freedom pass - caught. How do I get a replacement.

[sailor sam]

I have never heard of TfL settling a Freedom Pass abuse case, they always prosecute in my experience.

 

And so they should. Its basically fraud IMHO.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

[Old-CodJA]

I agree, but that should never prevent anyone from attempting to reach a settlement if they wish to try.

 

The fact is that abuse of Freedom Passes is a serious abuse of trust and TfL and any TOC involved have an absolute right to proceed as defined by law.

 

In my view, we cannot and should not discourage someone from trying to settle, no matter how unlikely that is to succeed. So long as the alleged offender knows how serious it is and the low likelihood of success, it's up to them to do as they see fit.

[sailor sam]

Yes OC, but we must also discourage the miss-use in the first place. I can't help believeing that these people only come on here with their sob stories and begging for a 'get out of jail free card' after being caught. If they aren't caught, then I have no doubt that in most cases, people will continue to use a pass to which they are not entitled to indefinately. Personally I do not agree in the way the scheme is run in the first place as it costs millions to maintain because there is no limits on how many times a person can travel on it.

 

Obtaining 'free' travel by someone who is not entitled to it is no difference in shop lifting in my book. I have no problems in giving my time advising people who have made a genuine mistake or has been hard done by through no fault of their own, but deliberately comitting an offence like this is where I draw the line.

 

I do however, respect you for doing what you do in this forum.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

[Old-CodJA]

That respect is mutual Sailor Sam, I agree wholeheartedly with what you say above.

 

Misuse of the Freedom Pass and the flawed system that runs it is nothing short of outright theft, but I think we have to recognise that the people who come on here looking for advice have, in the main, already been caught so the time for their re-education has already sadly passed.

 

If I were to have to make the decision in such cases I cannot envisage any circumstances in which I could sanction settling out of court.

 

I just say that no-one gets anything they didn't ask for in these cases.

[johnvernon74]

Advice, support and help !! on this site I assumed not judge and jury !!!

[mrdell80]

Hey Guys. Thanks for your advice and guidance.

 

sailor sam - I respect what you say. I would like to drive the point that people like us come here for help, advice about topics that we are not experienced/masters in and look up to you guys for advice.

The incident has happened and we are ashamed about it and probably would never do it again. Getting a criminal record is something everyone would like to avoid. It does have a impact on your confidence, job and immigration matters specially when it takes 5 years for such a record to be spent (thankfully they have realised this and are changing it now). You don't realise the gravity of the mistake you are doing unless you are caught.

 

Old-CodJA - Thanks!

[mrdell80]

I am planning to plead guilty in absence. Since I don't have a job "at the moment" shall I fill in my employment status as "unemployed"? This may change in a couple of weeks time or so. Do I have to make them aware of my changed circumstances then?

 

The form also asks personal information that I am uncomfortably to give like -

home/mobile phone number

NI number

Partners income.

 

Could someone please let me know which of the above is mandatory please?

 

Thanks.

[sailor sam]

Hey Guys. Thanks for your advice and guidance.

 

sailor sam - I respect what you say. I would like to drive the point that people like us come here for help, advice about topics that we are not experienced/masters in and look up to you guys for advice.

The incident has happened and we are ashamed about it and probably would never do it again.

 

I wouldn't use that word in your defence. I would use the word 'definately'.

 

Getting a criminal record is something everyone would like to avoid. It does have a impact on your confidence, job and immigration matters specially when it takes 5 years for such a record to be spent (thankfully they have realised this and are changing it now).

 

This must be good news to asylum seekers who commit offences here.

 

You don't realise the gravity of the mistake you are doing unless you are caught.

 

Old-CodJA - Thanks!

 

Sorry but I don't consider deliberately using some else's pass a 'mistake'.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

[Justice_]

This must be good news to asylum seekers who commit offences here.

 

Yes, it's a shame that these dangerous criminals will be allowed to roam the streets just a year after committing such a heinous act. If only we could give a criminal record to everyone who has downloaded an mp3 or movie illegally; the country would be a much safer place.

[sailor sam]

Yes, it's a shame that these dangerous criminals will be allowed to roam the streets just a year after committing such a heinous act. If only we could give a criminal record to everyone who has downloaded an mp3 or movie illegally; the country would be a much safer place.

 

The offences I was thinking of are a little more serious than that. For example, there seems to be an increase in asylum seekers driving illegaly. I know of at least one case where a child has been killed because of this. At the end of the day, the puishement should fit the crime but as we all know, the justice system in this country is very soft in some cases.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

[mrdell80]

coming back to the question -

 

I am planning to plead guilty in absence. Since I don't have a job "at the moment" shall I fill in my employment status as "unemployed"? This may change in a couple of weeks time or so. Do I have to make them aware of my changed circumstances then?

 

The form also asks personal information that I am uncomfortably to give like -

home/mobile phone number

NI number

Partners income.

 

Could someone please let me know which of the above is mandatory please?

 

Thanks.

[wtlh]

From my understanding and research (having received a summons of this type too): the fields in the form are NOT mandatory. However the more you fill the more potential benefit it may bring to your-self (if you have a low income). It is basically used as an assessment of your income. Things like home/mobile number may be unnecessary to fill, but it does make contacting you easier if they have any questions. They have to verify the correctness of information you provided. So things like NI are quite essential I think. It may also be a good idea to attach your recent pay-slips etc to backup the information stated on the form.

 

At the end of day, if they are not satisfied with the information you provide, they may just slap a standard fine of around £350 (estimated average week's wage), which could be lower if you could show them that you only get, say 100 a week (just an example).

[Old-CodJA]

From my understanding and research (having received a summons of this type too): the fields in the form are NOT mandatory. However the more you fill the more potential benefit it may bring to your-self (if you have a low income). It is basically used as an assessment of your income. Things like home/mobile number may be unnecessary to fill, but it does make contacting you easier if they have any questions. They have to verify the correctness of information you provided. So things like NI are quite essential I think. It may also be a good idea to attach your recent pay-slips etc to backup the information stated on the form.

 

At the end of day, if they are not satisfied with the information you provide, they may just slap a standard fine of around £350 (estimated average week's wage), which could be lower if you could show them that you only get, say 100 a week (just an example).

 

Yes, whilst payslips etc are not mandatory, it is a good idea.

 

The most important thing is to be truthful. If a court find out later that you have deliberately falsified your means in order to get a lower penalty then you could face much more serious punishment.

[mrdell80]

Thanks everyone.

 

I have replied to the summons and given all the information truthfully. I have mentioned that at the moment my income is 0 but gave out my previous salary as well. As I have income on the higher side of the band, I have not provided the salary slips. I have withhold my phone numbers and NI number. I have pleaded guilty and would not be present in court.

 

What happens next? Do i receive a penalty notice and a way to pay it?

 

Thanks.

[Old-CodJA]

The Court office will quite probably request your NI number, because they normally ask for it when setting up any fine account

 

Normally, they will record the conviction and send you a payment demand to be cleared within 28 days.

 

All necessary contact details and instructions will be on that notice

[mrdell80]

update: my wife tried a last attempt to write another apology and hand delivered it to the address. She was lucky to meet a prosecutor there (although this is not a norm) and the prosecutor explained that they are a team of people that they decide as a team. After a couple of days she received a letter from LU, saying that they are still going to the court.

 

It had been more than a couple of weeks and she still hadn't heard from the courts. So she called up the courts to find out the fine and paid it over the phone. But she doesn't have a letter as yet, mentioning what is she convicted for, the fine amount and the date of conviction. Could anyone please help of going about getting the details/copy?

 

Also, in the mean time my wife found a new job and she was suppose to make the disclosures. This was around the court hearing date. So we wrote that she is expecting a fine and a possible conviction for fare evasion. The employer made a basic disclosure check (this was after the hearing date, so i am assuming the conviction must have been recorded). Just last week she got the results from disclosure Scotland that she is clean and there are no convictions. Again, would anyone know what does this mean?

 

Thanks,

[mrdell80]

*bump*. any comments. - Thanks.

[sailor sam]

I'm confused. How can you pay a fine without having the court hearing? Was the case heard in her absence?

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

[Old-CodJA]

That's the only possibility that I can think of, but it's very unusual for any court not to get the notice of fine out by post within a 'couple of weeks' because the usual order is payment within 14 days for proof in absence. .

[mrdell80]

sailor sam, the court hearing was on 22nd March 2012 and my wife pleaded guilty and requested the matter be dealt with in her absence. Since we didn't hear from them we called up the courts to find out and pay the fine.

 

yes Old-CodJA. The people over the phone said that they have sent out the notice. I guess it is just lost in the post.

 

So the question is - she doesn't have a letter, mentioning what is she convicted for, the fine amount and the date of conviction. I guess she would need one for the records, won't she?

 

and the 2nd question - Just last week she got the results from disclosure Scotland that she is clean and there are no convictions. Again, would anyone know what does this mean?

 

Thanks again for your help.

[mrdell80]

* bump again *

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

I'm trying to get you some help on the Disclosure Scotland aspect.

 

As for the letter, have you asked the people who were supposed to have sent it?

 

My best, HB

[caro]

Maybe this link will answer some questions for you Mr Dell. http://www.business.scotland.gov.uk/bdotg/action/layer?site=202&topicId=5001899742

[IdaInFife]

It will dependent on what disclosure was asked for