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    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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Account numbers - are they relevant


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Think I might have posted this orignally to the wrong issue group. Or, really, no one is able to answer...:(

 

But, I'll try again here (with some additional detail) if I may:

 

Received a s78 response for a credit card in the prescribed time limit, which is OK. The account number, however, does not match the credit card number or the account number under which the request was made.

 

The original agreement was for a store card (Debenhams). In 2006 received a letter stating the store card would be replaced by a credit card and that unless a refusal for the card was put in writing, the card would be sent. No refusal was offered, the card was duly sent.

 

Does the agreement for the original store card automatically constitute an enforceable agreement for the new credit card account even if the account numbers do not match?

 

My thinking is: account numbers identify uniquely a person within a lender's system and it is probable that changing an account number is a referencing exrecise within that system. If it's not then and personal details are transported and the old account "closed"?:confused:

 

As stated above, the letter of response from Santander (the account administrator) refers to a different account number than that on the Credit Agreement (and if on the agreement forms part of the contract?:confused:).

 

I can find nothing in the CCA (not that I've looked at everything) which refers to account numbers and whether these are unique to the ACCOUNT and therefore represent for contract purposes unique executibale agreements. If the account number is unique to the account does that mean that a signed executable agreement for one account (number) cannot constitute an executable agreement under another account (number).

 

Anyone, any ideas or previous examples of this?

 

M1:-)

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I would say that the account number identifies the CCA contract and the bank is required to supply you evidence that the formalities of the particular contract did satisfy the 1974 act requirements.

If they can show that the new number merely replaced the old number but that it was the same agreement then they might have a valid position.

 

This is just a point of view

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montoonie1

 

it would appear that when you enter into an agreement for a credit card then that transaction is allocated a unique account reference number.

 

we have experienced ourselves when challenging the enforceability of our credit card account that the provider will totally ignore the original credit card account and will only wish to provide details of any subsequent card accounts that it has issued to you. almost in every circumstance they have failed to obtain from you a new terms and conditions that are present when you start useing those new cards, and obviously you had never been asked to sign those new conditions and neither did you ever ask for them.

 

i believe the simple answer to this is if they fail to provide a copy of the original agreement when requested then they are clearly in breach of the consumer credit act. and most credit consumer litigants would be pleased to go to court on that basis to prove and win the day for unenforceable agreement.

 

note that i have no legal experience just hopefully common sense and first hand knowledge.

 

djc

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montoonie1

just a further thought concerning your original question 'account numbers are they relevant' answer 'yes'

every time that a credit card is changed from ie visa card to master card etc.... then the provider changes the account number that identifies that card and you. but we believe that in law the original terms and conditions that you would have signed up to cannot be transferred to a new account without your express agreement in writing.

 

djc

Edited by djc
spellig error
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Hi djc

 

Thanks for your input. It would seem to me to be common sense that if the account number is assigned to the agreement it needs to be unique and if changed would require a new agreement. But whoever said the law makes any sense!:p

 

This change was from a store card to a credit card and I know the two things to be materially different in purpose and scope (Ooo! I seem to be forming an additional argument:rolleyes:!)

 

I have written a polite note asking for clarification and I will have to wait for a response just to see what happens. I get the impression the more legally strident the response, usually the smaller leg they have to stand on - I'll post with results.

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moontoonie1

 

was the original store card(debenhams) underwritten by santanda or have they only come into the frame later through acquisitionof the original provider.

 

djc

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Hi djc

 

I see what you mean. The S78 request was made to GE money: that is the address on the credit card statement and any previous communication was to, and from, 'GE Money'.

 

Something has clearly happened, the letter that accompanied the S78 return was headed "Santander Cards". The statement of account was for GE Money and "Signed on behalf of GE Money". It may be that Santander has an outsource agreement to administer GE Money accounts - my wife (it's her account) has had no correspondence to suggest Santander has aquired GE Money - but then GE Money has had significant credit crunch problems in the US with some of the biggest exposures in the mortgage securitisation market. Also, I know that many senior GE managers were let go last year and this year in the UK. So, maybe Santander, the great mopper upper, has mopped up GE Money in the UK.

 

Anyway, your previous thoughts have turned on the lights! So thank you. I reflected on my statement, "purpose and scope" and suddenly remembered that that credit account allows for cash transactions and has a separate interest rate that is shown ("Cash Transactions") on all the card statements. But as the original account was a store card, this was not included on the agreement:rolleyes:. Store cards don't have a cash withdrawal facility.

 

In addition, as the change over occured there was a small debit on the old account, which my wife paid with the new card on the advice of a GE representative - this would suggest that the two accounts ARE mutually exclusive as you can't pay to an account with that account's own money (how good would that be:D?). This will require a SAR request to confirm.

 

Is this case closed?

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montoonie1

 

i personally would wait a little longer before taking further action until one of our other more legally skilled operatives have had a look and maybe able to guide you further on your quest for justice.

 

good luck i will tickle the site team scale to see if they are able to help on this thread

 

djc

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