It's only about how the reader takes the email ?

[Emmzzi]

Don't mix work and leisure and you'll have no issue. And no, you don't get to decide what makes other people uncomfortable. Get over it. You shouldn't have emailed either after the event - bit stalkery. Just leave her alone, eh?

[Emmzzi]

A) you are male

b) you have an office - higher graded?

 

I would have totally left it alone. If someone feels harrassed can you imagine how unpleasant it is to then have to explain in detail why? Just... Don't. It's a dreadful thing to ask of her!

 

I'd have a look at NLP and emotional intelligence if you want to get better at reading cues.

[Emmzzi]

PS I would read "we had been getting on well" as "I would like to have an affair with you." Please please put down the shovel!!

[Emmzzi]

Oh and "don't give you cause to raise other concerns" reads as "you dropped me in it". This email has not helped at all!!!

[Emmzzi]

No disrespect Emmzzi, but is that truly how this could have been interpreted ^^^^^^

 

I totally agree that once the young lady had made the complaint the OP should have backed off and certainly not asked her to explain her actions.

 

IMHO, you could end up with a persecution complex in today's workplace ?

 

By a woman feeling vulnerable, yes. Because if that is what you are prepared to put in writing, what would you say to her face?

 

Best to leave that sort of thing for people you don't work with. But then I have never understood why people feel the need for work to be their social life, as opposed to making the effort to make friends outside of work!

[Emmzzi]

 

I guess I must have been very fortunate in that as a female, I never felt threatened or vulnerable..

 

Very, and I bet you had a better working life because of it! I am happy for your experience

[Emmzzi]

The HR manager clearly does not think there is a significant issue, so do not create an issue.

 

The HR manager is doing as the woman requested, I think. We do not know their opinion.

[Emmzzi]

A slightly embarrassed, but less naiive, Pin Stripe

 

Good decision - sure things will pick uo from now on!

[Emmzzi]

But also some of the HR stuff is really quite feminist.

 

 

 

You say that like it's a bad thing.

 

The days of the controlling patriarchy are ending. Get over it.

[Emmzzi]

This is more about whether any good can come out of this frustrating situation. Is there a culture of encouraging people to go to HR, when it might in cases like this be better to encourage people to set their own boundaries ?

 

One thing we feminists get really tired of is having the same conversation over and over again when the internet is there to help. A reasonable person will take the trouble to educate themselves.

 

May I suggest you google "male privilege" for why your minor inconvenience and dented ego in this is really not the issue?

[Emmzzi]

Yes, point taken Emmzzi, feminism is for the equality of women with men, a good thing, I was using the term wrongly, as it is sometimes mis-used. I meant 'some of the HR stuff appeared to me to be sexist biased towards women (not feminist)'

 

You're right to pull me up on this. You're not correct in implying I want to see a continuation of the 'controlling patriarchy'.

 

But your reply suggests you don't want to stop doing things unless they meet the bar for the legal definition of harrassment in the UK. Otherwise OMG WE ARE OPPRESSING YOU! Whereas what has actually happened, is someone has had a friendly word to say "you're making her uncomfortable, could you stop?" I mean jees, what would you have been happy with? A formal complaint? seeing the whites of her eyes while she explained exactly how you were creeping her out? What? Do you WANT a full investigation? Is it neccessary in order to change the situation? Or is that actually all about you and your needs?

 

So, yeah. Your stated intention doesn't match at all what you are saying. What is so very difficult about actually modifying your behaviour, to make other people feel comfortable? Why is this a huge political issue? Why is the organisation now conspiring against men because someone had a quiet word designed to help you?

 

Let's get some perspective. You did a thing which made someone feel bad. Someone who, by virtue of their gender (and possibly place in the hierarchy, you didn't answer that one), feels uncomfortable. You were asked to stop.

 

Can this not just be an end to it that you learn from and move on? Or do we actually have to go through the whole checklist of why women are less comfortable than men in everyday life?

 

(Do you check if its dark before crossing the carpark and feel uncomfortable? On what scale do you measure your discomfort? Do people think you are stupid if you are less attractive? and so on and on and on... you can find big lists on the internet!)

[Emmzzi]

I think this is sexist Emmzzi. Not meaning to be unkind.

 

Which is why you don't and won't and get this.

 

Happy to talk more if you are willing to educate yourself. Until then it's just my head and the wall!

[Emmzzi]

It does not just apply to men. Yes, the days when you could send hilarious innocent emails to each other were great. These days, you have to remember Big Brother is reading all your messages. Your friend is probably worried about who is reading it and perhaps getting into trouble for exchanging "inappropriate" emails, rather than anything personal towards you.

 

It was a bit rotten for her to complain to HR, when she could have just told you.

 

I don't agree that the days of sending "hilarious" emails to each other were great. My inbox generally had racist sexist rubbish on circular emails. I'm glad it has stopped and I no longer have to deal with Bernard Manning style "comedy".

 

Why, I wonder, did she feel unable to approach OP directly when they were such good friends? "Bit rotten?" Don't think so. And I would be wary of assigning motives to someone you have never met.

 

But then, thinking you know how women probably feel, is a very common thing....

[Emmzzi]

The one with the stressed out cat was good. Em, chill out!

 

A thing men say to reduce any point a woman has to make to "she's emotional." Saves actually listening and thinking about it.