Arrow/copes claimform - MBNA card 'debt' **DISC'D**

[libra007]

Hi

I just got a court claim from Arrow Global last week. after reading around this forum, just filed acknowledgement via MCOL to defend full claim amount and sending them more information letter

 

here are some details its quite an old account, spent aroung 5 grand then later repaid them, then they reduced my limit to around 400 or so. have been good with them but then I lost my job and couldnt afford the normal payments, now the spend amount of roughtly 300-400 came in claim as 1770 including court and solicitor fee.

 

claim details

1. the claimant is the Asignee of the debt from MBNA bank ("the assignor"). the claim represent the balance of payments under a LOAN agreement made between the assignor and the defendant regulated by consumer credit act 1974.

 

2. the Agreement provides for:

Payment of equal monthly instalments;

and

in default the assignor may recover the balance of the principle sum;

and

all charges provided for

 

3. in breach of the said agreement the defendant fault to make payment or comply with a default notice server the assignee. The agreement was terminated accordingly.

 

4. the balance payable by the defendant is 1615 which is claimed together with costs.

 

 

 

dont know if that matters, now firstly i didnt have any loan agreement with MBNA, it was a credit card

about this account, I remember I had received a transfer of debt to a compny from MBNA, i am not sure that I have received a default from Arrow though, will check and post it here.

 

any help to defend this heavily inflated figure will be appreciated.

 

as this is in court, shall i send the letters to arrow or to their solicitor?? or both?

[Docman]

You should send the letter to their solicitor, if that is who has filed the claim. In doing so, they are accepting service on behalf of their client.

 

If (it should be when in an ideal world, but we are dealing with a DCA) you get a reply within the next 14 days, you should send a copy of your request letter and the claimant's response to the court. Otherwise you will be filing your formal defence along the lines of non-compliance

[libra007]

Thanks Docman,

in the court claim , claimant name was arrow global and in the second box solicitor address. I sent to arrow global as it was the one who made the claim, but will send another copy to solicitor today just in case.

[libra007]

I sent the letters to Arrow and solicitor on 31st march and 2nd of April respectively copying the first letter, Since then I have not heard anything from them yet. and its 15th almost over the 14 day period, please advise how to file a defence in best possible way given this scenario?

[Docman]

Hi lib,

 

What is the name of the solicitor? Also, can you be specific about the name of the claimant (is it Arrow Global LTD or some other name)?

 

Did you acknowledge service with the court? You can do this online if the claim was from Northampton County Court.

[libra007]

solicitor is Cope's and claimant is Arrow Global LLC.

I have acknowledged the service and since wiriting to them i havent got any response from both. checked th delivery of letters both are received by them.

[Cornucopia]

It appears to me that Arrow are undertaking bulk litigation at the moment as I have recently received a claim but under different circumstances.

 

It is difficult to advise how you should formulate your defence as I am slightly confused as to what their claim is? You are saying it's a CC not a loan? It contains substantial charges? Could you clarify? Also, ring the court and check exactly what day you have to have your defence in because the risk is you will receive a CCJ by default if you don't adhere to the timescales.

 

Regards,

 

Corn x:)

[libra007]

hi Corn,

the account was credit card with MBNA, but in claims arrow says i didnt adhere to loan terms and installment werent paid. so made me confuse cause i never had any loan account with them.

yea i know i will get CCJ by default if dont file defence within 28 days. by charges i meant it was 300 balance on the card mount to 1615 according to Arrow. so it includes mostly charges.

 

If arrow doesnt reply, what should i say in my defence? or if they do reply today or tomorrow what will be good line of action then to file the defence? can it be done all online or have to go to the court?

[Cornucopia]

hi Corn,

the account was credit card with MBNA, but in claims arrow says i didnt adhere to loan terms and installment werent paid. so made me confuse cause i never had any loan account with them.

yea i know i will get CCJ by default if dont file defence within 28 days. by charges i meant it was 300 balance on the card mount to 1615 according to Arrow. so it includes mostly charges.

 

If arrow doesnt reply, what should i say in my defence? or if they do reply today or tomorrow what will be good line of action then to file the defence? can it be done all online or have to go to the court?

 

I am really sorry for the late reply but have been out after work!

 

Right, so MBNA assigned the credit card, Arrow have said "loan" which is clearly a mistake and they have inflated the balance by rather a lot! Have you SAR'd them???

 

I can help you put a defence together, but how long have we got? It sounds to me as if you have a defective default notice aswell. Can you dig it out? I would suggest a simple defence along the lines that, you, the Defendant is unable to submit a full defence due to the confusing nature of the Claimant's claim. You can write a simple two lined letter to Arrow's Solicitor saying that you need to take legal advice but your Counsel is unavailable until x date, therefore would they agree to an extension of seven days?

 

Can you submit the SAR immediately, if you have not already.

 

Let me know and I will get back to you.

 

 

Regards,

 

Corn x:)

[Docman]

The whole paperwork will probably be defective.

The reason for my query over the name is that the actual assignment may be to an entity called 'Arrow Global LLC', which is the American parent and is not registered with the Data protection people. All the paperwork is with Arrow Global Ltd. So first stage is to clarify which entity is the assignor and who is actually claiming against you in court.

Can I also clarify about what you put in your first post? By 'information letter', do you mean the letter under the Civil Procedure Rules (18.1)? If so, there is no need to spend £10 with a Subject Access Request. Now that the matter is before the court, different rules apply and the solicitor has to comply or face their claim being struck out.

[libra007]

I have checked the assignment notice and the court claimant names, both are same and are "Arrow Global LLC"

 

 

here is the letter i sent to them

 

Arrow Global LLC

3rd Floor

15 Old Bailey

LONDON

EC4M 7EF

In the Northampton County Court

Claimant -v- xxxxx

Claim Number: xxxx

 

 

 

March 31, 2008

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION

 

I have received a recent court claim from your organisation. In order to file a defence and counter claim I require some information. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below.

 

The information must be furnished within fourteen days of the receipt of this letter. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.

 

1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.

 

2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:

 

a. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations by your company, or by any previous creditor

 

b. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with ORIGINAL CREDITOR.

 

c. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

 

d. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

e. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

 

f. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

 

g. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

h. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

 

i. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement.

 

3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.

 

I will require this information within the next fourteen days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.

 

 

 

Yours sincerely,

xxxxxx

[libra007]

well anyone reply me ASAP here or PM, I have phoned the court they say the defence final day will be on Sunday and they are closed on Sunday so I have to submit today to make it to the system. ARROW global hasnt replies at all.

 

they suggested to fax the documents instead of doing online. they can confirm when I phone them after sending the fax

[Cornucopia]

well anyone reply me ASAP here or PM, I have phoned the court they say the defence final day will be on Sunday and they are closed on Sunday so I have to submit today to make it to the system. ARROW global hasnt replies at all.

 

they suggested to fax the documents instead of doing online. they can confirm when I phone them after sending the fax

 

Hi, it is outrageous that they haven't replied to you. I suggest you submit a defence along the lines suggested above and enclose your letter to Arrow Global and state that because they have failed to reply to your queries under the Civil Procedure Rules, you have been disadvantaged as a litigant in person and cannot submit a full defence.

 

Alternatively, you can ring Arrow and tell them they because they haven't replied to your CPR letter, you require a further 7 days to submit your defence. If you apply to the Court to do this, it will cost you money.

 

It is all a bit late in the day isn't it??? Draft something up and we'll have a look at it today.

 

Regards,

 

Corn x:(

[libra007]

thanks for your answer, shall i dispute the whole amount? or partly?

[Cornucopia]

thanks for your answer, shall i dispute the whole amount? or partly?

 

Sorry can you clarify. Are you talking about your acknowledgement of service? This is where you say you are defending in full, or not or whatever the case may be?

[libra007]

I have already filed the acknowledgment of service, yes i said that in full.

i was just fiddling with the MCOL in the defence section, they say i dont need to send any supporting evidence at this stage. so how I am going to send the supporting letters? and delivery confirmation. etc stuff. sorry for my ignorance but this is the first time for me.

 

or rather i file defence oniline fax the documents or fax whole the defence leave online thing aside.

[Cornucopia]

I have already filed the acknowledgment of service, yes i said that in full.

i was just fiddling with the MCOL in the defence section, they say i dont need to send any supporting evidence at this stage. so how I am going to send the supporting letters? and delivery confirmation. etc stuff. sorry for my ignorance but this is the first time for me.

 

or rather i file defence oniline fax the documents or fax whole the defence leave online thing aside.

 

Right, personally, I would, given how late it is, type up and fax the document actually. This way you can include your letter to Arrow and you can ring the court and make sure they have got it. I think it is very important that the court know they have not answered your questions under CPR because you are at a distinct disadvantage at this stage. The outcome of this hopefully will be that the court will stay the case and order Arrow Global to comply with your request and you will then be able to submit an amended defence.

[Docman]

The Civil procedure Rules provide an exemption from filing documents with the initial online stages. Once the case is transferred, you will have to submit your evidence.

 

I'm surprised at the timescale. Are you sure you have had 28 days since receiving the original N1 claim form?

 

I suggest you file a holding defence in view of the fact that Arrow haven't responded. I have copied a draft below that you might like to consider.

 

In the xxxxxxxx County Court

Claim number

Between

xxxxxxxxxxx- Claimant

and

XXXXXXXXX - Defendant

 

Defence

 

 

• Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the claimants Particulars of Claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof.

• The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

• The claimants’ particulars of claim discloses no legal cause of action and they are embarrassing to the defendant as the claimant's statement of case is insufficiently particularised and does not comply or even attempt to comply with CPR part 16. In this regard I wish to draw the courts attention to the following matters;

a) The Particulars of Claim are vague and insufficient and do not disclose an adequate statement of facts relating to or proceeding the alleged cause of action. No particulars are offered in relation to the nature of the written agreement referred to, the method the claimant calculated any outstanding sums due, or any default notices issued or any other matters necessary to substantiate the claimant’s claim.

b) A copy of the purported written agreement that the claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim, and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served attached to the claim form.

c) A copy of any evidence of both the scope and nature of any default, and proof of any amount outstanding on the alleged accounts, has not been served attached to the claim form.

4. Consequently, I deny all allegations on the particulars of claim and do not know what case I have to meet.

 

• Further to the case, on xx/xx/2007 I requested the disclosure of information pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules, which is vital to this case from the claimant. The information requested amounted to copies of the Agreement referred to in the particulars of claim and any default or termination notices, a transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, alleged repayments by myself and payments made by the original creditor. Also any other documents the Claimant seeks to rely on, including any default notices or termination notice, and a list of charges applied to the account.
   
  
  
• To date the claimant has ignored my request under the Civil Procedure Rules, and I have not received any such documentation requested. As a result it has proven difficult to compose this defence without disclosure of the information requested
   
  
  
• It is neither admitted nor denied that any Default Notice in the prescribed format was ever received and the Defendant puts the Claimant to strict proof that said document in the prescribed format was delivered to the defendant.
   
  
  
• Notwithstanding point 8, I put the claimant to strict proof that any default notice sent to me was valid. I note that to be valid, a default notice needs to be accurate in terms of both the scope and nature of breach and include an accurate figure required to remedy any such breach. The prescribed format for such document is laid down in Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) and Amendment regulations the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) (Amendment) Regulations 2004 (SI 2004/3237)

• Failure of a default notice to be accurate not only invalidates the default notice (Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain and Co - [2001] GCCR 2255) but is a unlawful rescission of contract which would not only prevent the court enforcing any alleged debt, but would also give rise to a potential counterclaim for damages where damage occurs to my credit rating (Kpohraror v Woolwich Building Society - [1996] 4 All ER 119)

• Without Disclosure of the relevant requested documentation I am unable to asses if I am indeed liable to the claimant, nor am I able to asses if the alleged agreement is properly executed, contain the required prescribed terms, or correct figures to make such an agreement enforceable by virtue of s127 Consumer Credit Act 1974

• In view of the matters pleaded above, I respectfully request that the court gives consideration to whether the claimant’s statement of case should be struck out as disclosing no reasonable grounds for bringing the claim, and/or that it fails to comply with CPR Part 16.

• Alternatively, I respectfully request a stay in proceedings until such time as the claimant complies with the requests outlined in paragraph 6 above or until the court orders its compliance with the same. I will then be in a position to file a fully particularised defence and counterclaim and will seek the courts permission to amend my statement of case accordingly.

Statement of Truth

I,xxxxx, believe the above statement to be true and factual

Signed …………………

Date

[libra007]

Thanks Docman

just a follow up question about the default notice, Arrow did sent me a default notice last year when the bought the debt from MBNA, given that can i include the statement above about the default notice?

[Cornucopia]

The Civil procedure Rules provide an exemption from filing documents with the initial online stages. Once the case is transferred, you will have to submit your evidence.

 

I'm surprised at the timescale. Are you sure you have had 28 days since receiving the original N1 claim form?

 

I suggest you file a holding defence in view of the fact that Arrow haven't responded. I have copied a draft below that you might like to consider.

 

 

In the xxxxxxxx County Court

Claim number

 

 

Between

 

 

xxxxxxxxxxx- Claimant

 

 

 

and

 

 

 

XXXXXXXXX - Defendant

 

 

 

 

 

Defence

 

 

 

• Except where otherwise mentioned in this defence, I neither admit nor deny any allegation made in the claimants Particulars of Claim and put the claimant to strict proof thereof.

• The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

• The claimants’ particulars of claim discloses no legal cause of action and they are embarrassing to the defendant as the claimant's statement of case is insufficiently particularised and does not comply or even attempt to comply with CPR part 16. In this regard I wish to draw the courts attention to the following matters;

a) The Particulars of Claim are vague and insufficient and do not disclose an adequate statement of facts relating to or proceeding the alleged cause of action. No particulars are offered in relation to the nature of the written agreement referred to, the method the claimant calculated any outstanding sums due, or any default notices issued or any other matters necessary to substantiate the claimant’s claim.

 

b) A copy of the purported written agreement that the claimant cites in the Particulars of Claim, and which appears to form the basis upon which these proceedings have been brought, has not been served attached to the claim form.

 

c) A copy of any evidence of both the scope and nature of any default, and proof of any amount outstanding on the alleged accounts, has not been served attached to the claim form.

 

 

4. Consequently, I deny all allegations on the particulars of claim and do not know what case I have to meet.

 

 

• Further to the case, on xx/xx/2007 I requested the disclosure of information pursuant to the Civil Procedure Rules, which is vital to this case from the claimant. The information requested amounted to copies of the Agreement referred to in the particulars of claim and any default or termination notices, a transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, alleged repayments by myself and payments made by the original creditor. Also any other documents the Claimant seeks to rely on, including any default notices or termination notice, and a list of charges applied to the account.
  
• To date the claimant has ignored my request under the Civil Procedure Rules, and I have not received any such documentation requested. As a result it has proven difficult to compose this defence without disclosure of the information requested
  
• It is neither admitted nor denied that any Default Notice in the prescribed format was ever received and the Defendant puts the Claimant to strict proof that said document in the prescribed format was delivered to the defendant.
  
• Notwithstanding point 8, I put the claimant to strict proof that any default notice sent to me was valid. I note that to be valid, a default notice needs to be accurate in terms of both the scope and nature of breach and include an accurate figure required to remedy any such breach. The prescribed format for such document is laid down in Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1561) and Amendment regulations the Consumer Credit (Enforcement, Default and Termination Notices) (Amendment) Regulations 2004 (SI 2004/3237)

• Failure of a default notice to be accurate not only invalidates the default notice (Woodchester Lease Management Services Ltd v Swain and Co - [2001] GCCR 2255) but is a unlawful rescission of contract which would not only prevent the court enforcing any alleged debt, but would also give rise to a potential counterclaim for damages where damage occurs to my credit rating (Kpohraror v Woolwich Building Society - [1996] 4 All ER 119)

• Without Disclosure of the relevant requested documentation I am unable to asses if I am indeed liable to the claimant, nor am I able to asses if the alleged agreement is properly executed, contain the required prescribed terms, or correct figures to make such an agreement enforceable by virtue of s127 Consumer Credit Act 1974

• In view of the matters pleaded above, I respectfully request that the court gives consideration to whether the claimant’s statement of case should be struck out as disclosing no reasonable grounds for bringing the claim, and/or that it fails to comply with CPR Part 16.

• Alternatively, I respectfully request a stay in proceedings until such time as the claimant complies with the requests outlined in paragraph 6 above or until the court orders its compliance with the same. I will then be in a position to file a fully particularised defence and counterclaim and will seek the courts permission to amend my statement of case accordingly.

 

 

Statement of Truth

 

 

I,xxxxx, believe the above statement to be true and factual

 

 

Signed …………………

 

Date

 

You beat me to it! I was just chopping up my own defence docs to put on but these are actually quite similar. I think that a default notice was received though?

 

Also, I was advised that I could provide back up information with the defence, by a lawyer, although you may be quite correct in what you are saying. Obviously at AQ stage, Libra will be able to add other things.

 

I agree with you re : timescales - Libra, when exactly was the date actually on the Court Claim documents? You have 5 days for service and after that is when your 28 days starts. So, say they were dated 28 March, you would have until 1 May to submit your defence. Could you clarify please?

 

Regards,

 

Corn x:)

[libra007]

sorry for being pain guys, whats the point 8 in

 

Notwithstanding point 8, I put the claimant to strict proof.....

 

shall i also add that to point 1 and 2 that I dont have any loan agreement with MBNA because it was credit card agreement ??

[Cornucopia]

sorry for being pain guys, whats the point 8 in

 

Notwithstanding point 8, I put the claimant to strict proof.....

 

shall i also add that to point 1 and 2 that I dont have any loan agreement with MBNA because it was credit card agreement ??

 

 

No, don't say it was a credit card agreement, say that you simply have never had loan agreement with MBNA and leave it at that.

 

Did you read my post about the dates for your defence (one post back), could make all the difference to rushing this out!!!

[libra007]

what does it mean?

 

• The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

corn, i checked the claim form, it is dated 18th mar, so my mistake opened the letter after few days and court is right the 28 days will be ended on sunday.

[Cornucopia]

what does it mean?

• The Defendant is embarrassed in pleading to the Particulars of Claim as it stands at present, inter alia: -

corn, i checked the claim form, it is dated 18th mar, so my mistake opened the letter after few days and court is right the 28 days will be ended on sunday.

 

 

In my defence, I chose to use the word "disadvantaged" but Docman has chosen a different way.

 

It basically means that you cannot plead a full defence because of lack of co-operation from the Defendant.

 

What a bum about the dates. You do know you can request an extension from Arrow but I think this would probably have to be in writing. An application to the Court would cost £75.00 (I think that is how much it is).

 

Look, it is very late to be doing this so I would do your level best with the defence, you will have opportunity to add to it and provide supporting evidence at Allocation Questionnaire stage. What you don't want is an automatic CCJ. You are a litigant in person and I am sure this will be taken into account. Have you checked what time the Court closes today because you want to be 100% they have got it???

[libra007]

Thanks Corn and Docman, I faxed the defence documents and confirm from the court that had received it.

 

let see whats the out come.

 

thanks again