Moorcroft unable to provide agreement

[221b]

Moorcroft chasing me for £1800 debt that thief of my phone abroad ran up.

 

Been in dispute with Voda over this for 1 1/2 years as they did nothing to stop thief's phone calls accelerating to this level in less than 24 hours.

 

Voda referred to Capquest Debt Recovery first of all.

 

I stupidly paid £500 as I got scared what with threats over the phone etc.

 

Didn't know what I know now!

 

Capquest gave up when I asked for copy of CCA and DOA. They provided neither and referred me back to Voda.

 

The next day (!) a letter came from Moorcroft Debt RA.

 

I sent off request for CCA and DOA to them. Actually not sure CCA relevant as it's a mobile phone contract...

 

They have written back outside of the 12 days saying they don' t have access to this info and that upon consultation with Voda, they have confirmed that I will have to contact Phones 4U for a copy of the agreement as my original contract was with them and as I originally took the handset out with them - back in 1999!

 

Do Moorcroft have to provide the DOA themselves and if they can't it's unenforceable? Would appreciate advice on this point.

 

Also, strictly, contract was never signed by me, but my dear old Mum (who's now 73) who got the phone for me as a gift back when I was a student.

 

Appreciate all advice and wisdom!

 

Many thanks

 

221b

[spamheed]

If Moorcroft are attempting to collect monies due under and agreement, then they are responsible for furnishing you with a copy of the agreement, or forwarding your request on to the original creditor, irrespective of whether it is governed by the CCA or not.

 

if they don't have the agreement, what exactly is it they are enforcing?

 

Stand your ground, make them prove that they have a right to collect on the debt.

[221b]

Thanks for that Spamheed!

 

Any further advice, most welcome...

 

221b

[ScarletPimpernel]

Alas, mobile phone contracts are not regulated by the Consumer Credit Act 1974, so there is no point in making a s.77/78 request.

 

However, if it is the case that you did not sign the contract then on what basis are they pursuing you? Unfortunately, however, if you go down this road, they may well end up going after your mother!

 

Usually mobile phone contracts include a clause that limits the customer's liability if the phone is stolen, provided it's reported to them within a predefined time. You'll need a copy contract to determine if this is the case.

[221b]

Thanks for that, Scarlet Pimpernel!

 

They are pursuing me (rather than my Mum) becuae the bills have always been paid by me, yet I have to admit they are constantly addressing all correspondence to my Mum, but at my address.

 

Now, I don't for one moment want them to go after my Mum obviously.

 

I asked Voda over a year ago for a copy of the original agreement, but they have never given it.

 

My very first contract (or my Mum's to be specific) was actually with Phones4U, though it was a Voda airtime contract and was so for the next 7 years.

 

So, my questions are:

 

1 Who do I now write to and ask for what?

 

2 Also, what do I do about Moorcroft - do I write back to them, and if so, saying what?

 

It does seem like everything is grinding to a halt, I must say, but would like to bring this to a conclusion. It's been occupying my headspace for 18 months now

 

Advice so far - most thankful to all.

 

I'd appreciate help on the above points.

 

Best wishes

 

221b

[spamheed]

you need to get them to prove they have a right to the debt, so write to the people who are demanding payment, the agreement is what they are trying to enforce. ask for a copy of the signed agreement and also a copy of the final statement from Voda, to prove that no unlawful charges have been applied.

 

If the original creditor cannot supply you with the agreement, then it's doubtful that Moorcroft will be able to.

 

You can use letter N from the templates library but you will need to amend it to remove the CCA references (as mobile debts are not covered by the CCA)

 

 

if this has been helpful, please feel freee to tip the scales

[221b]

Hi there

 

Many thanks for your reply Spamheed

 

I've already asked them for copy of the original agreement and the deed of assignment (as mentioned in post 1) and they have referred me to Phones 4U as both they and Voda don't have it.

 

I have already sent them the template letter along with my request for the above, so I don't really want to send the same letter again!

 

Can I ask them for it again, then? And if so, how do I couch the letter?

 

Many thanks

 

221b

[babybear39]

Going back to the theft...As mentioned in a previous post, you should only be liable for a very limited amount as long as you reported it in a timely fashion. What answers have you had from then regarding this?

[221b]

Oh dear!

 

Floodgates. Opened. Etc.

 

Been in wrangles with Voda since the incident happened - I was pickpocketed abroad having just had an operation. No phone. No money.

 

I rang within 24 hours of the theft - the minute I landed on UK soil in fact.

 

They say that bottom line is I should have called them immediately otherwise I'm liable. They don't have any anti-fraud software and they 'prioritise' all the alerts they do receive - clearly nearly 2 grand in less than a day isn't important enough They sent a text to my phone when it reached £500 and that was it, despite me never really going above £35 a month for the last 7 years...

 

Got BBC involved. Appeared on Working Lunch programme. Got Otelo involved (they are worse than useless, quite frankly and in the pay of the Mob companies so no surprise there).

 

Bill brought down to £800 odd by endless letters and the above.

 

Me still saying they should have done more to protect me.

 

Them denying any responsibility or duty of care.

 

Then the Debt RAs start with first Capquest then Moorcroft.

 

Voda no longer communicating on the dispute front. They send me the occasional bill showing that I've paid £500:mad: . Part of the £2,300 they're after is a lovely £500 they charged me for leaving them! Priceless!

 

They've never provided me with a copy of the original agreement.

 

Anyway, back to Moorcroft and the current situ!

 

What letter next and to whom?

 

Many thanks all!

 

221b

[babybear39]

This is turning into one of moorcroft and the mobile companie's silly soaps

 

Of course you did everything you were supposed to do. How can you call them with NO money? They do have a duty of care and could easily have suspended the line. Every account has a credit limit and this should have kicked in automatically on thier systems when the call charges reached it.

 

The only flimsy 'defence' they might have is that when calls are made abroad it takes a bit of time for the foreign carrier to pass the info. to the UK carrier. But their admition of sending a text to your phone when it reached £500 in charges would negate this

 

Did you report the theft to the foreign police and notify your travel insurance company?

[221b]

Didn't have TI

 

Reported to Station authorities - not sure if they were Police ( I was pickpocketed at Bruxelles Centrale) and filled out a form just before I started to make my way home but Voda not interested in that. They didn't seem to care whther I reported it or not, just that I pay up.

 

Have been through the rights and wrongs of it all a zillion times with Voda and they aint budging...

 

Just need to know who to write to, and what next!

 

Thanks so much...

 

221b

[babybear39]

Have you tried Trading Standards? Here's the link:

 

Trading Standards Central - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK

 

Did you get a copy of the form you filled out?

[221b]

I didn't unfortunately...

 

I was a little dazed and in shock from the theft/recent op and aware I was about to miss my train connecting me to my onward journey home.

 

At that point I thought perhaps I had dropped my things and hadn't really considered I'd been pickpocketed

 

In hindsight I'd have got a copy of the form had I been thinking straight.

 

Voda don't really care whether I reported it or not. They just want me to pay up...

[babybear39]

My best advice is to write to moorcroft advising that you have disputed the account explaining the grounds. Ask them for a statement of the account which is free of charge so you can check if they've added any charges.

 

Also write to the mobile company asking for a copy of their complaints procedure.

 

Send these letters recorded and keep copies of them for future reference.

[221b]

I've been through Voda's complaints procedure already - last year in fact - that's how I got to Otelo (the mobile ombudsman).

 

Voda say they have exhausted the complaints procedure which is why they've handed over to a debt recovery agency.

 

I get a bill from Voda from time to time - all the charges are for the phone calls the thief made plus the termination fee of £500 whacked on top.

 

HTH.

 

Thanks

 

221b

[babybear39]

Ok...Time for other avenues.

 

MP

 

Trading Standards:

 

Trading Standards Central - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK

 

Still write asking what I suggested to moorcroft. You never know, pigs might fly and they may see sense

 

Office of Fair Trading:

 

The Office of Fair Trading: making markets work well for consumers

 

Financial Ombudsman Service:

 

Financial Ombudsman Service

 

Advise in your letter to moorcroft that you're contacting these people