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    • Regretfully it does. Have you actually seen any papers which show what you were charged with (rather than what you were convicted of)? It is unusual not to be “dual charged” but if you were not charged with both, you are where you are. If you had been charged with both offences and providing you were the driver at the time, you could, after performing your SD, have asked the prosecutor to drop the “Fail to Provide” (FtP) charges in exchange for a guilty plea to the speeding charges (you cannot be convicted of speeding unless you plead guilty as they have no evidence you were driving). You will have difficulty defending the FtP charges. In fact, it’s worse than that – you have no chance of successfully defending them at all because the reason you did not respond to the requests is because you did not receive them and that’s entirely your fault. No it’s not correct. Six months from 18/11/23 was 18/5/24 so, unless they were originally charged, the speeding offences are now “timed out.” There is one avenue left open to you. If you perform your SD you must serve it on the court which convicted you. You will then receive a date for a hearing to have the matters heard again. Your only chance of having the matters revert to speeding (and this is only providing you were the driver at the time of those offences) is to plead Not Guilty, attend court and ask the prosecutor (very nicely, explaining what a pillock you know you were for failing to update your  V5C) if (s)he is prepared to raise “out of time” speeding charges, to which you will offer to plead guilty if the FtP charges are dropped.   This is strictly speaking not lawful. Charges have to be raised within six months. Some prosecutors are willing to do it, others are not. But frankly it’s the only avenue open to you. There is a risk with this. I imagine you have been fined £660 (plus surcharge and costs) for each offence. The offence attracts a fine of 1.5 week’s net income and where the court has no information about the defendant’s means a default figure of £440pw is used.  If the prosecutor is not prepared to play ball you can revise your pleas to guilty. A sympathetic court should give you the full discount (one third) for your guilty pleas in these circumstances but they may reduce the discount somewhat. The prosecution may also ask for increased costs (£90 or thereabouts is the figure for a guilty plea). So it may cost you more if you have a decent income (I’ll let you do the sums). But MS90 is an endorsement code which gives insurers a fit of the vapours. One such endorsement will see your premiums double. Two of them will see many insurers refuse to quote you at all. So you really want to exhaust every possibility of avoiding them if you can. One warning: do not pay solicitors silly money to defend you. Making an SD before a solicitor should attract just a nominal sum (perhaps a tenner). That’s all you should pay for. You have no viable defence against the FtP charges and any solicitor suggesting you have is telling you porkies. The offer to do the deal is easily done by yourself and you can save the solicitor’s fees to put towards a few taxis and increased insurance premiums if you are unsuccessful. In the happy event you find out you were "dual charged", let me know and I'll tell you how to proceed. (Seems a bit odd hoping you were charged with four driving offences rather than two, but it's a funny old world!).    
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Lisa and HSBC CCA and court advice please


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Hi All,

thought i should put this on it's own thread as i had previously added it onto an old one!

Anyway story so far, hsbc cc have registered a claim in court for OH's cc. I did the acknowledgement of service on 21st oct and put that i was going to defend the whole amount.

In the meantime i cca'd them (still awaiting a response). What i'm worried about is running out of time before they ccj me!

In the meantime, i cca'd my own hsbc cc and today rec'd a 'basically we haven't got your original agreemet but here's a copy of what it should be'! So i'm pretty sure OH will get the same response from his as it was taken out at exactly the same time.

Any advice very gratefully rec'd!

Lisa x

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They are taking r oh to court becuse he has broken the terms of the agreement.....erm what agreement is that exactly, when did i sign it? what was it for? etc and so forth?

 

if they take you to court and cannot answer these questions by providing the agreement then what is it that they are trying to enforce, surely they should have the agreement before trying to enforce it.

 

if you have asked for the CCA and at the time of attending court, they have not provided it, this is a defence in full.

 

You're doing fine, just be patient and wait, this is a game of "who blinks first"

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Hi Guys,

defo sent cca off spec. delivery (always do - work in a postroom)! haven't checked yet if they rec'd it but will do on monday when i'm back at work.

Also keep a spreadsheet on work pc but pretty sure i sent it week before last or very early last week.

Spam - do i need to actually file a defence though? And if so when is my time up (sent ack. of serv. 21st oct)?

Sorry so many questions!

Lisa x

Sorry also is there a template for the 'sorry you haven't complied with request'?

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Don't worry yet about the template - the 12+2 days has not run out yet.

 

They are running down, though, and that is important. Unless they can supply an enforceable agreement, they will be in default of this request before any hearing takes place.

 

First job done.

 

Yes, you will need to file a defence, and we will work on that and make sure it goes off in good time.

 

The next step will be to demand information under the Civil Procedure Rules. Give me half an hour to eat my dinner and I'll be back.

 

SH

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You have 19 days to file aos - after this you would have 14 days to file a defence - it looks like your deadline is tommorrow

 

If you don't file a defence they will get the ccj by default

 

don't worry about the default letter, they know the deadlines better than you do.

 

you need to act very quickly to submit even a skeleton defence

 

I would suggets you look at this immediately

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/108467-basic-introduction-consumer-credit.html it will give you an insight into the correct process to defend a court claim

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Thanks for that Spam. That's why i was so worried time wise, i knew time was up soon!

As i am absolutely pants at writing anything vaguely 'official', does anyone have a draft of a defence that i could put in for tomorrow?

Many thanks in advance

Lisa x

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Oh bugger.

 

This is another case where the Court Service website is not explicit enough. It says -

 

"If your defence is complicated and you need more time to respond, you can fill in the 'Acknowledgment of Service Form' N9.

 

If you file an acknowledgment of service within 14 days, this will allow you an extra 14 days to complete the defence form."

 

That is not good enough. It doesn't say whether the 14 days run from when the acknowlegment of service is filed, or whether the 14 days are added to the original 14 days, making it 28 days from receipt of the claim form.

 

We don't know, from the information given in this thread, when the claim was actually received.

 

Lisa, you don't seem to be online at the moment. All I can suggest is that you make an urgent telephone call tomorrow morning to the court, and find out when the defence has to be in by.

 

If you post here, I will see it tomorrow morning and get straight on with it. If you want to talk it through via voice or a chat session PM me and I'll give you my Skype details.

 

Oh, how I wish you had started a thread on the day you received the court claim. Still, it is too late for that now. I will do whatever I can to help.

 

SH

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Hindsight is a wonderful thing,

 

i believe the extension is of the 14 days for defence ie the aos is still 14 days but the defence may be submitted late

 

as stated - contact the court in the morning and find out about extension

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Hey scab - i'm back! Just checked Royal mail and it was delivered 4th november signed for.

Right have all paperwork here now. Original claim was issued 2nd october. I acknowledged and defended the whole claim which was on 21st oct.

Is there any way to work out the dates from those? Should i have a look on the mcol site (even though it confuses the hell outta me)!

Really pray i'm not too late.

Lisa x

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Can you telephone the court in the morning and find out for sure? I know you said you were back at work on Monday so have you got some time off?

 

If it is not too late, we will do what we can.

 

I'll be here again tomorrow morning, so just post on here and I'll help with whatever I can.

 

SH

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Its 19 days from the date on the claim to file AOS, then a further 14 to file the defence, as spamhead says 33 days in total.

 

If you miss the deadlines they will file for default judgement, after all this is what they were hoping for from the start.

Please note i have no legal training any advice i give comes from my own experience and from what i have learned on this site

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Right - just realised that this actually MY court claim and not OH's! Have all the court papers here now and it's mine!

Can't believe i missed that! - i have so many cca's going on at the moment that it's all got a tad confusing!

Regardless, i guess it's too late now as they issued the judgement.

Have mentioned on my 1st post that they sent a reply to that cca today saying that they don't have the original agreement!

I have ALL my finances on my pc at work and limited number at home. Need to get more organised!

Lisa x

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IS it still worth calling the court this morning? Thought i could plead ignorance and say that i HAD sent my defence but they obviously hadn't rec'd it?

Or am i just clutching at straws?

Many thanks

Lisa

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You probably are clutching at straws with that one.

 

As spamheed says, we need to find a breach of process.

 

It is very difficult, but not impossible, to get these judgments set aside. I've got to go out for a few hours now, but I'll be back after midday.

 

I am assuming the claimant was HSBC and not a DCA, in which case there will be no Notice Of Assignment. Do you still have the Default Notice so we can see if that is compliant?

 

SH

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Hi Scab, i have my file now relating to this. The earliest letter i had about this was from 'metropolitan' collection services on 12th aug. saying they had been instructed by hsbc to collect the above debt.

In the meantime, i contacted them on 4/9 to offer them 30.00 per month (they rejected that). So on 16/9, i offered 40.00 per month which they again rejected.

On 29/8 they threaten court action. On 8/9 they reject my last offer (the 40.00 one) and say they will take action in court and seek a charging order on my property!

The court papers from them say 'Dg sols' - which i know are theit in-house sols.

So i'm assuming it's them that are enforcing the debt and not 'metropolitan'.

That is all the info i have regarding this.

I'm panicking now as hadn't read the charging order one properly before.

I know you are going out now scab so look forward to hearing from you later.

Lisa x

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Is this charging order a serious threat?

Do you own property?

 

If you do, get a thread started in the "Legal Issues" part of the forum as quickly as you can.

 

Contact the court and find out about that CCJ - if you are making the payments ordered by a court, then a charging order should not be granted (Mercantile Credit v. Ellis 1987).

 

SH

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