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    • I'm not sure on the best option here, I'm happy to go with Tomlin, however I can afford to pay this one in full if needed and wonder whether I should be trying to get a reduced amount, perhaps in the court hallway before going in? that would require submitting a WS of some sort. What I 'like' (strong word) about TO in this instance, is that it allows me to keep my savings to hand for further accounts needing attention in the near future and I would hope gives me some control over the pcm amount.. I've read a number of TO threads now (fell to sleep at the keyboard last night ) but have a few questions please: - Do I specify the payment arrangement in a TO or the claimant? I'm thinking 20% lump upfront plus 96 months of circa 60 squid. - Who decides repayment amounts if CCJ is granted? if the judge, then do I submit I&E at any point? Given the amount of total debt across all my claims, I need to ensure anything I commit to is future proofed. I wouldn't want all my disposable income sent to this one debt, only to have another one in a month or two.
    • I'm sure I've said before that it's fine and dandy bringing in rules that favour you or your party, but you have to consider how it would play out if your opponents get in and want to use the same rules...
    • Its Gaelic celebration and bonfires today - Beltane Quite fortuitous for tomorrow lets hope
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    • Few tweaks as the run order was completely messed up and the main point of your defence (reconstituted agreement) pushed to the bottom of the statement.   I, XXXXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows; I make this Witness Statement in support of my defence in this claim and further to my set aside application dated 1 November 2022. 1.The claimants witness statement confirms that it mostly relies on hearsay evidence as confirmed by the drafts in person in the opening paragraph. It is my understanding they must serve notice to any hearsay evidence pursuant to CPR 33.2(1)(B) (notice of intention to rely on hearsay evidence) and Section 2 (1) (A) of the Civil Evidence Act. 2.  I understand that the claimant is an Assignee, a buyer of defunct or bad debts, which are bought on mass portfolios at a much reduced cost to the amount claimed and which the original creditors have already wrote off as a capital loss and claimed against taxable income as confirmed in the claimants witness statement exhibit by way of the Deed of Assignment. 3. As an assignee or creditor as defined in section 189 of the CCA this applies to this new requirement on assignment of rights.  This means that when an assignee purchases debts (or otherwise acquires rights under a credit agreement) it also acquires certain obligations to the borrower including the duty to comply with CCA requirements (such as the rules on statements and notices and other post-contractual information).  The assignee becomes the creditor under the agreement. This ensures that essential consumer protections under the CCA cannot be circumvented by assigning the debt to a third party. 4.  I became aware of original Judgement following a routine credit check on or around 14th September 2020. 5. The alleged letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 was served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018, no effort was made to ascertain my correct address.  I have attached a copy of my tenancy agreement which is marked ‘Appendix 1’ and shows I was residing at a difference address as of 11 December 2018 and was therefore not at the service address at the time the proceedings were served.  I have also attached an email from my solicitors to the Claimants solicitors dated 14 July 2022 which was sent to them requesting that they disclose the trace of evidence they utilised prior to issuing the proceedings against me.  This is marked ‘Appendix 2’. The claimants solicitors did not provide me with these documents. 6. Under The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims 2017 a Debt Buyer must undertake all reasonable enquiries to ensure the correct address of a debtor, this can be as simple as a credit file search. The Claimant failed to carry out such basic checks. Subsequently all letters prior to and including ,The Pre action Protocol letter of claim dated 7 January 2020 and the claim form dated 14th February 2020 were all served to a previous address which I moved out of in 2018. 7. Upon the discovery of the Judgement debt, I made immediate contact with the Court and the Claimant Solicitors, putting them on notice that I was making investigations in relation to the Judgement debt as it was not familiar to me.  I asked them to provide me with a copy of the original loan agreement but this was not provided to me.   The correspondence to the Claimant Solicitor's is attached and marked ‘Appendix 3’ 8. On (insert date) I successfully made application to set a side the judgment. The claim proceeded to allocation, 9. The claimant failed to comply with the additional directions ordered by District Judge Davis on the 2 February 2024 'The Claim shall be automatically struck out at 4pm on 3 April 2024 unless the Claimant delivers to the Court and to the Defendant the following documents.' None of these documents were received by the court nor the defendant by that date. (insert date you did receive the documents) I then sent a Data Subject Access Request to Barclays but no agreement was provided. Details the timeline of communication between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 4’and the copies of correspondence between myself and Barclays are attached and marked ‘Appendix 5’. Remove irrelevant 10.The claimant relies upon and has exhibited a reconstituted version of the alleged agreement. It is again denied that I have ever entered into an agreement with Barclaycard on or around 2000.  It is admitted that I did hold other credit agreements with other creditors and as such should this be a debt that was assigned to Barclaycard from another brand therefore the reconstituted agreement disclosed is invalid being pre April 2007 and not legally enforceable pursuant to HHJ Judge Waksman in Carey v HSBC 2009 EWHC3417.  Details of this are attached and marked ‘Appendix 6’. The original credit agreement must be provided along with any reconstituted version on a modified credit agreement and must contain the names and address of debtor and creditor, agreement number and cancelation clause. 11. Therefore the claimant is put to strict proof to disclose a true executed legible agreement on which its claim relies upon and not mislead the court. 12. It is denied I have ever received a default Notice pursuant to sec 87(1) CCA1974.The claimant is put to strict proof to evidence from the original creditors internal document software the trigger of said notice.  13.   As per CPR 1.4(2)(a) the court encourages parties to cooperate with each other in the conduct of proceedings in order to try and save time and costs for the parties and to also save the time and resources of the court however, despite vast attempts at mediation the claimants have been most unreasonable and have remained unwilling to mediate. 14. Until such time the claimant can comply and disclose a true executed copy of the original assigned agreement they refer to within the particulars of this claim they are not entitled while the default continues, to enforce the agreement pursuant to section 78.6 (a) of the Credit Consumer Act 1974. I believe that the facts stated in this Witness Statement are true.  I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. Signed                 ………………………………………………….. Name                  XXXX Date                     30 April 2024   Run 3 copies Court /Claimants Sol/File
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Welcome - illegal repo in contravention of section 92 and unfair relationship ** WON **


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The "new" statement of case is absolutely riddled with outright lies, I can feel a renewed Contempt of Court issue rearing its ugly head :-x

 

"The claimant has made no fewer than 3 applications to have the defence struck out"

Actually it was 1!

 

"It is denied that the agent entered the claimant's premises"

and included is a note from the agent saying he recovered the car from my property! Part 34 is becoming increasingly tempting and possibly my new best friend :-D

 

Ok so in laymans terms -

we cant count and are being picky

we deny it but we admit it

I know we will change our defence and try scaring Ms Wannabe

 

Hmm yes I can see how you are totally strengthening your case Mr P

 

I still dont actually see the significance of how many applications have been made, you are liberty to make them so why shouldnt you? maybe its me thats thick lol

 

:rolleyes:

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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Don't trouble yourself with decision making, the answer is all 3! :lol:

 

Im feeling inclined to agree!

I guess im on a waiting game now until I get directions from the court :rolleyes: They faxed AQ over at 3.30pm on Tues and posted us a copy which arrived 'late' :rolleyes: they want a stay, they want mediation, they want to settle, they want a 2.5hr hearing

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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Ok, time to give put the rage aside for tonight. A curry and X Factor will do nicely thanks :-D

 

Enjoy!! :) x

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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Ok so in laymans terms -

we cant count and are being picky

we deny it but we admit it

I know we will change our defence and try scaring Ms Wannabe

 

Hmm yes I can see how you are totally strengthening your case Mr P

 

I still dont actually see the significance of how many applications have been made, you are liberty to make them so why shouldnt you? maybe its me thats thick lol

 

:rolleyes:

It's in Part 3 that if an applicant makes multiple applications and 2 or more are dismissed as totally without merit then the applicant can be deemed a vexatious litigant and a civil restraint order can be applied for. Yes of course I totally fit that bill lol!

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It's in Part 3 that if an applicant makes multiple applications and 2 or more are dismissed as totally without merit then the applicant can be deemed a vexatious litigant and a civil restraint order can be applied for. Yes of course I totally fit that bill lol!

 

Again I dont understand the relevance when the above has toss all to do with anything as you say you 'totally' fit the bill :confused::rolleyes:

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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hello guest, sorry you're not going to find out what is up my sleeve until it lands on your desk. My lips are sealed. Don't you think it's shameful that you have to resort to reading the consumer forums to glean information?? Very sad, very sad...

free-sign-smileys-1000.gif

free-sign-smileys-1017.gif

free-sign-smileys-1000.gif

 

love it!!!!

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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I'm gonna have to quieten down for a bit, Mr P is learning too much lol!! I'll email you the secrets thinking-017.GIF

 

hahahaha ill await emails with great anticipation!

I am a consumer just like you, please get a second opinion or investigate yourself on anything I advise as I am in no way legally trained. Everything I know has come from the Mighty CAG and fellow CAGGERS. :cool:

 

If I have helped in any way please click my reputation star and make a donation to CAG to enable us all to continue to help each other :cool:

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Finally received my disclosure and statement of case from them and their "new" defence is that the agent was able to stand on the pavement and reach the car so he actually never entered my premises!

 

:-x

 

the law is that if the car is parked on your private property they need a court order not if the repo agent has to walk onto your property they need a court order.

 

the law is all about where the vehicle is, end of.

 

there are a number of lifting systems that would allow a repo agent to lift a vehicle off private land without actually entering it himself physically.

 

lets hope the judge doesnt uphold this defence or we will no doubt see a sudden surge in cranes trying to squeeze up narrow residential streets to lift cars off peoples drives.

 

i'd just reply to mr p's letter with a one line reply..... "you're a d1ck head" and leave it at that...lol

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the law is that if the car is parked on your private property they need a court order not if the repo agent has to walk onto your property they need a court order.

 

the law is all about where the vehicle is, end of.

 

there are a number of lifting systems that would allow a repo agent to lift a vehicle off private land without actually entering it himself physically.

 

lets hope the judge doesnt uphold this defence or we will no doubt see a sudden surge in cranes trying to squeeze up narrow residential streets to lift cars off peoples drives.

 

i'd just reply to mr p's letter with a one line reply..... "you're a d1ck head" and leave it at that...lol

 

nice one cyril nice one son, nice one cyril lets have another one lol-045.gif

 

cab

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there are a number of lifting systems that would allow a repo agent to lift a vehicle off private land without actually entering it himself physically

 

Completely automatically with no assistance from the operator to attach or connect up in a restricted area like a driveway???

 

Even manoeuvring a jib or any other of object into the immediate air space of your property requires the permission of the property owner in the absence of a court order I believe.

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many thanks uit can you give a link to what section of the cca 1974 states the regs about not being able to repo off a private drive except by a court order

 

you know me

 

true or not

 

I NEED TO SEE IT IN BLACK AND WHITE IN THE CCA 1974

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It's fine really, I have it all up my sleeve. I'm sorry I can't give any more details at the mo but like I said, forums have ears!

It is not just the CCA 1974 that is involved here, but I'm just not prepared to give Mr P a heads up so I'm keeping quiet for the next few days. He has pushed me too far this time :-x

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Completely automatically with no assistance from the operator to attach or connect up in a restricted area like a driveway???

 

Even manoeuvring a jib or any other of object into the immediate air space of your property requires the permission of the property owner in the absence of a court order I believe.

Wholeheartedly agree! :lol:
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Completely automatically with no assistance from the operator to attach or connect up in a restricted area like a driveway???

 

Even manoeuvring a jib or any other of object into the immediate air space of your property requires the permission of the property owner in the absence of a court order I believe.

 

there are various ways it can be done without the agent actually stepping foot on your property, the easiest being the use of a spectacle lift recovery truck rather than the tilt and slide flat bed type used in wannabe's case.

all you have to to do with a spec lift is reverse the device under the cars wheels and lift it up and drag, all can be done from several feet away from the actual property. of course you'd be a fool to tow a vehicle any distance on a spec lift without securing it with straps but you could easily drag a vehicle off a drive without steping onto the property to fix straps.

 

but as you say, and i agree, even by using a mechanical device the agent has entered your property, and in any case the law relates to where the vehicle is and not where the repo agent stands.

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many thanks uit can you give a link to what section of the cca 1974 states the regs about not being able to repo off a private drive except by a court order

 

you know me

 

true or not

 

I NEED TO SEE IT IN BLACK AND WHITE IN THE CCA 1974

 

http://www.stephensons.co.uk/site/services/individuals/srvdisputes/hire_purchase_agreements/

 

here is a link to a solicitors website which clarify's this matter, i happen to know this firm having used them in the past, not for a consumer contract issue but they are a reputable legal firm and here is what they have to say about the matter.....

 

"If however, you have paid less than a third of your debt, the creditor will only need a Court Order when they want to remove goods from your property. However your creditor will not need to obtain a Court Order if the goods are in a public place. For example, if you have a hire purchase agreement on your car, your creditor does not need a Court Order to remover it from the street."

 

note the term used is "to remove goods from your property" not "to enter your property" it's really quite simple the court order is required to take the goods off your drive, not to enter your drive.

 

in fact there is no need for a court order to enter your drive, if there was we would be able to outlaw those annoying door to door sales men, no, it's not the stepping on the property that a court order is required for, it's taking of goods off the property that the court order is needed for, no matter how you do it.

 

try again mr p, this is an epic FAIL:confused:

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http://www.stephensons.co.uk/site/services/individuals/srvdisputes/hire_purchase_agreements/

 

here is a link to a solicitors website which clarify's this matter, i happen to know this firm having used them in the past, not for a consumer contract issue but they are a reputable legal firm and here is what they have to say about the matter.....

 

"If however, you have paid less than a third of your debt, the creditor will only need a Court Order when they want to remove goods from your property. However your creditor will not need to obtain a Court Order if the goods are in a public place. For example, if you have a hire purchase agreement on your car, your creditor does not need a Court Order to remover it from the street."

 

note the term used is "to remove goods from your property" not "to enter your property" it's really quite simple the court order is required to take the goods off your drive, not to enter your drive.

 

in fact there is no need for a court order to enter your drive, if there was we would be able to outlaw those annoying door to door sales men, no, it's not the stepping on the property that a court order is required for, it's taking of goods off the property that the court order is needed for, no matter how you do it.

 

try again mr p, this is an epic FAIL:confused:

 

No but you could withdraw their licence (in writing) to enter the boundary of your property which includes your driveway Then if they do, for any reason, that's trespass init

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No but you could withdraw their licence (in writing) to enter the boundary of your property which includes your driveway Then if they do, for any reason, that's trespass init

 

you don't need to write anything,

once you have told the person to remove his person from your property, that person is then trespassing.

 

cab

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postgi Why should removing a vehicle from private property without consent be mentioned in the CCA????

Thanks for your input JonCris and you are totally correct! The removing of a vehicle from private property is covered by several Acts of Parliament, including Criminal law, as well as S.92 of the CCA 1974. I am aware of these Acts and have case law at my fingertips to prove as much! We all know their argument is fatally flawed it is just a case of putting pen to paper now and telling them as much. It is the sheer arrogance of the man that riles me the most, how dare he pertain to be a professional and then send me such drivel as could be compiled by my 5 year old child!! :-x If you have made errors at least have the common decency to admit it!

 

you don't need to write anything,

once you have told the person to remove his person from your property, that person is then trespassing.

 

cab

Yes absolutely, trespass is a very valid argument as there are several types of trespass which, incidentally, are not in any way dependant upon setting foot on the property, (as we discussed last night ;-) )

You don't even need to ask them to leave, the fact is that they cannot enter your property unless you have given your permission!

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Hardy ha ha ha!! :lol: Just got more drivel in the post! OMFG this one is a classic!!

 

They must be getting worried now because they are threatening court action if I use any of the documents they have provided for any other reason than the hearing! What like scanning and posting on a thread?? He has also mentioned something in his latest letter that I have NEVER told him direct BUT is on my thread!!

 

It's a good job I have never used ANY documents for anything else then!!

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