Big Motoring World/Black Horse Finance - refusing to honour statutory rights ***SETTLED**

[Karalius]

Hi guys,

 

I have purchased used vehicle on finance, on 1st of June 2021 from Big Motoring World (Audi A7 - 2016 plate).

 

On 7th of June I noticed a vibration on wheel and noise on passenger front side when braking. I logged the problem on warranty app that comes with the car (3 months). I took the car to local independent garage on 9th of June. They advised me that brake discs are slightly warped, and disc pads needs replacing. Invoice and diagnostics sent off to BMW warranty team. They are not happy with the price quoted and asked me to take the car to Halfords auto center. This is fine and I am happy to do that.

 

However a real problem started this morning 11th of June. I heard a loud whistling noise coming from under bonnet when I accelerate. I suspected this was a turbo noise. I took the car to local independent garage and been confirmed that the turbo is gone. Been advised not to drive the car. 

 

I called BMW warranty department and they have given me details of approved Audi dealer. The garage gave me appointment to diagnose next week Thursday 17th of June. 

 

I am no longer happy with this, meaning I will have no vehicle for at least a week and have no way of getting my family around. I thought about the issues that are occurring within the first week and I decided that for peace of mind I would like to hand the car back. I suspect it will cost me arm and leg if I do decide to keep the car. I called BMW after sales team and advised them that I would like to reject the car and return it back. They have advised me that they don't offer that option and that is not possible to do so.

 

Now, I thought under consumer rights I have 14 days to cancel this? I have paid 3000 pounds deposit and remaining is on finance. What are my options here? What can I do? Any suggestions please? Anyone has had anything similar happen? 

 

I am on the line to speak with the financing company to see what they tell me and what my options are.

 

Many thanks for any suggestions.

 

 

[Karalius]

Sorry, I didn't know how to edit the post. 

 

I have just spoken with finance department at Black Horse Trading. I explained the problems to them and advised that I want to reject the vehicle.

 

They advised me that this cannot be done. They must take the vehicle to authorized garage on Thursday 17th of June and confirm what the problem is before they can help. They will arrange for recovery truck to move the car to garage. They will try to resolve the issue for me afterwards. How would I protect myself before it goes onto the recovery truck in case damage is caused? 

 

However, I am still not confident with the car and I believe I will have further problems down the line. I want to hand it back. They didn't really care that I have kids to take around to school and I have no means to do so until the car is back. They cannot provide courtesy car.  Sounds like this will be a lengthy process to say the least.. 

Thanks

[Karalius]

Wow, thank you so much for detailed reply BankFodder!

 

Understood, I will not take the warranty repairs and leave the car outside of my house for time being. I was also confused when both companies told me I have no rights, but thinking about it no wonder with finance company not wanting to take a hit. 

 

I have in fact just spoke with Black Horse and advised them what you just told me to do. They have advised me that they have this logged on system and that I want to reject the car. However, the man on the phone has advised me that the vehicle still needs to be inspected and report given to them before they can proceed further. I have advised them that I would be happy to do that as long as the vehicle is not being repaired under the warranty and that only inspection is carried out. Does that sound correct? Should I let recovery vehicle take my car to the garage? 

 

Yes indeed it is correct dealer!

 

I will get on with the letter now. May you please advise if I should send the letter to both companies via email or physical letters and get paid postage receipts?

 

Thanks

 

 

[Karalius]

Ok, I got the app for recording and just raised this officially with black horse, but for some reason it did not record.

 

They told me this is now raised and they are dealing with BMW directly and I should hear response back next week. I have pointed out all the statements that you advised. 

 

I guess, for my own protection I will type this out to them directly via email so I have this as proof. If you don't mind I will post this just to review.

 

Thanks

[Karalius]

I guessed so. I just tried on couple different numbers and it did not record... Do you mind just having a look at what you typed out and I just added few things at the bottom that you said. Does that sound ok to send over to both BMW and Black Horse?

 

Thanks, I really appreciate you helping me here!!

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

I insist that this is a formal complain to the financial ombudsman.

 

As you know on 1 June 2021 you sold me an Audi registration number RF16 TYV.

 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform your after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that you don't offer that option.

 

We all know that this is a breach of your statutory obligations. The vehicle is rejected and I require you to make arrangements to collect it and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to deal with the finance company to cancel the finance agreement.

 

I'm sending a copy of this letter to the finance company.

 

If you have already started make any arrangement to carry out warranty repairs et cetera then I advise you to stop because I will not be proceeding with this purchase.

 

If you force me to go to court about this then I'm more than happy and the court will draw its own conclusions about your attempts on the telephone to mislead me into believing that I had no statutory rights in the matter.

 

I would also like to point out that since the defect has occurred within the first 30 days, my presumption is that it was always there and that the car is rejected and I won’t stand for any excuses.

 

As discussed over the phone on 11 June, we agreed that appointment is booked for authorized Audi garage at 8:30am on 17 June. You can certainly take the car away on the recovery vehicle, but I would like you to understand that when you do take the car, it will not be coming back. It will not be accepted back. I will cancel all insurance and I also want to revoke my ownership and if you do try to return it to me it will be an uninsured vehicle.

 

I want you to also understand that all of this is done on the basis of my statutory rights and that I am not interested in the warranty which is part of the contract and I am rejecting the contract.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Edited June 11, 2021 by Karalius

[Karalius]

Ok, my apologies for my misunderstanding. I want to send the letter to both BMW and Black Horse Finance. Should I only send such as you posted in post #3? Or also add the extra

 bits which you made in post #6 too? 

 

[Karalius]

I am sorry if I am still not understanding this correctly. Forgive me as I have never been in such situation prior. Please see if this sounds ok to send to both companies? 

 

Ok, so to BMW, and below to Black Horse.

Quote

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

As you know on 1 June 2021 you sold me an Audi registration number RF16 TYV.

 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform your after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that you don't offer that option.

 

We all know that this is a breach of your statutory obligations. The vehicle is rejected and I require you to make arrangements to collect it and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to deal with the finance company to cancel the finance agreement.

 

I'm sending a copy of this letter to the finance company - and I have informed them that you are attempting to avoid your statutory obligations.

 

If you have already started make any arrangement to carry out warranty repairs et cetera then I advise you to stop because I will not be proceeding with this purchase.

 

If you force me to take you to court about this then I'm more than happy and the court will draw its own conclusions about your attempts on the telephone to mislead me into believing that I had no statutory rights in the matter.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

To Black Horse

Quote

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

This is my formal complaint with much I wish escalated to the financial ombudsman service

 

As you know on 1 June 2021, I was sold an Audi registration number RF16 TYV by Big Motoring World. The purchase was financed by yourselves finance reference number XXX

You should understand that I am fully aware of my rights under section 75 Consumer Credit Act 1974
 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform Big Motoring World after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that they don't offer that option.
 

I have also attempted to inform you and I was also astonished to be told by your staff that I was not entitled to reject the vehicle and that I had no rights in the matter. This will be the basis of my complaint to the ombudsman about you
 

We all know that this is a breach of statutory obligations. I am rejecting the vehicle and I require for Big Motoring World to make arrangements to collect the vehicle and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to help me cancel the finance agreement.

 

I would also like to point out that since the defect has occurred within the first 30 days, my presumption is that it was always there and that the car is rejected and I won’t stand for any excuses.

As discussed over the phone on 11 June, we agreed that appointment is booked for authorized Audi garage at 8:30am on 17 June. Big Motoring World can certainly take the car away on the recovery vehicle, but I would like you to understand that when they do take the car, it will not be coming back to me. It will not be accepted back. I will cancel all insurance and I also want to revoke my ownership and if they do try to return it to me it will be an uninsured vehicle.

 

I want you to also understand that all of this is done on the basis of my statutory rights and that I am not interested in the warranty which is part of the contract and I am rejecting the contract.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

[Karalius]

Thank you ever so much! Both letters sent to both companies. I will keep you updated on the outcome.

 

 

[Karalius]

Hi,

 

I have just received an email from BMW. I am unsure if I should be replying to this email. It sounds like they want to go into route of repairs, they should see the problems logged on the system either way. Can you please advise my course of action? Thanks

 

"Good Morning, 

Thank you for contacting us and I am sorry to hear that you are not satisfied with the vehicle. 

Could you please advise what the fault with the vehicle is that you are experiencing and if you have had a diagnosis report carried out?"

 

 

[Karalius]

Hi BankFodder,

 

Hoping you had a great weekend. I have sent them the email as suggested above, and just received below email from them. Should I agree for the warranty company to collect the car and give them all the requested documents et cetera? Should I be taking the pictures of the vehicle and videos etc of the faults in case they play a game with me? Will they try to down value from my payments that I made due to milage that I clocked up already (around 850 miles). Should I mention to him that the after sales team is where I was told that my vehicle could not be rejected? 

 

Thanks

 

"Good Afternoon,

Thankyou for getting in contact with us, and for providing the additional details in your prior emails. 

I cannot see anything stating previously that your right to reject the vehicle is voided and not something that we would look into.
I can assure you that we are more than happy to assist with moving forward on that front. The eventual outcome and agreement to accept the rejection will of course be subject to an inspection confirming the noted concerns/faults.

To move forward from the current position, we would need to organise for the vehicle to be recovered to our Snodland Service Center from yourself. Can you please confirm you are happy for me to forward your details across to our Warranty Company to liaise with you directly to organise this aspect?

When the vehicle is recovered, we would require for all relevant paperwork to be sent along with the car, most importantly any spare keys, SD Cards and the V5 document. These can be left in the glovebox of the vehicle when it is recovered. 

Please let me know if you're happy for me to forward your information across, and we can organise the next steps accordingly.

Kind Regards"

[Karalius]

Thanks BankFodder I will get onto this right now.

 

Just one more question - I have paid 3000 deposit by my debit card to BMW. Total car of cost was 18,000 - 3000 deposit = 15000 with the finance company. I hope I will not lose deposit money? 

[Karalius]

Thank you ever so much. I will keep updating as we go along  I hope this works out all well! 

 

Just FYI - I have only had option to update Black Horse via their portal, but once I did and no reference has been given. I have just called them to check if they can see on their system, and apparently they don't. I have just forwarded all the emails I have sent to them via email so now I have proof.

Edited June 14, 2021 by Karalius

[Karalius]

Well they have the formal phone complaint logged which is good. I have tried couple different apps, but it seems that apple is blocking the recordings and I am unable to make recordings.

[Karalius]

Hi, just giving update.

 

I received below email from BMW this morning. I had a phone call from them and been advised that car will be collected today on recovery truck. I am awaiting for them to get in touch with me to arrange this.

What can I do to protect myself in regards to the collection to ensure that vehicle is as they taking it away? Do I take pictures of the inside/outside once the vehicle is on the recovery truck? Milage etc? Anything I am missing here?

 

What do they mean in below email regards to subject to signing of settlement agreement and removal of any negative postings online?

 

Thanks

 

"Good Morning,

Thankyou for getting back to me and confirming.

I've forwarded your information across to the warranty company and they should be in touch with you shortly to organise for the recovery of the vehicle to us.

As noted in my previous email, the rejection of the vehicle will be subject to an inspection confirming the concern raised. Furthermore, it will also be subject to the signing of a settlement agreement and removal of any negative postings online. 

Once these elements have been confirmed, we will be able to proceed accordingly."

[Karalius]

Thank you. Makes perfect sense. I had just taken the pictures and video of the car inside/out and will take some more when its on the recovery truck. 

 

I will hand them over both car keys that came when I purchased along with the V5 log book. I won't sign anything if they ask me.

 

Just quick one - I had initially purchased GAP insurance alongside the car. It says on the paper I have 30 days to cancel it. I assume I need to get this done, or will this be part of the finance step as it is them who issued the finance for it.

 

Thanks BankFodder, your help means a lot! I do very much appreciate it! 

[Karalius]

Hi,

 

Just an update that the vehicle has been collected last night on the trailer. I got all pictures before and whilst it was on the trailer. Handed both keys over and the V5 document.

 

Awaiting to hear what they have to say now.

 

Thanks! 

[Karalius]

Ok. How would I go about divesting myself from the ownership with DVLA? 

Is the below ok to send to finance company?

 

Dear Sir/Mdm 

 

This is to confirm that vehicle registration number ......has now been collected by Big Motoring World. I am no longer in the possession of the vehicle and I am no longer the owner. DVLA have been informed.

 

I request for the finance reimbursement to be followed through.

 

I have already filed a complaint on this matter and the time is already running for the matter to be referred to the financial ombudsman service.

 

As you know you have a duty under COBS - conduct of business regulations to treat me fairly and so far I haven't noticed that you complied with this statutory duty.

 

Best wishes

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Karalius]

Morning, hope weekend was nice!

 

I just had a reply back from BMW. What would be wise next step to do as per below email? I have left both car keys and V5 documents in the car. Not sure why they are asking for them.

 

“Good Morning,

Thank you for your patience whilst we have been looking into this for you.

I can confirm the finance company have accepted a return of advance of your finance therefore we would look to accept rejection of your vehicle, we would request that a settlement agreement is signed prior to the refund being processed. 

Can you please confirm where all of the documentation is for the vehicle this will include the logbook and any additional keys you have for the vehicle?

Kind Regards”

[Karalius]

Thank you. I will write the letter once I get home from work today.

 

DX - I unfortunately gave the whole V5 log book along with both keys  

[Karalius]

I did, but I didn’t have a chance to call them until today. DVLA told me that I would need to keep a whole V5 document and only hand the part 4 of the document where I am selling or trading with motor trader.

 

The V5 was already with the car on collection prior to this conversation that we had  

[Karalius]

Thank you I am onto DVLA to see what they advise me. How would I know to whom do I need to transfer the registration to though? 

[Karalius]

Hi there,

 

I have received the settlement agreement from BMW. Can you please help me look into if this sounds ok to sign?

 

There are few things that I am not really happy about.

PARTIES

Point (1) - My name was spelled incorrectly.

Point (B) - It does not state of me reporting an issue with the turbo that has failed.

Point 1.4 - I do not understand what this is about? The vehicle has been collected and V5 + keys left inside + 1 key with the recovery truck driver.

 

If there is anything that could be advised, can you please let me know? 

 

Thank you!!

 

 

 

[Karalius]

Whoops, I'm very sorry!

1Settlement_Agreement.pdf

[Karalius]

Very nice layout and explanations. I agree with your logic. 
 

Car is with BMW. I assume at their garage. I have called them Friday and said they would call me back. I then received the email with settlement agreement.

 

I lost really my insurance premium as I cancelled, but I’m willing to write that off to make it easier? 

 

What shall I be doing now? 

[Karalius]

I paid 3000 deposit (2800 + 200 buyers fees cover by my debit card). The car was purchased on Hire Purchase.

 

I can only see the attached on agreement files that state something about 14 day period. I am unsure if that is what you are asking. 

 

 

 

 

Your right to withdraw.pdf