sum will become. I will however accept interest calculated to the date that Abbey write the cheque on condition that the cheque is received by me within 48 hours.

 

Contrary to my direct instructions, Abbey appear fixated on paying any settlement offer by cheque into an account I no longer have access to, should Abbey choose to take that course of action I will consider the debt unpaid. I am within my legal rights to request payment by cheque or any other form of payment that I may so request.

 

I also note that Abbey has as yet not agreed to remove any or all defaults / Status markers from my credit files; this is clearly stated on the issued Court claim and is an integral part of my claim against Abbey.

 

Only upon receipt of cleared funds for the full amount and written confirmation that the defaults / status markers have been removed will the matter be settled, and only then will I inform the Court of the settlement, therefore a delay of two to three weeks is totally unacceptable, also be advised that once I have judgement, Abbey will be ordered to pay forthwith.

 

Should Abbey have any doubt as to the legal position, I invite Abbey to join me at a full hearing of the matter before a District Judge of the xxxxxxxxx County Court on 31st October 2006 at x.xxpm, where the entire question of Abbeys’ true operating costs, the Contractual Interest argument and default / Status marker issues can be settled once and for all.

 

I have also dispatched this offer via registered letter.

[Lula]

Bloody hell Jane!!! thats excellent, I wish i had asked you to write my letterS, who is your DLa Lackey?

[jannercobbler]

hi my name is Paul not Jane? ....lol jannercobbler is a nickname my DLA lacky is Michael Shires and this letter will be in his Inbox when he gets into work on Monday morning, and also on his desk on Tuesday via Registered post.

 

There is only about 4 weeks left till D-Day in court.

 

This is not a fully finished letter as I have been making minor alterations all day.

 

Please feel free to use anything you find useful and please don't forget the scales at the top

 

Paul

[Lula]

LOL Paul, from this istance you looked like a Jane, but i will clean my specs LOL and I think you will find that I know where your scales are LOL, i may end up nicking a few phrases from your wonderful letter, Ihave Paul Denham, but I am not sure that his mother knows he is out this later sometimes bless him

[jannercobbler]

many thanks for the Rep points. It's great when we have a collective that helps each other. I would like to thank everyone that has helped me so far and will keep the thread updated as an when things develop.

 

Paul

[michellej]

Excellent work Paul,...Will be taking a few pointers from your thread,..Never give the contractual interest a thought,..but will see how things develope for you and might pursue that route myself,.Why not you have a great point,..their have taken it,..we want it refunded,..Best Wishes & Luck M.

[jannercobbler]

Ok Letter sent via Email and awaiting Posting via Registered Post in the Morning.

 

Lets see what response I get to this.

 

I decided to remove a counter offer as at no time did they agree to remove the defaults, as can be seen in the letter above I have specifically asked for this in the original claim. and I believe this should happen.

 

So now its waiting time again, the court date is just over 4 weeks away so time is ticking.

 

Paul

[Bev77]

Great work Paul,

 

I may end up using some or all of your letters/wording, it sounds great, well done. I'm actually sorting out my prelim letter to send off first thing tomorrow, after I have *finally* received all my charges breakdown.

 

Just wanted to give you a 'well done, mate'! You really sound like you know what you are doing!

 

Best of luck.

Bev

[jannercobbler]

many thanks for the vote of confidence Bev, wish you luck in your case, please feel free to use what you need from my thread and I hope it helps.

 

Paul

[bish]

Good luck Paul, reading this thread with interest as only just noticed on my statement this month the large hike in interest to 28.7%. This due to me not using this account since june so no money going into it. Back street loan sharks springs to mind. Received a letter from shabby Friday regarding default on not complying with managed down overdraft payments. Prompt reply in the post as to in dispute with account and awaiting defence from shabby to court. Requested stoping all charges and interest on this account until court action resolved, see what their response is, but will keep in mind the CI argument. Nice one.

 

Regards bish.

[jannercobbler]

many thanks Bish, I hope you remembered to state in your claim that you require the REMOVAL of all Defaults / Status markers from your credit file as part of the settlement.

 

I feel this will be the sticking point in my claim.

 

Paul.

[jannercobbler]

I have now amended my claim to include contractual interest and so opened myself up to Abbey turning up at court.

 

This fight will go all the way.

 

Paul

[jannercobbler]

Here's todays letter from our new found friends at DLA

 

 

Please submit your thoughts / suggestions. Would like to get an email back to them today. Everything in Red are my thoughts

 

 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE

 

Dear Sir

 

xxxxxxxxx COUNTY COURT - CLAIM NO: xxxxxxxxx

 

Further to your letter dated 21 September 2006, we respond as follows:

 

Interest

 

The only implied term regarding interest is the statutory one of 8% under s.69 of the County Courts Act 1984. We restate that "mutuality and reciprocity" are not implied terms in a negotiated written contract but are requirements of the equitable right of 'set-off. (I think they need to learn about mutality)

 

In any case, as this higher rate of interest was not included in your particulars of claim you will have to make an application to amend your particulars of claim before the hearing. (So glad they informed me of what to do, oops I have already amended my claim ) We feel that were you to make such an application you would be unsuccessful and it would only succeed in extending these proceedings further. (I have waited 8 months so far and it may be succesful)

 

Default Notices

 

Our client will not remove the notices on your account because they were properly entered when you breached the conditions of your account. Our client is willing to note that the notices are satisfied upon the conclusion of this matter but will oppose the removal of these notices at trial. (The account is in dispute)

 

Payment

 

After inquiries of our client we note that you are currently overdrawn by £xxxx.xx. (This means Abbey have added another £326 of charges, since I begun this action and I have proof of previous Balance and no access to the account.) Our clients collection department is currently holding any action pending the resolution of your claim. (I should hope so, therefore why are they still marking my credit files.) In these circumstances paying you the whole amount by cheque would be a double recovery on your behalf as the above monies are still owing to our client. (Surely it's upto me to decide when I pay it back?)

 

However, our client is willing to offer the following settlement on a without prejudice basis. Refund your bank charges of £3,055.54 and interest at 8% on your claim being £747.85 up to and including the day of settlement being 17 October 2006 and your court fees of £220.00 making a total of £4,023.39. (They're persistant with the 8% interest)

 

Our client offers to pay the money as follows: £xxxx.xx will be paid into your account and the remaining £xxxx.xx will be sent by cheque to your address on 17 October 2006 (this is 14 days prior to going to court (court Bundles due by this date also) therefore the funds won't be clear until at least 23 October) to prevent double recovery and any further proceedings our client will have to bring to recover the £xxxx.xx outstanding on your account

 

In conclusion, therefore, we are offering to you the sum of £4,023.82 and satisfaction notices placed against your existing default notices in full and final settlement of your claim, but of course without any admission of legal liability by Abbey. If you are prepared to agree this, please confirm this to us in writing by signing and returning the additional copy of this letter. (Not likely as Abbey have added more charges and I want them back also )

 

Should you choose to reject this offer our client will pay the monies in the above manner on 17 October 2006. (So tough luck this is what i'm getting anyway like it or not) We will notify the Court of this payment and contest the removal of the default notices and oppose any application you may make for a higher sum of interest. (So will they attend court finally)

 

We believe that this is a fair offer of settlement and will avoid any further expense and time on both our parts. (Thats your opinion not mine)

 

We look forward to hearing from you.

 

Yours faithfully

[jannercobbler]

ok as Abbey have changed Solicitors here is my response to the last letter I received from DLA

 

 

Without Prejudice

 

Ref xxxx.xxxx.xxxx.xxxxx.xx

 

I am in receipt of your letter dated 27th September 2006, and note the contents; however the offer still does not fully satisfy my claim against your client Abbey National PLC (“Abbey”) and as such is not acceptable. However I will accept it as a partial settlement.

 

Interest

 

On the matter of contractual interest I have submitted an application to amend my claim with the Courts. I believe that there is an implied term and as such I am entitled to charge Abbey Contractual Interest on the amount that they have borrowed from me without my authorisation, currently 28.7%. Should Abbey wish to defend this claim then I invite them to attend Court.

 

Default Notices

 

 

Abbey has been submitting wrongful information to the credit reference Agencies as you have clearly stated in your letter which I thank you for being so succinctly, that the Account has been placed on hold pending the outcome of this claim. Therefore satisfied notices are not acceptable, and only complete removal will suffice.

 

Payment

 

I have noted your comments that Abbey currently state that I am overdrawn by £x,xxx,xx

 

According to my records, I have had no access to this account since Late March; I am also in possession of my Annual investor Statement that clearly states an overdrawn balance as at 5th April 2006 of £x,xxx.xx, which is attached, Therefore Abbey have added further charges of £326.62 to my account and as such I will require the reversal of these charges. Should Abbey be unwilling to reverse these charges I will begin a separate action to reclaim them.

 

Conclusion

 

My claim remains £3,055.54 in charges, £2,648.00 interest at the Unauthorised Contractual Rate of 28.7% plus court costs £220, total £5923.54 as at 2nd October 2006.

 

I would like to re-iterate that interest will continue to accrue on the charges at 28.7% until settlement or actual judgement.

 

I have also noted from your letter that you state that Abbey will ‘pay’ the amount they are currently offering whether I accept or not on 17th October 2006. Although, this will be issued via cheque, on this date, I am sure you are aware that this is the date that Court bundles must be submitted, subsequently, therefore I look forward to receiving Abbeys’ calculations and documents as I am sure that Abbey will submit a detailed report of how they arrive at the amounts they charge, and as such, I therefore look forward to receiving this information and all the documents you intend to rely on in defending this claim.

 

As previously stated should Abbey ‘pay’ monies as you have indicated, I will inform the courts of this payment and I will accept this as partial settlement of my claim only. However, I will continue my action for the removal of the default / status markers and for Contractual Interest, and as such you / Abbey will need to submit documents showing you intend to rely on in defending this claim and the calculations for charges prior to the above date.

 

I can assure you that any offer from yourselves or Abbey will only be accepted as partial payment and my action will continue without any conditions attached to it, i.e. full and final, and without liability, should Abbey wish to offer a Settlement without conditions then Please contact me otherwise I look forward to meeting you / Abbey in Court.

 

I have also dispatched this letter via email.

 

Lets see what the new Solicitors say as they have less than 10 days to settle, before Court bundles are due.

 

Paul

[traceyrmj]

they will probs throw the "need tiem to familliarise with the case" rubbish at you but sitk you your guns, unless they apply to court for extra time they will ahve to comply with the original conditions, its not your fault grabbey have changed solis is it?

good luck and lets hope there is a cheque, paid off OD and remnoved default notices in your near future

[jannercobbler]

Well nothing heard from Abbey as of yet or their new Solicitors, Oh well only 6 days to go till Court Bundles need to be in.

 

Paul

[lesser1010]

keep going paul,hopefully you'll hear something before the date that the court bundles have to be in,if not ring them the day before and see if they want to settle.

[karencupit]

Great thread Paul! I've clicked on your scales and will be bookmarking this thread to see how it goes for ya! I'm sure I'll find all the info you include here a big help with the claim I'm about to start against (gr)abbey!

 

Good luck and keep going!

Karen x

[jannercobbler]

Just got the order from the Courts, looks like they have allowed my late amendment to claim Contractual Interest, plus removal of status markers and my request for disclosure of their costs, the good thing is Abbey's Solicitors whoever they are have 5 days to supply Court bundles and 7 days to object to the Amendment I wonder which will come first? or prehaps they will amend their offer now

 

What fun this is.

 

Paul