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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
    • Not sure what to make of that or what it means for me, I was just about to head to my kip and it's a bit too late for legalise. When is the "expenditure occured"?  When they start spending money to write to me?  Or is this a bad thing (as "harsh" would imply)? When all is said and done, I do not have two beans to rub together, we rent our home and EVERYTHING of value has been purchased by and is in my wife's name and we are not financially linked in any way.  So at least if I can't escape my fate I can at least know that they will get sweet FA from me anyway   edit:  ah.. Sophia Harrison: Time bar decision tough on claimants WWW.SCOTTISHLEGAL.COM Time bar is a very complex area of law in Scotland relating to the period in which a claim for breach of duty can be pursued. The Scottish government...   This explains it like I am 5.  So, a good thing then because creditors clearly know they have suffered a loss the minute I stop paying them, this is why it is "harsh" (for them, not me)? Am I understanding this correctly?  
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Lowell Financial/Lowell Portfolio/Capital One


ims21
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Hi All

 

I wonder of I might get some help please.

 

I had a credit card with Capital One and a S87(1) CCA 1974 was issued in March 2008. I have the letter here. I paid a couple of ad hoc payments around that time so I am not suggesting that the debt is time barred at all. I am not trying to get out of what I owe....I just want to make sure I am paying the right amount.

 

Anyhow, I got a letter from Lowell Portfolio in February this year saying that they had purchased my debt from Capital One and in the same envelope was the letter from Cap One saying that they had sold to Lowell.

 

Then I get some letters from Lowell Financil, the last one in Mid March saying that I could pay 75% in F & F if I did it in one go OR I could pay 85% in F & F if I did 3 paymentsOR I could do a monthly direct debit of a fairly small amount until the debt is cleared.

 

I haven't responded to any of these letters by the way.

 

I was wondering why they should make an offer like this if they are sure of the debt. Are they just being kind? (think not). Would they not chase for the whole amount?

 

Anyway, I have gone back through the Cap One statements that I have and there are charges on there which I feel I may be able to claim back. Particularly they are described as "Overlimit fees" of £12 each and "Late Payment Fees" also of £12 each.

 

If, as I have read, I might claim these type of fees back, then my balance will reduce and I can then sort out paying the balance.

 

I was hoping for some advice as to whether these charges qualify to be the subject of a claim. If they are, do I get in touch with the new owner of the debt (Lowell) or do I go back to Capital One?

 

As I say, I don't want to try and evade the debt, I just want to make sure I am paying the right amount.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

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thatds prob why cap1 sold it to the fleecers

 

they know its all charges and thats why lowlife have offered you a discount

 

if you look in the cap1 forum

 

you will see you can reclaim ALL those unlawful fees + the interest they have charged you PCM AT THEIR PURCHASE RATE!!

 

do some reading in the cap1 forum and ignore lowlife.

 

they know they have a lemon.

 

what about PPI?

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi dx

 

Thanks for the heads up.

 

I didn't see the Cap1 forum but I'll have a look there now.

 

Apologies if this thread is in the wrong place....maybe a Mod can move it to the correct place if need be.

 

Thanks

 

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poss if that helps

 

i'll do it now for you

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi dx

 

Thanks for that.

 

There was no PPI charged.

 

In the last couple of mins I had a brainwave as to where all the old statements were and I've found them!!!!

 

Going back to the start.....October 2000!

 

I'm going to have an intersting evening going through them on a spreadsheet to get all the charges listed and Compund Interest at their purchase rate.

 

Do I calculate the interest up to the date of default notice? since then no further charges have been added or do I calculate the interst up to now (say 31st March 2011)?

 

As my claim may go back further than 6 years, will I certainly have to put this through court or might they settle prior to court action?

 

Can't wait to get going on this!

 

Thanks

 

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Hi again

 

I've had an interesting evening going through the old statements and have found a total of £895 between 3/1/01 and 2/4/08. They are described respectively as "Overlimit Fees" and "Late Payment Fees".

 

I'd like to go for the compund interest route and then the 8%.

 

I just hope I've got the compund interest correct with the spreadsheet. the total compund interest comes out to £3,893. The simple interest comes out to £428.

 

The way I worked the compund interest is to take the average of the purchase rate (which comes out to 1.9% per month) and apply that using a formula taken from Microsoft's website to calculate the compund interest to date.

 

I don't know if there is a maths guru here but by way of example, the first charge was on 3/1/01 for £18. 122 months have elapsed and the monthly average rate is 1.9%. I get the answer that the compund interest on that £18 is £178. This would be the interest for some 10 years. Is anyone willing just to check this for me please?

 

So, if it is confirmed that my compound interest calculation is correct then my total claim could be £895 + £3,893 compound + £428 Simple = £5216.

 

This is, I believe, above the limit for small claims. If this is the case, do I just put it to Capital One for the charges plus compound which total to £4,788 and if necessary take action on that sum with an application to the court that if I get judgement I want the simple added on as well.

 

What court route do I take if I have to claim the £5k odd right from the off?

 

Thanks in advance

 

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please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Yep, got that dx. Thank you.

 

Formula works in Excel so I guess it is all OK. Just seemed a big figure to me.

 

Has anyone got thoughts on how to go to court with a claim over £5k please?

 

Cap 1 claim to have sold the debt and Lowell claim to have bought it. Which one should I send my refund request letter to and do I go straight in for the charges plus compound + 8% or just go for the charges plus compound at this stage?

 

Many thanks

 

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I used the calculator here http://www.egalegal.com/compoundWindow.html which is linked to from the site, however in your example the resulting figures are pretty close, so the method you have employed seems it would stand up to scrutiny.

 

When you first request your charges back, you cannot claim the 8% but by all means draw their attention to what the figure is should they not play ball. From the many threads I have followed on cap one, it is pretty clear that they will employ standard tactics when dealing with your request. They will blank you on anything over six years old, and probably end up offering the difference between the charge and £12 on anything else, plus 8%.

 

In order to get anywhere on a claim such as this, you will undoubtedly have to file at court, as I have done (for my g/f).

 

If the claim is over £5k it will get allocated to the fast-track channel at court, at which point costs are possible. However the idea is to get this settled before having to enter a courtroom. You might consider reducing the interest rate a little to get the claim under £5k, but there is always the possibility that your case could get fast-tracked anyway.

 

Hope this helps, im sure others will have opinions too.

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Thank you Still_surviving.

 

I think what I shall do is play with the CI rate to get to just under the £5k mark which would show that I am not being unreasonable in my requests. This would stand me in good stead should court action be the route I have to go.

 

I have read a goddly amount about Cap1 and agree that they will almost certainly baulk at every turn but I'm ready for that.

 

Never Give Up is frame of mind to have I think.

 

I'm off to get my request letter done and will keep the forum posted as to progress.

 

Regards

 

ims

 

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Hi

 

I think I'm about ready to send off my initial request letter. However, there is just one question before I do.

 

The account was defaulted in March 2008 and since then there haven't been any further charges or interest added to the account. For my compund interest, do I stop calculation at the date it was defaulted or do I run the compund interest right up to now. I understand that the 8% simple interest will run until the date of settlement if appropriate but what about the restitutional compound interest please?

 

Thank you

 

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they have benefitted from having your money

 

to date of claim CI

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi

 

Preliminary Letter ready to go...here is the text. I propose sending this recorded delivery. Is this wording correct for a preliminary request? Thank you

Oh, and do I send my SOC with a preliminary letter?

 

Capital One Bank (Europe) plc

Trent House

Station Street

Nottingham

NG2 3HX

 

4 April 2011

 

 

 

Dear Sirs,

 

CREDIT CARD ACCOUNT NUMBER: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 

I consider that the regime of fees which you have been applying to my account in relation to late fees and over limit charges, are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer regulations.

 

I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law.

 

I am frankly shocked that you have operated my account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise as my fiduciary.

 

 

I calculate that you have taken £895.00 plus £3,919.74 which you have charged me in interest for the sums which you have taken. Total £4,814.74.

 

Additionally, you have entered a default notice against my credit record. This default occurred merely in respect of unlawful charges levied by you, or was the result of impecuniosity caused directly by the taking by you of penalty charges which you had applied unlawfully to my account.

 

In addition to full payment of the sum mentioned above, I require that you remove the default entry from the register. Please note that mere correction or amendment to the entry will not be acceptable.

 

I give you 14 days to comply, or else provide me with a full breakdown of your costs in addressing any breach on my behalf, which demonstrate clearly that your charges are in proportion to your actual costs.

 

Failure to do so will result in me issuing a county court claim for recovery of the charges plus interest and costs.

 

Yours faithfully,

Edited by ims21

 

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Hi again

 

While waiting for some advice on my previous post, another thought crossed my mind.

 

Up until now I have ignored the Lowell letters but as the debt has been sold to them, would it be wise for me to CCA Lowell? I ask this because if an enforceable credit agreement cannot be produced then i assume the account should just be closed and no claim for refund of charges etc. by me would be effective. If, however, they have an enforceable agreement, then my claim can be put in.

 

Maybe I'm thinking about this too hard but I'd really like some help with the route to take bearing in mind the debt has been sold to Lowell.

 

Thank you

 

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i would leave out the last 3 line for now.

 

that int seems very high whet were the majority of the charges? 1999

 

and it matters not if the cca is en or un-en

 

wait for cap1 to suddenly take the debt back

 

you mention no figures so's i cant really comment on if yo'll have outstanding still

 

but as sure as eggs is eggs, if the dca offered a discount - the three rules apply...

 

either its un-en

all unlawful charges or ppi

or its near sb date.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi dx

 

Thanks so much for coming back to me.

 

OK, I will remove the "I am shocked" line. Thanks

 

I have calculated the compound interest using an average of their rate per their statements which comes out at 1.89% per month. For example, the earliest charge was for £18 in March 2001. The compound interest calculates out at £180 to date. The second one is for £18 in April 2001 and the CI calculates out at £170. One of the last ones was for £12 in April 2008 and the CI on that one to date is £23. So I have claculated the compound interest for each individual charge and then just added them together.

 

There are 57 charges on the account between March 2001 and April 2008. Started off at £18, then went up to £20 each and then went down to £12 each.

 

So we are talking CI from some of these charges going back 10 years or so.

 

Lowells want about the £2,300 mark which can easily be cleared with the claim I am intending to put in. Having read other threads, it seems that it is Cap 1 who must refund me, not Lowell (despite the sale of the debt). I can then sort out the payment of what I legitimately owe them. It is this "Sold" bit that confuses me. If Cap 1 have sold the debt will it be the new owner (Lowell) who deal with collection or will they somehow get it back to Cap 1?

 

Thanks for your help dx...really appreciate it

 

ims

 

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Hi dx

 

Sorry, misunderstood. You didn't mean the "Shocked" line did you. You said last three lines which is the bit about default in the credit file, the bit about full breakdown and the bit about court action. Just leave it that they have 14 days to comply?

 

have I got this right please.

 

ims

 

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i meant to say the last 3 lines! sri....

 

the oc charges you - the oc refund you!

 

this will be quite a nice earner for you you should see quite a bit to your pocket!

 

incidently, there ia nice nice thread in the barclaycard forum [infact i think two now] of recent

whereby the refund went to the op's bank a/c!

they have no legal write to 'give' it to the dca as the a/c is sold and no agreement exists anylonger.

 

have a poke around.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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delete from i give you 14days

 

save that for their wriggling that they'll do

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi dx

 

Thank you for your advice. I have amended the wording and the letter has now gone recorded delivery. And so the games begin!

 

Just noticed some of your other posts....Wow, you do stay up late trying to help people.

 

When I win this there will certainly be a donation made to the site. I'll keep the thread updated as to progress.

 

Thanks again

 

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Just got in from work to a telephone message from Lowell stating that they need to talk to me urgently today. I'm going to ignore this now that I have served correspondence on Cap1 for a reclaim.

 

Is this the right thing to do please?

 

ims

 

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hehe

you're learning....

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi dx

 

Had another Lowell letter saying this is the last letter before passing to Red Debt Collection. Carry on ignoring?

 

The only thing I am unsure of is that Cap 1 and Lowell say that the debt from Cap1 has been sold to Lowell rather than just passed to Lowell for collection.

 

Does this not have an impact even though I am after Cap1 for repayment of unfair charges?

 

Incidentally, I sent Cap1 the preliminary letter requesting refund of charges etc on 5 April. Sent recorded. They signed for it. Haven't had a reply yet. Is it time to send lba or shall I give them a bit more time to respiond?

 

Thanks in advance

 

ims

 

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