Advice needed Parking customers only

[laynaxxx]

Hiya, I run a pub with a very small car park right next to a busy hospital & I am really confused about my rights on how to stop the hospital visitors from parking in the pub car park, as they take up the few parking spaces meant for my customers. My business is a dying trade & every month I struggle to make ends meet, so I need to be able to keep those spaces clear for my genuine customers. I have notices displayed saying clamping in operation but as I have never actually carried out the threat they have little effect. I am now worried that the new clamping laws will give them an open invitation to completely abuse the use of a free cark park. I am aware the hospital charges an obscene amount to park in the grounds so I understand why people will try to avoid paying & take a risk on parking in my car park but I simply cannot afford to lose any more customers. I am not totally heartless & if someone is polite enough to pop in & ask if it’s ok to park I do allow them to park there for a short time as long as they put a small donation in a local charity box displayed on the bar. It’s the ones that park there all day without asking or attempting to pop into the pub to purchase anything that I need to be able to stop. Please can someone explain what my rights are rights on stopping them from doing this in the future?

[vax2002]

Who owns the pub and the land that is used for the car park.

If you dont own it outright you have no legal right to invite anyone to park on it in the first place.

Just as I dont have the right to invite you to park on my neighbours drive.

 

Clear that up first.

[raydetinu]

the only clear way would to to fence it off or put a chain across entrance and give genuine customers a key when they pop in to park.

Not convenient, but only way to keep fly parkers out.

[Jamberson]

Is the pub open all day? I know pubs which have barriers which they unlock at opening time. It won't stop unauthorised parking, but should reduce it, as I would think most hospital visitors are daytime, and most pub trade is nighttime.

[laynaxxx]

My brother in law has a 10 year lease on the pub & I am the manager, as it's such a small pub only one member of staff is needed at all times so it would not be easy to keep leaving the bar to let genuine customers in. I was hoping there were some signs I could display warning of action that could be taken for the consistent offenders, I do not want all the hassle of issuing tickets & then trying to recover the fine, I would just simply like to be able to prevent non customers from taking up the few spaces available

[Surfer01]

I don't think there is any issue with getting a tow truck into remove any offending vehicles as long as signs are clearly displayed that unauthorised vehicles will be towed unless the car registration is registered inside the pub. That means whoever parks there needs to enter the pub to register their car if they want to avoid it being towed. You will only need to get one or two cars towed and the word will get around. When they come into the pub to register, ask them what they want to drink. probably won't cost you anything for the tow truck as the issue will then be between the two truck operator and the person that parked illegally.

[Michael Browne]

I don't think there is any issue with getting a tow truck into remove any offending vehicles as long as signs are clearly displayed that unauthorised vehicles will be towed unless the car registration is registered inside the pub. That means whoever parks there needs to enter the pub to register their car if they want to avoid it being towed. You will only need to get one or two cars towed and the word will get around. When they come into the pub to register, ask them what they want to drink. probably won't cost you anything for the tow truck as the issue will then be between the two truck operator and the person that parked illegally.

The Protection of Freedoms Act specifically bans vehicle immobilisation and/or removal without lawful authority

[Surfer01]

The Protection of Freedoms Act specifically bans vehicle immobilisation and/or removal without lawful authority

Thanks for the heads up! BTW surely having a barrier is as good as immobilising a vehicle and this could open a can of worms i.e. if you are in a NHS car park and it is barrier controlled and you want to leave without paying as it is private land and you were invited onto the land?

[queensclose]

you could try complaining to the hospital that their parking system is having an effect on your business. its something they should have considered before introducing it

[Aretnap]

Thanks for the heads up! BTW surely having a barrier is as good as immobilising a vehicle and this could open a can of worms i.e. if you are in a NHS car park and it is barrier controlled and you want to leave without paying as it is private land and you were invited onto the land?

There's an exception to the ban on immobilisation where the immobilisation is by means of a fixed barrier which was present when the vehicle was parked - linky. Intended to allow pay-on-exit car parks to operate, but how long before ex-clampits start running pay-on-exit car parks and impose a £500 "lost ticket fee"?

[raydetinu]

As said above in 3 the only way is a control barrier, no signs will deter, but you can try.

you can ask customers to come in and ask for key to let theselves in and out again, hassle and would probably put people off going there.

Pay on exit( with a token from you) barrier will work, but will have large capital outlay.

[Surfer01]

There's an exception to the ban on immobilisation where the immobilisation is by means of a fixed barrier which was present when the vehicle was parked - linky. Intended to allow pay-on-exit car parks to operate, but how long before ex-clampits start running pay-on-exit car parks and impose a £500 "lost ticket fee"?

 

They would ned pemission from the land owner. Can you imagine the chaos if someone refuses to pay and holds up every one behind them. Supermarkets will soon abandon that idea. Tesco tried it in Kidderminster and they had to abandon the idea.

[vax2002]

Unfortunately these automatic barriers often are self raising on the entry side and work by way of a metal detecting circuit on the floor in front of the barrier .

So clever motorists who feel blocked in just pick good timing, put the car jack on the loop and drive out of the entry barrier, pick the jack up and drive away.

[Steve__M]

The Protection of Freedoms Act specifically bans vehicle immobilisation and/or removal without lawful authority

 

The Act says:

(1)A person commits an offence who, without lawful authority—

(a)immobilises a motor vehicle by the attachment to the vehicle, or a part of it, of an immobilising device, or

(b)moves, or restricts the movement of, such a vehicle by any means,

intending to prevent or inhibit the removal of the vehicle by a person otherwise entitled to remove it.

so I think if you tow the vehicle off your land and onto the nearest piece of road, you are potentially within the law because there is no intent to prevent the removal of the vehicle (I would guess you'd need clear signs warning of the risk).

[laynaxxx]

Some very interesting bits of advice have been given & I'd like to say a big thank you to all of you that have read & commented on my car park problem, I will keep you all informed if anything exciting happens concerning action taken against some of the persistent offenders