Hi all,

I have made a claim against EDF via Moneyclaim online,

I received a letter from the court saying that unless I submit particulars of claim

and show why court has jurisdiction, it will be discharged

and I will be made to pay hundreds of pounds in EDFs legal fees

I'm finding this whole process very biased towards those legally minded

but I thought the whole point of the small claims route was for the layperson.

I'm not sure what to put in the particulars,

I'm not legally minded at all,

I raised the claim after 6 months of complaints and dozens of letters with no success.

This was all while I was out of work due to ill health and struggling financially.

I have mental health issues,

I'm agoraphobic and at my worst can't even put my bins outside,

I'm terrified of talking on the phone.

The main issue is I believe they double billed me.

Their bills were difficult to understand but it looked like I was charged for some energy twice,

because of the readings.

They insisted they hadn't and

when I asked them to explain they all but called me retarded

and said they've done their duty to provide clear billing that all their other customers understand fine,

it's tough luck that I can't read them.

I'm unsure how to word this legally.

I'm not even certain I have been double billed,

their derogatory response makes me think I'm wrong

and I feel humiliated and stupid because I don't understand it and they won't explain it.

the amount owed was reasonably disputed.

I believed, and still believe to an extent, that I was double billed.

They also have me on the most expensive tariff for my energy consumption.

I complained about this in all of my communications.

They responded that I have to call them to get switched to a cheaper tariff.

I explained I'm unable to talk on the phone but again they were insulting

and derogatory and final response was tough, if I won't call, they won't switch tariff.

due to having mental difficulties that prevent me from communicating via telephone

I can't get the most affordable tariff.

I tried to switch online,

it was so easy and it turned out I'd save £60 a month,

that's a lot of money when you're out of work.

Three times the new supplier tried to switch me,

every time EDF blocked it,

forcing me to stay with them,

demanding money I disputed and

charging me the highest they can for electricity and gas,

they took advantage of my mental disabilities

and have bullied me into staying with them paying extortionate rates for my energy.

I had no option but to take legal action.

Now the court is threatening to dismiss the case.

EDF solicitors are sending threatening letters saying they are going to take action

that will result in me paying thousands of pounds in their fees

and EDF are taking enforcement action,

I got a visit from Grosvenor Legal Services today.

My original claim was for the amount I believed I was charged double for,

plus £60 a month from the time I complained about my tariff until claim date,

this is because the new supplier quoted a saving of £60 a month,

that's how much EDF has cost me by blocking my transfer

and by refusing to switch me to the best tariff for my circumstances because I won't call them.

I want the court to stop them from blocking my transfer,

I believe I have a right to choose the most affordable energy supplier for me,

not remain with these ignorant bullies that are bleeding me.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

This whole situation is making me so ill,

I'm already on medication,

my health is getting worse

and I'm getting suicidal, the court threatening to dismiss my case

added to threats from Grosvenor Legal Services, is too much for me to cope with.

On a final note,

I can't go to citizens advice because I am homebound.

When I'm well I can go outside but right now I can't even step out with my bins in daylight,

I do it in the middle of the night and I can't talk on the phone,

the only thing I can manage right now is writing.

Hi,

Can you please type up on here (less personal details) exactly what it was you originally wrote in the "Particulars of Claim" section of the Court Claim Form?

Hi,

 

Can you please type up on here (less personal details) exactly what it was you originally wrote in the "Particulars of Claim" section of the Court Claim Form?

Yeah sure, it was an online claim form via moneyclaim.gov.uk, it wasn't very much I'm afraid:

"Statement of Claim:

Unfair and improper billing.

Not applying the most affordable or appropriate tariff for my usage or circumstances.

Preventing me from switching to an energy provider with fair and reasonable billing practices and subsequently from obtaining an affordable tariff for energy usage.

Cost of raising action.

Interest at the standard daily rate."

It's pretty rubbish I know but I don't know what to put regarding legal particulars. Also realise not put anything about dealing with person suffering financial hardship and mental health issues but again don't know what to write or how to write it.

Don't know if it helps but this is the actual wording of the letter:

It is ordered that:

1. Unless the Claimant files and serves amended particulars of claim specifying the legal basis of their claim and the basis on which the county court has jurisdiction to deal with the claim (the cause of action) by 2nd September 2014 the claim will be struck out.

2. This order has been made on an application without notice. Any party affected by the order may apply to the Court, not more than 7 days after the day on which the order was served, to have the order set aside, varied or stayed.

How much are you claiming for? And how have you calculated this amount?

The reason the Court have ordered this is because your Particulars (the bit Ganymede asked you about) don't show a legal basis for making the claim, e.g. breach of contract, negligence etc etc.

The Particulars of Claim need to show how " Unfair and improper billing. Not applying the most affordable or appropriate tariff for my usage or circumstances. Preventing me from switching to an energy provider with fair and reasonable billing practices and subsequently from obtaining an affordable tariff for energy usage " led to you losing £XXX.XX (the amount of your Claim) and therefore you are now suing EDF for.

I don't wish to be insensitive but, given the nature of this case and your personal difficulties, you may wish to show the bills and tariff to a friend or family member who can have a second look at them to see if there is anything you've misinterpreted or misunderstood. It's worth doing this at an early stage because most judges are very intelligent and well versed at interpreting documents and they may simply not see the difficulty you had.

The particulars of claim need to briefly state that you suffered X because of Y, contrary to rule/law Z. The POC is very brief and does not go in to any of the whys and wherefores.

For example,

I suffered a loss of £X.XX because EDF would not reduce my tariff to the cheapest available, contrary to OFGEM rules. (Or whatever it is contrary to).

The loss is X.

The reason is Y.

The rule is Z.

Your particulars of claim will then need to be proven as the case proceeds.

So, if you say that you have been unfairly billed you will need to show that a cheaper tariff was available and that they should have put you on it without having to telephone them to do so. You will need to show that you requested the lower tariff, and that their failure to put you on it led to you paying £XX.XX extra.

The proof could be:

Copies of your tariff.

Copies of the cheaper tariff.

Letters showing your request to change it

Their response that they only accept such requests by phone

Some legal requirement that they should accept written requests for example.

Etc. for each point in your particulars.

You are a Litigant In Person so you do not need to quote law. The judge will help you with that.

Therefore, only put in the POC what you can prove.

But you do need to follow a procedure called the Civil Procedure Rules. Failure to do so means you are unlikely to succeed.

I'd be minded to abandon this action, by either telling the court directly or just leaving it long enough before the claim is simply dismissed.

You can't sue someone just because you **think** they've done something wrong. You need to start with CAB, who can word/explain things better to you/EDF, then they can help you go to OFGEM if you're still not happy.

Then, and only then, you could take legal action.

Once EDF send a solicitor to your local court, costs are going to really mount up against you.

Have you written a Letter Before Claim, (Civil Procedure Rules)? Can you justify the exact amounts claimed, or are you taking a stab in the dark/rounded numbers up/down, do you have evidence? Have you shared the evidence with EDF? The whole idea of a court is as a last resort. You've missed a lot of steps out along the way, (especially OFGEM reporting), and a court may not like that.

With respect, I think if you can't fully understand your energy bill, (for whatever reason), I think you're going to struggle to progress a civil claim alone, so you should consider instructing your own solicitor or as suggested, speak to friends/family who may be more knowledgeable.

I very much doubt that they've took advantage of your mental difficulties, it sounds more like a case of you struggling to tell them what your problem is, or them understanding what you're trying to say. I'm sure they have tried to help, but it sounds as though you simply don't believe what they're telling you. You need to find somebody who can help you.

I don't wish to be insensitive but, given the nature of this case and your personal difficulties, you may wish to show the bills and tariff to a friend or family member who can have a second look at them to see if there is anything you've misinterpreted or misunderstood. It's worth doing this at an early stage because most judges are very intelligent and well versed at interpreting documents and they may simply not see the difficulty you had.

No it's not insensitive at all. It's a good suggestion. Unfortunately I live alone and I'm in south of England while all my family are up north. I can't even talk to them on the phone, they all have own problems and don't want to listen to mine. Part of the reason for becoming so agoraphobic is I've been so socially isolated with no support.

So when I got too ill to work debts started piling up, I couldn't handle things and the situation with EDF has just been the tipping point. All I wanted was for them to put me on the beat tariff for my circumstances, then when they wouldn't do that, to let me switch to a supplier that would ease my financial burden.

I still also think I've been billed twice for some units but instead of explain it to me they got all defensive of their bills and all but callled me an idiot - after all their thousands of customers understand the bills just fine, so I'm the problem not their billing.

I've emailed citizens advice but not heard from them. It takes a lot for me to build up the courage to make a phone call, sometimes I feel like I'd rather die than talk on the phone, especially regarding financial matters, but the 2 occasions I mustered the courage to call,I couldn't get through.

I've no idea where to start forming a legal argument. I thought the whole point of small claims was for the lay person.

I'm also unsure if I should include my health problems in my particulars and if so how to word it.

EDF were aware I had problems, they weren't sympathetic, they were the opposite in fact. Their insistence that I call them after telling them I can't talk on the phone, telling me all their other customers understand their bills just fine and it's my fault I don't and that they've met their obligation to provide clear and legible bills, if I can't understand them it's my problem.

I'd be minded to abandon this action, by either telling the court directly or just leaving it long enough before the claim is simply dismissed.

 

You can't sue someone just because you **think** they've done something wrong. You need to start with CAB, who can word/explain things better to you/EDF, then they can help you go to OFGEM if you're still not happy.

 

Then, and only then, you could take legal action.

 

Once EDF send a solicitor to your local court, costs are going to really mount up against you.

 

Have you written a Letter Before Claim, (Civil Procedure Rules)? Can you justify the exact amounts claimed, or are you taking a stab in the dark/rounded numbers up/down, do you have evidence? Have you shared the evidence with EDF? The whole idea of a court is as a last resort. You've missed a lot of steps out along the way, (especially OFGEM reporting), and a court may not like that.

 

With respect, I think if you can't fully understand your energy bill, (for whatever reason), I think you're going to struggle to progress a civil claim alone, so you should consider instructing your own solicitor or as suggested, speak to friends/family who may be more knowledgeable.

 

I very much doubt that they've took advantage of your mental difficulties, it sounds more like a case of you struggling to tell them what your problem is, or them understanding what you're trying to say. I'm sure they have tried to help, but it sounds as though you simply don't believe what they're telling you. You need to find somebody who can help you.

I did send them a letter before action and I explained to them exactly why I believed I'd been double billed. Edit: Just checked, sent Formal Notice Before Action on 12th March this year.

Basically the units I was charged for overlapped on 2 consecutive bill. When I explained this they became very defensive of their billing and said I was wrong without explaining why.

My letter before action was clear regarding the extra costs I'd incurred by their refusal to change my tariff without calling them, after I'd told them I can't speak on the phone.

They do switches all the time via the internet, this was nothing but deliberate awkwardness and spite, saying they couldn't switch me because I wouldn't call them?

I'm pretty sure I did do all the proper steps first, apologies for not explaining that.

My claim included the difference I would have saved if they hadn't blocked my transfer/switch, I can show that as I was given a cost from what would have been my new provider. It also included the charge for the units that overlapped on the 2 bills (subtracted the units, multiplied by the unit charge, added the VAT). I think it's correct, maths isn't my strong point.

Edit: Heres a copy of what I put in my 3rd complaint to them, by this point it was escalated to the CS Director, the highest level of escalation within EDF:

"1st July 2013

Electric 68083 - 68242, Gas 866 to 876, Total bill £45.54

I paid £428.02

26th August 2013

Electric 68242 to 68630, Gas 876 to 894, total £104.67

18th November 2013

Electric 68083 to 68799 AND 68799 to 73905

Gas 866 to 869 AND 869 to 892, Total bill £784.77

My understanding is that you have charged me TWICE for electricity and gas because on 18th November 2013 you billed for units billed previously on 26th August 2013 and 1st July 2013."

EDF did not reply with any explanation of the above, just point blank told me I was wrong and then when I complained again that's when they get all defensive and insulting. I really don't understand how I've got this wrong.

My notice before action was emailed on 12th March, they got it is I got an auto-acknowledgement saying aim to reply within 5 working days. I gave them until 25th March to respond. To date I received no response to this and I didn't go ahead with the claim until 6th April. They just completely ignored me.

I did write to OFGEM and I have their response so can forward to the Court. They thanked me for the Information, said they might consider it in their evaluation of EDF, and they might take action against them etc etc, but they don't deal with individual cases, they referred me to Consumer Direct.

So I have all that information and can submit it to the Court. It was my understanding however that you submitted evidence at the hearing stage, not at the initial claim stage? Should I submit all emails, letters and copy bills with the POC then?

I also have evidence of EDF ignoring my complaints, taking 3 months to respond to complaint emails despite their complaints charter claiming they'd respond in 5 working days. For that reason the Energy Ombudsman were useless. Because a final response hadn't been issued they couldn't intervene. Also got letter from Energy Ombudsman. I think they could have still intervened based on time since I complained but they didn't, thankfully I have letter from them saying wouldn't help.

I spent almost a YEAR in communication with EDF trying to sort this out, waiting months for responses to my complaints. All the while on the most expensive tariff they have and them preventing me from switching to a supplier than could ease my financial hardship.

I believe I have a real case here. At the end of the day I no longer want EDF to be my supplier, they won't let me switch, I feel I've tried everything to get away from them but they won't stop, so I'm turning to the Court to help me get away from them.

I also want an explanation for what I believe is double-billing without being bullied and insulted and threated to keep quiet and go away. I'm not going away unit they give me the explanation and let me decide who I want as my energy supplier and stop treating me like a cash cow to the detriment of my health.

The particulars of claim need to briefly state that you suffered X because of Y, contrary to rule/law Z. The POC is very brief and does not go in to any of the whys and wherefores.

 

For example,

I suffered a loss of £X.XX because EDF would not reduce my tariff to the cheapest available, contrary to OFGEM rules. (Or whatever it is contrary to).

The loss is X.

The reason is Y.

The rule is Z.

 

Your particulars of claim will then need to be proven as the case proceeds.

 

So, if you say that you have been unfairly billed you will need to show that a cheaper tariff was available and that they should have put you on it without having to telephone them to do so. You will need to show that you requested the lower tariff, and that their failure to put you on it led to you paying £XX.XX extra.

 

The proof could be:

Copies of your tariff.

Copies of the cheaper tariff.

Letters showing your request to change it

Their response that they only accept such requests by phone

Some legal requirement that they should accept written requests for example.

 

Etc. for each point in your particulars.

 

You are a Litigant In Person so you do not need to quote law. The judge will help you with that.

 

Therefore, only put in the POC what you can prove.

 

But you do need to follow a procedure called the Civil Procedure Rules. Failure to do so means you are unlikely to succeed.

Thank you (and everyone) so much, that's really helpful. I've also had a look at the civil procedures regarding paarticulars of claim and think I understand what is required, so will draft something up.

I understand this could get costly but I really do believe I have a case here and don't see much option. They refuse to change my tariff and they won't let me go elsewhere.

Does anyone know if there is a limit on outstanding balance above which they can block a transfer? At the time I tried switching it was just over £300 in arrears, about £90 of which was disputed as units I believed were billed twice.

Another thing (sorry for the walls of text), the amount I believe I'm owed is more than it was at the time I raised the action which was almost 4 months ago. Because the new supplier said they'd save me £X a year by switching, I divided this by 12 and multiplied by the number of months since I first requested a switch.

It's now more because 3 months have passed, do I put the new amount on my amended POC?

Thanks in advance.

And also EDF has raised a counterclaim for the outstanding balance (which isn't accurate anymore as I made payments), don't know what impact that has on my claim.

Seems a bit strange that they have made a counterclaim for the balance and also sent Grosvenor Legal round to my door the other day. Can they even do that?

You need to instruct professional legal advice. This is starting to run away from you and IMO you still don't fully understand your own case, and are making far too many assumptions and estimates, rather than solid figures, which a court will need.

edf

You need to instruct professional legal advice. This is starting to run away from you and IMO you still don't fully understand your own case, and are making far too many assumptions and estimates, rather than solid figures, which a court will need.

I've not made assumptions, that was you, assuming I hadn't tried contacting certain parties, hadn't followed the correct process etc. and my figures aren't estimates, they are solid calculations.

I asked for help with the particulars of claim, not criticism.