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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

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Your case might be too complicate for them to handle... They twisted it so much that they now need some expert to untangle the knots...

 

It will be a long and arduous process... for them!

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I have just checked online for the recorded delivery my partner sent last tuesday asking for an appeal on the dismissal, but it is not showing as been delivered or signed for yet?! great! deadline to appeal was last friday, where do we stand with that if they have not recieved it by that date?... we have proof it was sent on tuesday....

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Can you contact them by email?

If so, I'd do so ASAP, explaining the situation and attaching a copy of the letter and a downloaded copy of the recorded delivery web page. Keep all evidence of the recorded delivery, of course.

They can't, or certainly would be very foolish to, refuse you an appeal in this circumstance.

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Hi 'sack6470',

 

I have had several instances where I sent a recorded delivery letter/packet and it did not show on the 'Royal Mail' website as received, or signed for.

 

However, you have proof it has been sent... your letter is deemed to be received by its addressee two working days after being posted.

 

Nevertheless, as 'elpulpo' mentioned, you can send an e-mail reiterating the content of your appeal...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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Hi,

 

How are you getting on?

 

Any update?

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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Hi, they have emailed back saying that the appeal letter has been recieved.... so just waiting for appeal date.

 

my partner wants his name cleared, and for them to admit that this has been dealt with wrong and claim for unfair dismissal, Would we approach the solicitor now or wait until after the appeal?

Edited by sack6470
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You may want to approach him/her now and brief him/her about the case and where you actually stand at this moment in time.

 

Would be a good idea, too, to send off that SAR/DPA now as they could well send the requested documents on the deadline (40 days).

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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Hi,

have just recieved a date for the appeal plus the minutes of the d.h which are in some cases inaccurate, wrote in the wrong order of how the conversation went and issues raised by partner not even mentioned in them!

 

 

what do we do regards this? send them partners account of d.h and tell them that we do not agreee fully with their minutes? is it correct that these should have been shown to him at the end of the d.h and he should have agreed or disagreed with them then for them to be amended accordingly?

 

any advice greatfully accepted.

 

 

Wish we were well off, then we would get the best solicitor in the land to fight all this.... stress, headache, frustration... on and on and on.! :mad:

Edited by sack6470
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Try and find an employment law specialist who will do a free, initial consultaion.

Beware of NWNF in employment law, costs are very rarely awarded to applicants at the ET, so the legal fees would eat up a fair chunk (or all) of any award you might receive.

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Hi 'sack6470',

 

As you previously mentioned... the minutes are inaccurate... this is where the notes taken by you and your colleague come handy...

 

Minutes should have been signed by you at the end of the meeting... thus asserting their truthfulness... Since this has not been the case... you will be able to put that forward at the tribunal... you challenge the veracity of the minutes...

 

To challenge the Disciplinary Hearing procedure... go back to your 'Handbook of Employment' and check, point by point, what should have been done and followed... do the same by using the ACAS Code of Practice - Disciplinary and Grievance Procedures...

 

Any new evidence in the case?

 

Regarding NW/NF solicitor... shop around before signing any Conditional Fee Agreement (CFA)... Generally is around 25% plus incurred expenses as case goes along...

 

The road to redress is a long one but we are all behind you two...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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Bigredbus, thanks for your advice..

 

Should we not at ths point then write or even bring up in the appeal that the d.h minutes are inacurrate?

 

 

 

god the whole thing stinks.......

 

SO WISH I HAD TAKEN OUT FULL HOUSE INSURANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited by sack6470
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You may, at the appeal, mention that you intend to challenge the veracity of the minutes... as they have not been signed... (do not sign them then)... what you intend to do here is to demonstrate before a tribunal that they were dishonest in their minutes...

 

Do not get mad... I fully understand the pressure and feelings running high but if you take everything in a logical and rationale way, they would have little room to move...

 

Let them say... but, please, make sure you have everything in writing...

 

We can, even, help you write a letter to prepare for your appeal...

 

Do not hesitate... :)

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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We would be greatful for any help on writing the appeal grounds letter...

 

 

I have said to my partner, (am I right in doing so?) that the appeal is just a process he has to go through to take it to the next stage ET, so not to get too stressed over it ...

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Dear So and So,

 

We acknowledge your letter dated XX/XX/2010.

 

We contend as follows:

 

a) Pursuant to the Advisory, Conciliation and Arbitration Service (ACAS) - Code of Procedures - Disciplinary and Grievances at Work - '[E]mployers and Employees should raise and deal with issues promptly and should not unreasonably delay meetings, decisions or confirmation of those decisions'. We remind you that this case has been unduly protracted for the last 5 months, thus causing us unnecessary physical and financial burden.

 

b) We remind you that none of the minutes of hearings and/or meetings have been signed by both parties, thus we will challenge the veracity of those minutes.

 

c) Pursuant to The Reporting of Injuries, Diseases and Dangerous Occurrences Regulations 1995 (The RIDDOR 1995), cases of over-three day injuries must be notified within ten days of the incident occurring. Upon requesting a copy of the recording of the accident, which occured on your premises on XX/XX/2009, from the Health and Safety Executive (the HSE), we have been notified that such entry does not exist, contrary to your confirmation in the minutes of the meeting dated XX/XX/2010.

 

d) We requested, from you, disclosure of the true copy of the recording of this accident with the HSE, to no avail. We, hereby, request that the said document be disclosed prior to the appeal.

 

We hope the present clarifies our position.

 

'sack6470'

Edited by Bigredbus
Typo...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

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Thanks Bigredbus for your reply...

 

Can I just say the RIDDOR Report that my partner asked about was not even mentioned in the minutes of the meeting... . yes it is all relevant in the case, it highlights the incompetance and lies that are being told and they just get away with without answering... but I feel that thats just another thing thats going to be looked over by them.

 

 

I wanted to clarify with ACAS that when we put in appeal letter that they have not followed company procedure in disciplinary action... that we were in fact correct to argue this...

I have looked back again in the company handbook and contract of employment and it does not actually state a procedure to follow for disciplinary action (it did for grievance procedures)

 

So I said to the ACAS advisor that it does not proplerly lay out the procedures and she said, then they have to revert to using ACAS code of conduct if they havent got them themselves... and thats what should be used.....

 

So one of the first things is like so many of you have said before.... the amount of time it takes should be reasonable.... well it hasnt been! so i am getting more and more lost in this.... Acas Advisor saying one thing, telling me another, then reading another... oh lord give me strength.

Edited by sack6470
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Thanks Bigredbus for your reply...

 

Can I just say the RIDDOR Report that my partner asked about was not even mentioned in the minutes of the meeting... I am wondering if they will turn around and say ... 'this is not we are here to discuss'... at the appeal like they did with my partners grievance he raised at the d.h... yes it is all relevant in the case, it highlights the incompetance and lies that are being told and they just get away with without answering... but I feel that thats just another thing thats going to be looked over by them.

 

I have just come off the phone from ACAS yet again! sometimes you get such helpful sympathetic advisors, and sometimes ..........:mad: well make you feel that you are interupting their tea break lol..

 

I wanted to clarify with ACAS that when we put in appeal letter that they have not followed company procedure in disciplinary action... that we were in fact correct to argue this... they said that although the time they took to deal with this case from suspension to d.h although unreasonable length of time... was not specifically deemed as them not following company procedure... I raised the fact again that every peice of evidence or written documents they had provided... it was only provided once we had requested it... again she said does not necessary mean they have not followed procedure... hhmmm?

 

So then I went and looked back again in the company handbook and contract of employment and it does not actually state a procedure to follow for disciplinary action (it did for grievance procedures)

It states a disc.. procedure.. for punctuality and absentise....

but when it came to GROSS MISCONDUCT all it had was a list of what is deemed as GM and thats all... it did not say , a investigory hearing, suspension... d.h etc etc ? nothing ! just the list of what can be classed as G.M and being abussive and aggressive wasnt even on that list...

 

So I said to the ACAS advisor that it does not proplerly lay out the procedures and she said, then they have to revert to using ACAS code of conduct if they havent got them themselves... and thats what should be used.....

 

So one of the first things is like so many of you have said before.... the amount of time it takes should be reasonable.... well it hasnt been! so i am getting more and more lost in this.... Acas Advisor saying one thing, telling me another, then reading another... oh lord give me strength!

 

The company want it outlined why they have not followed company disciplinary procedures, when we think we have an argument eg time and lack of proof and evidence submitted.... we then get told that it is not enough to say that they did not follow procedures correctly, it may have been unreasonable but that is not classed as enough to claim unfair dismissal... and could in fact just warrant a slap on the hand for them if anything else...

 

The fact that the crime (that didnt even occur) abusive and agressive behaviour, warrants dismissal for gross misconduct is too severe a punishment, and is not even listed on their list of whats deemed as GM

Is a good argument.... But I worry that we will lose on the not following company procedure and that if we raise the riddor report etc that we feel is important, they will say that is not the issue here...

 

That's where your strength lies...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi 'Mr and Mrs sack6470',

 

We all hope that your case is coming together nicely and strongly...

---Aut viam inveniam aut faciam---

 

***All advice given should be taken as guidance... Professional advice should always be taken before any course of action is pursued***

 

- I do not reply directly to any PMs, but you are more than welcome to enclose a link, in a PM, to your post. Thank you -

Make a contribution to this site... Help the CAG keeping on helping you for FREE.

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