DG dirty tricks? ****WON****

[lizvp]

ah phoenix, fowey may sound nice, but parking? and congestion? to say nothing of the summer standstill? not sure i would pay the premium to live there.

some say that we are the stig :o but, should you ever see a large olde english sheepdog convinced that he is in charge of a large olde(ish) silver sports car, then look for an olde scruffy(ish) red-head nearby, and you will have found me

 

court bundle due tuesday, 27th. hearing 13th march. EEK.

i shall be happier when ive filed and served. it pleases me little to prepare several trees worth of documents for no good reason.

 

does anybody have any ideas/knowledge/thoughts on liquidated damages? i would be very glad of any input

[lateralus]

i just can't believe the amount of copying that goes into it - they should pay everybody out before this point. 40 pages on the court bundle alone - plus other docs. and all that in triplicate???????what a waste of time and resources!

very best of luck liz - you seem well capable of handling it all!

[lizvp]

just a quick question...are we supposed to include all the statements for the period in question? just the statements with charges on?

cos ur quite right Lattie, tis an awful lot of copying! specially with all the limitations stuff too!

[Katteh]

Just to follow up on the Cornish side of things (sorry for the off-topic post here! ) - Was born and grew up in a lil village called Gunnislake in Cornwall, quite near St. Austell I think!

[thefenz]

I'm following this thread as I'm about to claim back charges over 6 years with HSBC.

 

Guess I'm gonna face the same.

[lizvp]

hi Katteh, yup not too far, about 40 miles. very pretty around there, wasnt it the first main crossing for the tamar?

good luck Fenz, lots of good threads on over 6 years claims around here..just watch out for the costs problem outside of the small claims track and make sure you keep copies of EVERYTHING.

court bundle stands at nearly 200 pages!!

[lizvp]

btw..heres another splendid bit re Limitations act:

House of Lords - Cave (Respondent) v. Robinson Jarvis & Rolf (A Firm) (Appellants)

for the court bundle?

[Katteh]

Yeah it's lovely there - an idyllic place to grow up. And yes I believe it was the first main crossing.

[lateralus]

i see no reason to include pages of statements where no charges are being reclaimed - and i assume you use copies - even for the court - i wouldn't send originals - unless someone comes along and tells you differently.

 

you'll have this?

After the AQ's have gone back, if/when the judge has agreed to the directions in the draft order you will then need to provide;

 

a) Your schedule;

 

b) Your statements showing the charges. Alternatively the list of charges which the bank provided under your S.A.R - (Subject Access Request);

 

c) A statement of evidence. See post *24 or my sig for a link to the one I used for my Lloyds claim. In most cases it'll need amending to suit, although I'm working on it to make it more broad-ranging. *DONE*

 

d) All the statutues and decided cases on which your claim relies. Ie, UTCCR's, UCTA's, SOGA, case law, etc. For this, I'd just submit the whole of the Basic Court Bundle.

 

and for the statement of evidence - post number 55 of the new strategy.

 

(just making sure and also putting it where i know where to find it)

 

just out of curiosity - when is it due - and how long did they give you from the court letter? you seem so up for this - is your job somehow court related? just something you said awhile back. i'm impressed and wish you the very best - i suppose they could just offer at any time as well couldn't they - you maybe are doing all that copying for nowt!

and i think the point of the order is that they won't do it anyway! so you'll get a judgment? i've not followed one this far before - i'm watching your every move! feel the support!!!!

[nettyg]

you and me both lats!

[lizvp]

hi Lattie,

 

court bundle due tomoz! just putting finishing touches to witness statement. the bundle is running at 193 pages, but i have included limitations act and the house of lords Cave appeal, as that is the main thrust of their nonsense.

 

thanks for the link for witness statement tho..i was in a bit of a tizz finding it; happily, i have already done one court bundle for our case against ex-mortgage co. so wasnt too badly daunted, even tho we only had a week to put it together.

 

the 1 min hearing is 2 weeks tomorrow, im well up for it and certainly feel the support

nope, no court related job, tho i guess its fair to say ive had a few fairly high powered jobs..currently discovering the joys of rural domestic bliss and renovating a house.

i just passionately hate the way financial institutions treat people, the lives they ruin and the misery they cause....be nice to get the money back, but i guess my driving force is standing up to them and maybe we can get some more equitable laws put in place, or at least a decent and more accessible complaints system.

 

end of rant

[lateralus]

don't think you'll get your day in court - i don't think they will send theirs in 14 days in advance of the court date - and i don't know what happens then although the upshot will be your filing for judgment - their defense thrown out, judge will rule, whatever! you'll win by default i'm thinking.

this is really exciting - keep us up to date.

 

just found this - it's something to look at...... GOT A COURT DATE? A guide to the later stages

GaryH

[sharkie]

Liz

 

Now I see why the similarity in our attitude, I gave up GM 5 years ago, and moved away from the “rat race”. Physically it was good not to have to worry about budgets, targets, KPI’s or pleasing some board or keeping lots of people occupied / employed, although mentally and financially its pants, a job that just pays the mortgage, and a rusty old 4x4. I have spent the past five years and a fortune rebuilding a converted barn (bad conversion done in 88) in the other “Gods” country about 400 miles north of you (as the crow drives, mostly on motorways, except where there isn’t any).

If only you could be sure the photocopying was not going to be needed, what a total waste, times yours by all the people that have gone this far only to have them pay out.

Crazy

 

"Noli nothis permittere te terere" I think

 

Sharkie

[lizvp]

tis done! court bundle filed and served....and ive just seen 6 magpies

 

thanks for that link Lattie, its very informative and reassuring, good to have all in one place. though, like you, i cant see it getting to court somehow.

 

Sharkie, is that the peaks? or maybe the dales? certainly both other 'gods' countries to my mind.

we didnt have the energy for barn conversions, the OHs parents went that route and it seems exhausting in every way!! ours was more neglected really, we are just finishing rebuilding the kitchen, which was more of a leaky lean-to when we started...gods wont i be glad when thats over!!!!

and latin! poor brain! my latin master was a very fierce man! i quite agree..maybe it should be the site motto

[sharkie]

Its the Dales, one of two choices, Cornwall or here, thought sell the house in the south, reduce the mortgage, get a little job, DOH!!!, now the mortgage is 2-1/2 times the size, job is "pony and trap". Like I said apart from the tryping error, our place was badly converted (and I mean badly) in 88, done all the work myself.

400ft up a hillside, weather comes sideways, no money, but every time I look out the window I think I should have done this twenty years ago, boy I would be better off now.

 

Well done on the bundle, don't understand their logic not paying out with 1 minute hearing, unless they are going for judgement and then costs.

 

reference HSBC and Latin, reckon Caeser may have said "Sentio aliquos togatos contra me conspirare."

 

I think

 

Sharkie

[lizvp]

lols @ sharkie

 

actually, this morning, its veni, vidi, vici!!!

 

they have backed right off the limitations bit, 'in our specific circumstances' and are prepared to refund the earlier charges.

full offer, no mention of confidentiality or any other clause.

 

still not going to inventory the poultry until the cheque has cleared, but im certainly off for a prolonged chuckle and a liquid lunch

 

more later, if capable..and reference hsbc and their defence, might caeser have said .. non gradus anus rodentum

[lateralus]

sounds rude to me! i don't speak latin but i got that third word!

 

with the rodent involved - is it: i don't give a rat's ass?

[lizvp]

not worth an anus rodentum

[Spiceskull]

they have backed right off the limitations bit, 'in our specific circumstances' and are prepared to refund the earlier charges.

full offer, no mention of confidentiality or any other clause.

Hi Liz,

 

They won't push statute barred charges if they are a natural runover to your main claim - there is a lot of history that they feel would make them look petty to a judge (not that they will see the judge...!!!)

 

This approach would be harder if you were trying a completely statute barred claim...

 

Regarding other clauses/confidentiality - when they send the settlement, the letter will be trickily worded along the lines of "...I agree to bring no more claims against HSBC for this period..." If/when you do sign, make sure that it is clear (if appropriate) that this line ONLY applies to this account. I know someone who signed this, and then thought he could start another claim using another account - he signed that he would bring no action against HSBC, without specifying that it applied to only the one account...

 

Good luck.

[veryannoyed]

I see no reason to sign any confidentiality clause unless they are offering SUBSTANTIALLY EXCESS of your legitimate claim - confidentiality should come at a massive price after the way you (and I) have been treated... your claim is only the absolute minimum you are entitled to, especially if you are not going down the contractual rate interest route - so stuff them with their clauses!

 

Either they pay out of court with no conditions whatsoever, or challenge them to go before a judge and argue their case...

 

It makes me sick the banks think they are doing US a favour by settling out of court, when in fact it is their ass they are saving by settling out of court...

 

The absolute most I would be prepared to sign would be "I agree to bring no more action against HSBC for these particular referenced charges on this particular named account only" ... anymore than that would be unreasonable and intimidatory

[Spiceskull]

The other thing to consider is that any settlement is likely to be a "gesture of goodwill..."

 

As such, they are saying that out of the goodness of their heart they are giving you some money, which, coincidentally, is exactly the same amount as you are claiming.

 

If it is a GOGW then they are not actually contesting the claim, and as such any mention of statute barred, confidentiality or conditions goes out of the window...it is either GOGW or it isn't...

[lizvp]

hi guys, what a lovely day.

 

thanks for your thoughts on confidentiality etc. makes me cross as well.

 

i should perhaps clarify, i sent a letter turning down their previous offer which was for the full amount barring a large chunk that they deemed statute barred. i pointed out the holes in their limitations argument(in our case):

 

'For the avoidance of doubt, I will contend that your continued assertion that your clients charges are fair, inter alia, represents a deliberate concealment and further that:

1) While I reasonably attempted to resolve this matter without recourse to the Courts, your client delayed responding to my requests and was actively obstructive in supplying information by sending all correspondence, including confidential data, to the wrong address, thus delaying my eventual issue of claim.

2) My request for a comprehensive list of all charges relating to my account with your client, the original subject access request, dated 19th August 2006 represents, in this case, my discovery that a fraud/concealment/mistake had been made.'

 

and made them an offer that i would accept, which was rounded down to the nearest £:

 

'In order to more speedily resolve this matter, I am willing to accept the sum of £****, payable by cheque made out to myself at the above address. I do not agree to waive my rights in respect of any other actions, nor do I agree to a clause of confidentiality. If I do not receive your agreement within 48hrs, followed by payment within 7 days I shall bring this letter to the attention of the courts when the question of costs arises.

I invite you to reconsider your position and await payment,'

 

the letter we got back just basically denied all wrong doing, strongly denied my assertion that there was a deliberate concealment, but in light of history of complaint, were prepared to make full offer..the last paragraph:

 

'therefore, our client makes a without prejudice offer in the amount of £(full amount) in full and final settlement of your claim. this offer is made for commercial reasons as outlined in previous correspondence and is without prejudice to our clients contention that its charges are reasonable and are properly disclosed. hsbc is confident that it was entitled to apply these charge and that it would successfully resist your claim in the courts.'

 

there was no sign of the bit they send for you to sign and send back, and no mention of 'conditions', so we just wrote a short letter saying we accept their offer in full and final settlement of THIS claim, and expect payment by cheque forthwith.

 

so, just waiting for the cheque now.

then we might think about using what we have found out about the SoL

[Spiceskull]

Well done.

 

Your mention of SOLA again suggests you may now claim for charges outside the six-year period: welcome to the harder part of your claim - eight months down the line and all I have so far is an admission (verbal) that my original contract DOES exist on microfiche, but all transaction history does not...which contradicts what I have been told before...

 

This is all pipeline stuff, so will not discuss further, but any support you want in claiming further will be available from a few determined people on the site...

[lizvp]

thanks Phoenix

yup, certainly contemplating going beyond 6 yrs

i also had a visa card that i was (i admit) a bit naughty with and on their advice took out a loan to clear. ive only just found the old paperwork and the loan was made in july 2001. so might see if i have a case against that as well. i seem to have been paying an awful lot on that loan for an awful long time too!

im not sure im not a bit touched actually...do i really wanna go through all this again?! maybe i just have too much time on my hands...not.

lots and lots of luck with your claim phoenix, i shall def be keeping an eye on your threads

[lateralus]

oh, liz, that's great news! i am sooo pleased for you!!!

netty got a full offer today - wow..... hope they've got enough money to pay you two!!!!

you worked so hard and ugh! all that copying!

never mind - YOU WON!!!!

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!

VERY MUCH DESERVED!