5 Year Australian Debt being chased in the UK

[bobster316]

I was there for approx 3 years on a 4 year working visa

[Johnd101]

Hi Bobster I am in the exact same position, gotten the same thing from this crowd just recently as obviously a few others have. Not quite sure what to do, have you had any further information/ contact from these people? Not sure if I need to contact a solicitor any help appreciated

[FlatBroke]

Seems like a scare tactic, especially if the debt is an Australian one. One quick look at the The Australian Bankruptcy Act 1966, Section 43 basically says that a creditor can only petition to the court to make you bankrupt (a sequestration order) if you are residing in Australia at the time. They cant do it in your absence. The letter is most likely a fishing attempt to make you phone them and acknowledge the debt and therefore restart the clock. See below extract.

 

Jurisdiction to make sequestration orders

(1) Subject to this Act, where:

(a) a debtor has committed an act of bankruptcy; and

(b) at the time when the act of bankruptcy was committed, the

debtor:

(i) was personally present or ordinarily resident in

Australia;

(ii) had a dwelling-house or place of business in Australia;

(iii) was carrying on business in Australia, either personally

or by means of an agent or manager; or

(iv) was a member of a firm or partnership carrying on

business in Australia by means of a partner or partners

or of an agent or manager;

the Court may, on a petition presented by a creditor, make a

sequestration order against the estate of the debtor.

[cancan987]

Hi Johnd101, I have just had the same letter from Stevendrake. Could you please let me know how you have got on, as i need to know what move to make next. Any information would be appreciated.

Regards cancan987

[cerberusalert]

Have a read through http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/overseas-debt-overseas-account/221573-debt-being-chased-australia.html it's a bit long but should answer your questions.

[bobster316]

I have just received a letter from SD again this time they advise

 

"we are instructed to issue County Court proceedings. In this connection are you instructed to accept service of the same?"

 

I questioned jurisdiction, to which they replied "under common law whatever country the defedant residents in has jurisdication, proceedings will now be issued"

 

what are my options now?

 

thanks

[cerberusalert]

Wait until the papers are served.... if they ever are.

[ODC]

I have just received a letter from SD again this time they advise

 

"we are instructed to issue County Court proceedings. In this connection are you instructed to accept service of the same?"

 

I questioned jurisdiction, to which they replied "under common law whatever country the defedant residents in has jurisdication, proceedings will now be issued"

 

what are my options now?

 

thanks

Personally I think they are talking roulards

Edited June 17, 2010 by 42man

[42man]

Please report them to the OFT - OFT warns credit firms against legal action outside debtors' home jurisdiction - The Office of Fair Trading

[bobster316]

Not sure if this ruling applies to overseas companies seeking legal action in the UK.

[42man]

Report Stevens Drake, they being a solicitor (they also act for Amex too) should frankly know better than to do this....they haven't a hope of enforcing an Australian product under UK law....(it might be worth reporting them to the SRA too)....if you get a court claim through then let us know. The SD was also a scare tactic too so it seems, one tactic that has also been given a slapping by the OFT - OFT imposes requirements on 1st Credit over debt collection practices - The Office of Fair Trading

[42man]

Let us know if a court claim comes through....

[42man]

They have committed a multiple breach in my view...In fact it would seem they are deliberately misleading you by saying

 

"under common law whatever country the defedant residents in has jurisdication, proceedings will now be issued"

 

This is what the OFT say...

 

a. use of official looking documents intended or likely to mislead debtors as to their status, for example, documents made to resemble court

claims.

 

b. leaving out or presenting information in such a way that it creates a false or misleading impression or exploits debtors lack of knowledge

 

d. unnecessary and unhelpful use of legal and technical language

[bobster316]

Thanks for your feedback, appreciate it, i am waiting for the next correspondance from SD, will let you know what they say this time.

[exroyalengineer]

Ok people, As far as I can make out these charlatans are blatantly taking the P1ss!! Having been sent the same toss as everyone else on this feed I sent them a "prove it " letter. Not heard anything since Feb. Get yourselves familiar with Aussie law. As far as I can understand they have absolutely no juristriction whatsoever in the UK. Whatever you do don't acknowledge it!!!!!! Ignore them. If ya still desperate PM me and I'll send you a copy of what I sent them.

[WA_Newman]

With regard to Jurisdiction, it is possible that an Australian contract can be enforced in a UK court if the UK court is deemed to be the appropriate forum to hear the case. Given that the debtor is a UK resident, it could be argued that a UK court is the appropriate forum.

 

Regardless of Jurisdiction, any contract between an Australian financial institution and a (then) Australian resident, signed in Australia is subject to Australian Law.

 

A creditor would have to sue in a UK under Australian Law, which is not the easiest, or cheapest option.

 

As the alleged debt is covered under Australian Law, the creditor would need to be a member of an Australian financial ombudsman service (there are two: FOS and COSL). Simply disputing the debt with the ombudsman service is going to delay anything for months at least. There are a lot of things a creditor has to do under Australian Law to enforce a judgement in court, not least issue a Section 80 letter before commencing any actions.

 

Anyone interested in reading up should google "ASIC debt collection", "Section 80", "UCCC".

 

New laws brought in on 1st July 2010 make it even more difficult for Australian Debt Collectors.

[cerberusalert]

Thanks for that post, I've copied it into one of the stickies http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?250889-Can-I-Be-Sued-For-An-Overseas-Debt

[William415]

Thanks, WA_Newman.

 

I will be doing some research on this when I have the time - as I am most defintely interested in this subject. Also, I will do a follow-up post on what I find out.

 

In the meantime, can you (or someone) provide a quick summary of the "new laws" brought in on 1 July 2010 that make it more difficult for Australian DCA's?

 

W

[bobster316]

I've now received a Count Court Claim which i need to respond to within 14 days. What do you think should be my next move. I don't think they are going to stop pursuing this, i may have to settle.

[cerberusalert]

Can you post the POC up after removing any identifiers?

[cerberusalert]

Also read post #41 above.

[bobster316]

Claim Form In the Brighton County Court

Claim No. XXXXXX

Issues Date

 

Claimant

Credit Corp Services Pty Limited

Level 11 10 Barrack Street

Sydney NSW

Australia

 

Defendant

Mr XXXXXX XXXXX

 

Address XXXXXXXX

 

Brief Details of claim

 

Monies due under an account assigned to the Claimant and in a foreign currency

 

Value

£4,125

 

 

Particluars of the Claim

 

1. The Claimant is Assignee of the Debt from Australua and New Zealand Banking ('The Assignor').

The Claim is for the balance of payments due under an Agreement made between the Assignor

and the Defendants entered into out of the jurisdiction and therefore not regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

2. The Agreement provided for:

a) payment each month of stipulated monthly payments

b) in default thereof the Claimant may terminate the agreement and recover the full balance under

the agreement.

 

3. In breach the said Agreement the Defedant failed to make payment and the agreement was terminated by the Assignor.

 

4. On 5 Novemeber 2009 the balance was due and payable by the defendant was AUS $6,758

 

5. The defendant has paid AUS $0,00

 

The Claimant therefore claims

1. AUS$6,758

2. Contractual interest accrued to the date hereof: AUS$610.12

3. Further contractual interest at the rate of 0.97% per month ($AUS2.33per day)

from the date thereof until judgement or sooner payment or as the court deems fit.

4. Costs to be assessed.

Claimant claim AUS$7,258

 

* We hereby certify that the rate current in London for the purchase of $AUS at close of business

on XX of August 2010 was 1.72 to the £1 sterling and at this rate the amount due unde the claim

to date amounts to £4254 and the claim total to £4600

[cerberusalert]

Send this to the claimant;

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR 31.14 Request

 

On (date) I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the (Name) County Court.

 

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

 

[Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the agreement mentioned in the Claim Form and on which you rely. That request was ignored][delete if no such request was delivered]

 

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of [each of the following / the] document(s) mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

 

1 the agreement. You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

 

2 the assignment*

 

3 the default notice*

 

4 the termination notice*

 

5 [any other documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim]*

 

* delete if not mentioned in the Particulars of claim.

 

[Although your claim is for a sum which is not more than £5,000.00 and will in all likelihood be allocated to the small claims track for determination upon my delivering a defence, at this moment in time I have not delivered my defence and the case has not been allocated to a track. In consequence the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect and you should not seek to avoid compliance with your CPR 31 duties by claiming otherwise]#

 

# delete if claim for a sum exceeding £5,000.00

 

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

 

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

 

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

 

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

 

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

 

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

 

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

 

yours faithfully

Print name do not sign

[William415]

I'm confused ... how could the Australian DCA (via their shark lawyers in the UK) submit a Court Claim unless there has been a prior court judgement against the debtor in Australia? Did I miss something?

 

Or are they trying to bypass the Australian courts and go directly to the UK courts?

 

Now I'm getting worried again, as this DCA is the same group of bandits that are chasing ME!

 

W

[bobster316]

Thanks for the letter i should send. Do i send it to Credit Corp in Australia or to Stevensdrake in Crawley?