Please help with CCAs

[HeatherMc]

I don't know what to do, I am so confused. I need to reply to the Egg one and the HFC one by the 11th. Barclaycard is just carrying on as normal.

 

I do think it's a bit dodgy that Barclaycard haven't signed the agreement but then again I don't think I am brave enough to take it to court. Do you think it would be worth bluffing and telling them that I would take it to court and it is not an executed agreement?

 

With regards to HFC, is an agreement enforceable when it is barely legible and doesn't comply with that part of the consumer credit act? Would they just send me back a newly typed up agreement and copy my signature on to it?

 

And Egg, there are no where near as many T&Cs on the Egg agreement as there are on the other two. But maybe Barclaycard and HFC just gave more than required. What needs to be on it? Do they not need to supply all T&Cs?

 

Thanks guys.

[pt2537]

Hi Heather

 

Firstly, NO in its present form the HFC agreement is not enforcable

 

send em what i wrote out on the other post and wait and see what they do. chances are whatthey have sent you is all they have, otherwise they would have sent you a legible copy wouldnt they?

 

the other agreements i feel it is worth waiting for Peter Bard to look at

 

i feel as previously stated you would be foolish to take this to court on the basis that the agreement is improperly executed, after all as the consumer credit act clearly states a court can order the agreement valid and enforceable

 

Regards

paul

[HeatherMc]

Thanks again Paul. I will be going to the Post Office shortly to post my letter to HFC. I agree that if they hd more than that they would have sent it so will be interesting to see what they say.

[Curlyben]

Heather, quick question.

What date is the B'card one signed as it might be important ?

[kennyparkroad]

why do you have to reply by the 11th Heather?

 

thats the part i dont get.

 

 

and yes it would be risky taking it to Court, but in the mean time you can send a letter arguing that because its improperly executed, it is unenforceable, and see what they send back.

[HeatherMc]

Hi Kenny, don't know why I need to reply by the 11th. That's what they sent in the letter. If id on't someone from collections will be in touch apparently.

 

Any suggestions on a letter I can send to Barclaycard?

 

Heather

[HeatherMc]

Heather, quick question.

What date is the B'card one signed as it might be important ?

 

It was signed on the 21st of September 2004. Will this make a diffirence?

[Curlyben]

Well on pre 2005 agreements the terms are meant to come BEFORE the signatures.

I'm jut trying to dig out the proper Si for this.

 

PeterB has all this in his head

[pt2537]

(4) Subject to paragraphs (5) and (9) below, the information, statements of the protection and remedies, signature and

separate boxes which this regulation requires documents embodying regulated consumer credit agreements to contain,

shall be set out in the order given by paragraphs (a) to (f) below under, where applicable, the headings specified below--

 

(a) the nature of the agreement as set out in paragraph 1 of Schedule 1 to these Regulations;

 

(b) the parties to the agreement as set out in paragraph 2 of Schedule 1 to these Regulations;

 

[© under the heading "Key Financial Information", the financial and related particulars set out in paragraphs 6 to

8B, 11 to 14 and 15 to 17 of Schedule 1 to these Regulations;]

 

(d) under the heading "Other Financial Information", the financial and related particulars set out in paragraphs 3 to 5,

9, 10, 14A and 18 to 19A of Schedule 1 to these regulations;

 

(e) under the heading "Key Information"--

 

(i) the information set out in paragraphs 20 to 24 of Schedule 1 to these Regulations; and

 

(ii) the statements of protection and remedies set out in Schedule 2 to these Regulations; and

(f) the signature box and, where applicable, the separate box required by paragraph (7)(b) below;

 

The above uote is taken from Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1553)

now both me and Curlyben have been digging around on this and it looks like the document from barclay card does not comply with the above as the signature box should be at the end of the document from my reading of the above,

so im sure CB has a letter in his vast library to send

Regards

paul

[Curlyben]

Ok have a go with this one:

 

Formal Complaint

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

With reference to my previous letters, I wish to draw you attention to your company's lack of compliance with my legal request.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8.

You have failed to comply with request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.

 

As you may not be aware , failure to comply with this request within 12 working days renders the alleged debt UNENFORCEABLE in law. Furthermore, if this non-compliance continues for a further month then a summary, criminal offence is committed.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* may not pass the account to a third party.

* may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

After taking advice, I am of the opinion that your continued pursuit is in violation of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40 as well as breaching a number of the OFT Collection Guidelines.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and I am writing this letter to you on the assumption that you would prefer to do this than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I await your rapid response.

[HeatherMc]

Just back from the post office, sent the letter to HFC.

 

This all means nothing to me. I have read it over and over and tried translating it in to words I understand but I still can't make head nor tail of it. You guys are fab, don't know where i'd be without you.

 

So do we think that Barclaycard might not be enforceable? Any letter suggestions?

 

Thanks again.

[kennyparkroad]

thanks CB

 

this is the letter i used too heather.

[kennyparkroad]

PS - if "collections" do write to you,

 

you just inform them that the account is in dispute as noted with your letters, and enclose copies.

[pt2537]

Heather, we well i certainly after looking into this believe that the form of hte agreement doesnt comply with the Regulations which state what order the info must appear

 

since the prescribed terms appear on the second page after your signature it is not inline with the lay out of the regs

 

coupled with the fact that this is not executed properly makes it a more damming case against em

 

thats my thoughts

 

as previously stated, if you only had the not properly executed arguement i would be very cautious but this certainly adds weight

 

Regards

paul

[Curlyben]

So do we think that Barclaycard might not be enforceable? Yep see #34 as this adds to the case of being improperly executed as they haven't signed it.

 

Any letter suggestions? yep look up a bit

 

Thanks again.

hehehe

[kennyparkroad]

PPS

 

barclays,

 

just write to them and send them the sameish letter that CB has posted earlier.

 

 

 

With reference to my previous letters, I wish to draw you attention to your company's lack of compliance with my legal request.

 

On **DATE** I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under consumer credit Act 1974 s77/8.

 

You have failed to comply with request, and as such the account entered default on **DATE**.

 

What you have sent me is a document, that is not an exectued signed copy of the agreement for the account mentioned.

 

The document that you are obliged to send me is a true copy of the executed agreement that contained all of the prescribed terms, all other required terms and statutory notices and was signed by both your company and myself as defined in section 61(1) of CCA 74 and subsequent Statutory Instruments. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.

 

As you may not be aware , failure to comply with this request within 12 working days renders the alleged debt UNENFORCEABLE in law. Furthermore, if this non-compliance continues for a further month then a summary, criminal offence is committed.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

 

* may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

* may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

* may not pass the account to a third party.

* may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

* may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

Therefore this account has become unenforceable at law.

 

Consequentially any legal action you pursue will be averred as both UNLAWFUL and VEXATIOUS.

 

After taking advice, I am of the opinion that your continued pursuit is in violation of the Administration of Justice Act 1970 section 40 as well as breaching a number of the OFT Collection Guidelines.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities as I see fit.

You have 14 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter which is now a formal complaint.

 

I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and I am writing this letter to you on the assumption that you would prefer to do this than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I await your rapid response.

[kennyparkroad]

beat me too it there Ben.

 

thanks for this, heather is a friend of mine

[HeatherMc]

Wow, that's some letter CB. I am very impressed, hope they will be too. When you sent it Kenny what sort of reaction did you get? Have you sorted things out with Littlewoods yet?

[pt2537]

Hi KPR

 

Hows the Littlewoods case progressing ? any movements yet?

 

Regards

paul

 

PS good luck heather

[kennyparkroad]

no updates on littlewoods, have written to experian threatening them with court action under libel

 

waiting on comp secretary, and chairman to get back to me from littlewoods

 

but watching your POC's paul, i may need them!

[pt2537]

No worries mate, they are nowhere near finished, ive just got the facts down on paper at the mo,. its the legal arguements im working on now

 

still hope they will be finalised in the next week or so, ive got so much on at the mo its sort of falling to the bottom of the pile so to speak

 

still lets wait and see what the chairman says

 

Regards

paul

[Curlyben]

KPR you have to be faster to beat The Librarian

[pt2537]

nah you just need to learn how to cut and paste hehehehehe

[Curlyben]

:p:p:p:p

 

Rearrange this well known phrase or saying:

Off Bogg

 

Ps most of that one is a CB original

[HeatherMc]

Does anyone have a link to the consumer credit act so I can have a read through it?

 

Yeah I know i'm sad but I may aswell. No doubt hubby will be watching the football tonight so I will be bored either way, lol.