Here is WRAGGES 6 PAGE DEFENCE - have a read

[alice-rose]

very many thanks for your kind advice jan

 

I will do that now.

 

alice xxx

[alice-rose]

hi jan,

 

i have completed the advanced search, as you suggested,

and have only found one other claimant at my local court.

her claim, like mine, has been stayed,

and her court date was september.

 

so I suppose the only way for me to find out what the

district judge

thinks about the bank claims

is by me phoning the courts tomorrow, and asking the clerk

the direct question.

 

i suppose its worth a try, and i haven't got anything to lose.

 

i will report back on here.

 

alice in hobble-land xxx

[jansus]

there is a seperate forum on cases that have been stayed (under general section)I have thread there as well so may be worth reading up in that section over the next couple of days.

 

Jan

[alice-rose]

hi everyone

 

my claim has been on the back-burner for the past few days.

 

still not got round to ringing my local court about the stay situation.

 

I managed to damage the tendon in my calf on friday night. :o

 

Howwwwl howl howl howl Ooooohhhh the agony..... going woozey

thinking about it again.

 

the pain was excruciating.....

like the worst possible cramp you could ever imagine

but 100 times worse

almost passed out

and went into shock.... icy cold.... teeth chattering.....

 

will try to muster/summon the energy tomorrow

 

alice in hobble (hobbit) land

xxx

[alice-rose]

Just spoken with my local court,

 

and they still haven't received my letter in response to theirs for an update on the status of my case.

 

The courts letter to me was dated 2nd August, posted out by 2nd class post, and took almost two weeks to arrive - reaching me on 13 August,

I replied and posted back the same day.

 

I was advised:-

 

No my letter hadn't reached them, wasn't logged on to the system, and wasn't on my file, but there was a back log of 7 days correspondence.

 

I asked about the Stay which had been applied to my Claim.

 

"the District Judge is making no decisions on claims."

 

"you should have received a Judgment Order by now from

the Judge, advising that your case has been stayed" YES received that

"and that your hearing has been VACATED ".

she advised me that the Judgment should state: My hearing had been vacated

 

but there was NO MENTION of my hearing being VACATED..... ???????

 

see above JUDGMENT ORDER

on

Thread 221

 

Does this mean that I now have to write to the Court to request they confirm that my hearing has been vacated ???

due incidentally - in a few weeks time

as there is no mention of this in my Judgment Order

 

I am going to send another copy of my letter to the Court,

maybe i should request confirmation that my hearing has been vacated.

 

or Maybe I am just being very dim with all this legal gobble-de-gook

 

any advice would be very much appreciated.

 

thankyou

 

alice xxx

[jansus]

"Alice"

 

I posted on my thread that vacated means the same as stayed- my letter also took a long time to come from the court.

 

If this is at the courts own initiative then you may not have to pay the fee. I can only tell you that in williams case as well the fact that you are willing to appeal against the stay or go into court when there may be a stay seems to frighten them. But it is early days so who can tell which way it will go?

 

what I did was file the N244 you can down load this - use the amended info on here as section C

 

read it carefully and add or amend anything you think will be relevant.

 

send to the court - then wait and see what they say.

 

In the mean-time email or write to Wragges and A&L and tell them that you do intend to appeal against the stay and have done so through the correct court system.

 

Can you remind me where you are with other dates re. Court bundles - hearing dates etc ( sorry dont have time to read all through thread as I am supposed to be doing other paperwork today?!) The Stay - Here is the application grounds for the removal of the stay

 

 

 

 

 

Xj

[cluel3ss]

Hiya's, sorry i not been online for awhile, couldnt pay the bill blahhhhhhhhhh. Ty alice and yes this forum was a light at the end of the tunnel, so glad i found this place. Anyways just thought i would let u know that Romford Court is not granting any banks a stay, i heard it from the horses mouth today (24th Aug), i recieved a letter from A&L today(24th Aug) saying that they are applying for a stay, well good luck to them cos the Court is saying NO lol.

 

Take care Debs xxx

[squarebob]

Well it looks as though we'll all have to have our cases moved to Romford. If not, then I see the 'horse's head' and an offer the banks' cannot refuse to accept coming into play!

Maureese xx

[alice-rose]

Well it looks as though we'll all have to have our cases moved to Romford. If not, then I see the 'horse's head' and an offer the banks' cannot refuse to accept coming into play!

Maureese xx

 

 

is this a madame maureese crystal ball prediction ???

 

alice in limbo-land xxx

[jansus]

Find out here if your local court is staying claims

 

"alice" thought posts 320 and 321 were relevant on this thread

 

Jan

[alice-rose]

[alice-rose]

don't you think this is breathtakingly exquisite !

[jansus]

quite beautiful!

 

jan

[jansus]

Alice

 

more congratulations due - another win today - so KEEP GOING -Jan

[alice-rose]

first of all - my thanks to my friends on here for their continued support

 

 

I phoned my local court this morning, initially to see if they have yet received my reply to them dated 13 August - and yes, 3rd time lucky..... they confirmed this morning they have received it.

 

whilst on, I asked about the Stay situation.

 

today I was advised it would cost me £35. (£65. last time i asked)

and i need to complete form N244.

 

I asked if there had been many stay requests,

I was advised there had been a lot of telephone calls, but she wasn't sure if they had actually applied for a stay.

 

I asked if there was a time limit on when i could apply for a Stay, and was advised - No, theres no time limit. apply whenever you want.

 

So then lets find Form N244

 

 

alice in stay-land xxx

[jansus]

I think from what I have read that the £35.00 is if you tick the box with no- hearing.

 

I sent my cheque but it was never banked.

 

Go for it Alice!!

 

 

 

Jan

[alice-rose]

Hi everyone

 

I received this standard letter from wragges today.

 

 

dated 7 September 2007

 

Dear

 

Your Claim -

No claim number, or reference, so assume this is a Standard letter which has gone out to all who are currently claiming.

Your case in relation to charges for unauthorised overdrafts (meaning paid items, failed items and unauthorised overdraft charges) is currently pending before the Court. We are writing to you on behalf of Alliance & Leicester in respect of a test case in relation to these charges.

 

We wrote to you recently to make you a goodwill offer as full and final settlement in relation to your complaint about your charges.

 

Although Alliance & Leiceter believe that the charges are fair, transparent and lawful, a number of current account providers have now become involved in legal proceedings with the Office of Fair Trading ("OFT") in relation to charges for unauthorised overdrafts. We believe this test case will rsolve the legal issues regarding the fairness and legality of your charges.

 

Alliance & Leicester is not one of the banks and building societies in the test case. However, this is an issue where customers, as well as the financial services industry as a whole, would welcome legal clarity.

 

Alliance & Leicester has asked the Financial Services Authority ("FSA") to suspend the normal timetable for dealing with bank charges complaints, and the FSA has agreed to this request subject to conditions that protect your rights.

 

In view of the test case Alliance & Leicester has also asked both the Financial Ombudsman Service ("FOS") and the courts not to proceed with any other case they are hearing until the test case is resolved. FOS has indicatd that as a general proposition it will indeed not proceed with cases which rely on the legal issues being considered in the test case. You should be aware that we have obtained a stay in proceedings in respect of your action until resolution of the legal proceedings with the OFT.

 

 

However, the goodwill offer Wragge & Co made to you on behalf of Alliance & Leicester still stands. If you wish to take up this offer, we will take this as "full and final" setlement of your complaint and you must contact us within 2 months from the date of this leter. If you accept this as a "full and final" settlement, it is highly unlikely you would be awarded a further sum at a later stage even if the test case established you were otherwise entitled to a larger amount. Though this does not preclude you asking for repayment of any future charges if the Court finds they are unlawful.

 

 

Once the legal proceedings between the OFT and the banks finish, Alliance & Leicester will resolve your complaint as quickly as possible, applying the test case principles. As a general matter, Alliance & Leicester will ensure that your claim will not be adversely affected by the stay of your Court proceedings.

 

We can asure you that Alliance & Leicester has registered and stored your complaint. Please retain your bank records, as this will make it easier for you to support your comcplaint on resolution of the test case.

 

The FSA requires Alliance & Leicester to ensure that your complaint will not be adversely affected by the delay in dealing with it. Either Wragge & Co. or Alliance & Leicester will keep you updated appropriately about the proceedings with the OFT

 

We hope the enclosed Frequently Asked Questions will clarify some of your questions about this. You can also check the most up to date position on Alliance & Leicester's website.

 

Alternaively you can find more information on the 'test case' through the following:

The Financial Service Authority - Financial Services Authority

The Office of Fair Trading -www.oft.gov.uk

the Financial Ombudsman Service -www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk

 

Yours faithfully

 

signed Wragge & Co

 

 

enclosed: the same Frequently Asked Question on the test case they enclosed with the last letter they sent out.

 

 

alice-in-about-to-apply-to-have-stay-lifted-land !

 

xxx

[dewhit20]

Hi Alice,

Poor DWD has received the same letter see thread "Patience (not) v A&L".

Is there no end to their dirty tricks?

Carry on the fight, thats what I say!

Love KayX

[cazawilson]

Hi all

 

Just back from a lovley holiday in sunny Spain. Been reading loads trying to keep up with people. Saturday morning got almost exactly the same letter from Wragges, my court case is on 17th, next Monday, spoke to the courts today (Bedford) and the Judge has stayed the case.

 

Does anyone know how long the outcome will take, are we looking at early next year or somewhere near the middle:confused:. Getting really fed up now.

 

Caza

[Bigmark]

Lloyds TSB has become the first High Street bank to cut its charges for unauthorised overdrafts in the face of a continuing customer revolt.

 

The bank, one of eight facing a High Court test case next year, will introduce the charges on 2 November.

Lloyds will cut its interest rates for unauthorised borrowing by about a third and charges for going into the red and bouncing cheques will also be reduced.

Other High Street lenders may now also cut their charges, analysts said.

Richard Hunter of stockbrokers Hargreaves Lansdown said that Lloyd's move was probably the "thin end of the wedge".

Refunds

Earlier this year, the bank revealed that it had had to refund £36m to customers in the first half of 2007, after they threatened to sue for the return of allegedly unfair charges on their unauthorised overdrafts.

BANK REFUNDS IN 2007

Barclays - £87m

HSBC - £116m

HBOS - £79m

Lloyds TSB - £36m

RBS - £81m

 

Source: bank interim results

 

Between them, all the High Street banks and building societies have returned an estimated £570m in the same period.

Lloyds TSB said, however, that its decision to reduce the cost of running into the red for its current account holders was simply a response to consumer feedback, and not an attempt to anticipate the outcome of next year's test case with the Office of Fair Trading.

"We want to help our customers avoid accidentally slipping into the red and are giving them the tools to do just that," said Ian Larkin of Lloyds TSB.

"We understand that it can sometimes be difficult for customers to keep tabs on their account and we want to make it easier," he added.

Lower charges

Instead of charging customers £30 a day if they go into the red without permission, the bank will now charge £15 a month and then between £6 and £20 a day on a sliding scale, according to the size of the overdraft.

Its charge for bouncing a cheque, standing order, or direct debit is going down from £35 to £20.

And the interest rate applied to the unauthorised borrowing will be cut by about a third to bring it into line with the bank's interest rate for authorised borrowing.

The bank believes that most of its customers who go into the red do so accidentally.

So any customer in this position will given until 3.30 pm that day to get in contact with the bank and make up the shortfall, thus avoiding any charges at all.

To help them do this the bank is offering an extra text message service, which will alert customers if they are within £50 of their overdraft limit, or if they have actually gone over it.

"Customers who do accidentally go over their limit, will be better off as they have the chance to top up their account and get themselves back on track," said Mr Larkin.

Scepticism

The move by Lloyds TSB was greeted with scepticism by the Consumer Action Group (CAG), which has been leading the customer revolt against bank charges.

Marc Gander of the CAG said the revised charges were still excessive.

"I think they are still well over the top," he said. "On the basis that the real cost of sending a letter or bouncing a cheque is about £2.00, then the mark-up is still very high."

will A&L follow ......?

 

we support A&L freedom fighters

[alice-rose]

THANKYOU Bigmark

 

for very kindly posting this information.

 

alice xxx

[tangated]

Hi Alice

I have had a similar response from Wragge - also a letter today from the local courts advising of a 'stay of execution' due to the big test case.

I am in the process of responding as the court manager has given each party permission to apply to remove the stay, giving reasons as to why the claim should proceed before the ultimate detrmination of the test case.

 

My thoughts are: they have agreed in principle - Section 20 of their defence - to pay anything in excess of £12 - so why not settle the individual case in question? A&L have already offered 2/3rds of my claim plus court fees. What are your views?

Tangated

[allen0601]

Hi everyone

 

I received this standard letter from wragges today.

 

 

dated 7 September 2007

 

Dear

 

Your Claim -

No claim number, or reference, so assume this is a Standard letter which has gone out to all who are currently claiming.

 

Your case in relation to charges for unauthorised overdrafts (meaning paid items, failed items and unauthorised overdraft charges) is currently pending before the Court. We are writing to you on behalf of Alliance & Leicester in respect of a test case in relation to these charges.

 

We wrote to you recently to make you a goodwill offer as full and final settlement in relation to your complaint about your charges.

 

Although Alliance & Leiceter believe that the charges are fair, transparent and lawful, a number of current account providers have now become involved in legal proceedings with the Office of Fair Trading ("OFT") in relation to charges for unauthorised overdrafts. We believe this test case will rsolve the legal issues regarding the fairness and legality of your charges.

 

Alliance & Leicester is not one of the banks and building societies in the test case. However, this is an issue where customers, as well as the financial services industry as a whole, would welcome legal clarity.

 

Alliance & Leicester has asked the Financial Services Authority ("FSA") to suspend the normal timetable for dealing with bank charges complaints, and the FSA has agreed to this request subject to conditions that protect your rights.

 

In view of the test case Alliance & Leicester has also asked both the Financial Ombudsman Service ("FOS") and the courts not to proceed with any other case they are hearing until the test case is resolved. FOS has indicatd that as a general proposition it will indeed not proceed with cases which rely on the legal issues being considered in the test case. You should be aware that we have obtained a stay in proceedings in respect of your action until resolution of the legal proceedings with the OFT.

 

 

However, the goodwill offer Wragge & Co made to you on behalf of Alliance & Leicester still stands. If you wish to take up this offer, we will take this as "full and final" setlement of your complaint and you must contact us within 2 months from the date of this leter. If you accept this as a "full and final" settlement, it is highly unlikely you would be awarded a further sum at a later stage even if the test case established you were otherwise entitled to a larger amount. Though this does not preclude you asking for repayment of any future charges if the Court finds they are unlawful.

 

 

Once the legal proceedings between the OFT and the banks finish, Alliance & Leicester will resolve your complaint as quickly as possible, applying the test case principles. As a general matter, Alliance & Leicester will ensure that your claim will not be adversely affected by the stay of your Court proceedings.

 

We can asure you that Alliance & Leicester has registered and stored your complaint. Please retain your bank records, as this will make it easier for you to support your comcplaint on resolution of the test case.

 

The FSA requires Alliance & Leicester to ensure that your complaint will not be adversely affected by the delay in dealing with it. Either Wragge & Co. or Alliance & Leicester will keep you updated appropriately about the proceedings with the OFT

 

We hope the enclosed Frequently Asked Questions will clarify some of your questions about this. You can also check the most up to date position on Alliance & Leicester's website.

 

Alternaively you can find more information on the 'test case' through the following:

The Financial Service Authority - Financial Services Authority

The Office of Fair Trading -www.oft.gov.uk

the Financial Ombudsman Service -www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk

 

Yours faithfully

 

signed Wragge & Co

 

 

enclosed: the same Frequently Asked Question on the test case they enclosed with the last letter they sent out.

 

 

alice-in-about-to-apply-to-have-stay-lifted-land !

 

xxx

 

Hi Alice i too that the same letter from wragges but without the paragraph about the good will guesture still standing! apart from that bit mine reads the same word for word!

Nicky

[jansus]

!!!!! OFT could drop test case !!!!!!!

[jansus]

Sorry Alice

 

more light reading !

hadyanth vs Lloyds TSB - Goodbye fingernails...

 

last few pages

 

jan