Old DJ vs Halifax****AND WON****

[hillards]

Oh now they are annoying me. I had a call, which got me up far too early this morning from the Halifax, Retail Bank Collections in Leeds on that dratted 0870 number. I have spoken to someone at their Leeds office who told me they would remove my number from the system - oh no they didn't!

 

I've been out most of the day in my role as a hospital volunteer, not returning tonight until 11.30pm and that's only because I've finished early as I felt shattered after the early morning call.

 

I'm told they called at 6.40pm, 8pm and 8.40pm this evening, and I only know about those calls as my wife picked up the phone to answer - as often happens, dead lines - just a recording of the engaged tone! How many times they called during the day I do not know but I also had calls to my mobile at 5.39pm and 8.22pm. The mobile was switched off as I was within the hospital, being a good lad y'see.

 

So, I feel a call to the OFT and Trading Standards coming on, as well as one to the Halifax in Halifax, customer relations, as I'm sick to the teeth of them now. What part of 'I now require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only.' do they not understand ?

Swines!

[hillards]

In threads I've read on here, I found some that mentioned that continued harassment by telephone is an offence, in law, if you had written to them to say that you would only correspond by letter. In other words, if they keep calling after they've had a letter to that effect then they are in breach of the Wireless Telegraphy Act 1949.

 

I also have notes regarding it being an offence under section 127 of the Communications Act 2003 and is actually arrestable under the provisions of Section 24(2) of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984.

 

Do I now send the Police in and arrest the entire call centre team? That being on the grounds that any one of them could be guilty of handling the calls I receive.

 

Strange, that after blowing my top at them yesterday, that they are not calling my home number today - but I've already logged 5 calls to my mobile!

 

I feel another letter coming on - this time it will go to:

The Financial Ombudsman Service

South Quay Plaza

183 Marsh Wall

LONDON

E14 9SR

[hillards]

After midnight tonight they'll not call any more... At least that's what they tell me at the Halifax.

 

It seems that they took notice of my telephone clal and took my home number off the system, but have left the mobile one on - which explains why I've been getting calls today still.

 

So, I called Customer Relations in Leeds - 0845 603 7923 this time. Nice lady who took my call listened to what I had to say, checked their (scanned) copy of my letter on the system and has now called the collections office to request that my mobile number is removed too.

 

She tells me that their department will respond to my letter and she will add that she has taken a call from me on the subject.

 

I'm not sure if this is normal procedure as I have hassled them a bit, not quite as much as they have me, to try and sort this out. I did mention sending the Police in to arrest the lot of them and she realised I was being quite serious, I tend note to joke about such things in their hearing.

 

So - for the benefit of anyone else suffering the barrage of calls from Retail Bank Collections - ring and ask them to stop in the first instance. They can do this for a 10 day period without needing to get permission from a supervisor. Insist if you have to.

 

Send them a letter, jonni2bad has a template here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/37006-harassment-telephone-response-letter.html#post290644

 

Allow a few days for them to process this, and refuse to answer security questions etc. when they do call in the meantime. If you still get the call then follow up, as I did, with a call to Customer Relations and point out your letter. They will make sure your numbers are taken off the dialler.

 

No - it does not remove any debt you may owe them, but at least stops them pestering too often!

[hillards]

OK - to update. The phone calls HAVE stopped, ever since I called and got Customer Relations onto it.

 

I got my credit report today, and there is no default on my Halifax bank account (yet) but they have one on my credit card account, so I'll have to see what can be done about that when I jump on them for those charges refunding.

 

I also found another credit card account listed as being in default, so will have to do some digging and see what I am able to sort out with that one. No doubt they slapped loads of charges on before they defaulted it. Strange how you forget these things...

[bathgatebuyer]

Good luck with that. I've sent off a section 10 letter as others have recommended I do with my own case, to try and ensure that the default they served during the course of my dispute is never sent to third parties.

 

And I did phone up the Collections Team at the Halifax to make sure the cheeky beggar that phoned me up the day before I got my settlement letter, and who was quite posisbly the rudest Halifax employee on the planet, knew that I had won.

 

"Show me the money, Jerry!"

[hillards]

Just been watching that 'Bank Robbery' program again, and picked up on the bit about the Financial Ombudsman telling the banks to prove it or pay up in full. I can't see the Hx suggesting people go that route any more.

 

If the ombudsman is saying that they are advising bank customers to proceed with action, rather than accept an early offer, then perhaps that gives a lot of people reading this site even more confidence.

 

Even the OFT are unhappy with the charges, despite the change of phrase to it being a 'service charge' now, rather than a fee, to get out of the legislation.

 

If the experts can't justify more than £4.50 for bouncing a cheque (manually) and £2.50 for a direct debit or overdraft charge, then the banks are going to have a real problem trying to stick to the claim it's all legal.

 

They reckon at least 80% of the charges are applied by the computer systems, and only a small amount require manual intervention. Bearing in mind these lesser amounts are for manual processing, I'd suggest that a computerised transaction is a max 50p - allowing for postage and raw materials of the paper and enevelope.

 

Wonder if it's worth amending a LBA to include the statement by Walter Merricks, the Chief Financial Ombudsman ? As backup, the sheer amount of cases they've settled before a court hearing must influence any judge, should a case get to that stage.

 

The banks are not going to let this go on much further though, they'll find something to block the flow of claims - although it's still only a small percentage of customers who are actually bothering. They can keep this up for a long time if they wish - ask us, we'll give you an offer, you refuse it, go to court, bank settles - it puts some people off by being a little confusing, and frightening.

 

If they were to hold their hands up and say yes, we have been charging too much, they would be faced with paying billions back to all the affected customers - not just the ones taking action.

 

So, what percentage of customers have taken action? - I'd guess it is in single figures...

[hillards]

A new trend seems to be appearing, in that some people are calling Customer Relations and having a chat about their claim, then finding the Halifax are agreeing to pay up at the LBA stage without a fight.

 

It's about time they saw sense and avoided having to shell out the refund of court fees on every single case - that's our bank not looking after the money in my opinion...

 

I'm really stuck for money at present, being out of work and Christmas on the doorstep, so it would be good if this were to work for me. I'd be quite happy to accept a full refund, and risk losing the 8% that could be added at court stage.

 

However, it's now 5.15pm on a Friday and I've only just found out about this possibility, so will have to wait over the weekend to give it a try. There is a slight complication regarding the status of my bank account, as I've had one letter saying they have closed it when I specifically requested that it be re-instated when this matter is settled.

 

I'd be quite happy to see the money in my account, and the promise of a new cash card, in time for the holidays.

 

The only sticking point is that I don't want them to simply take the lot to pay the credit card account as that's how all my problems started with the bank account!

 

If anyone has any contact details, which part of the Halifax to deal with, then that would be appreciated. I am tempted to send email to initiate this, and have quite a few notes on helpful people from other threads. That way they can be looking at the case first thing on Monday, instead of waiting for me to pluck up the courage to call.

[sickofbeingrippedoff]

the offer letter was signed by Phil Giaramita

and the number i rang was 0121 234 1068

[hillards]

Many thanks for that, I'll be calling on Monday.

[sickofbeingrippedoff]

i'd prepared what i was going to say about them avoiding interest, court fees etc. ,but didn't need to say any of it. just that unless i got the full amount i would be filing a claim with the courts on 28th december. it was as if they were expecting the call and were prepared for it

[hillards]

Well, after read more threads and checking my own info, I've drafted an email that will be going to Customer Relations over the weekend. I've picked up a useful contact name from Aaronsdad in his thread and hope I can get a resolution to all of this soon.

 

The email is quite long, but basically I've outlined the case and the letters to date. I've stated what amount I have claimed, and suggested that they may like to settle now instead of going forward and being liable for the court fees plus over £200 of interest.

 

Who knows, this method may work? I know I lose out on the 8% interest doing it this way, but my original request was only for the refund of charges, and that's what I'm requesting. It's only if you have to issue a court claim that you can tag that on, so if this is sorted out sooner then it would not have applied.

 

The only problem is the default notice on my Halifax credit card account - they may try and use the repayment to settle that account. So, I've gone into some details about that as well. From my original claim I've agreed to them taking whatever amount is required to balance my bank account, which is overdrawn only with charges anyway, and a reasonable payment against my credit card account, leaving me with about 65% of the claim to go into my bank account.

 

I have asked them to ensure that this is restored to it's former glory, and a new debit card issued, so I can use it as before. I don't feel like I'm being demanding, just requesting that they put right what they put wrong in the first place.

 

The end is almost in sight...

[hillards]

Oh boy - this is getting complicated...

 

I've been doing some phoning around today, seem to have got through to every Halifax department except the one who could do something.

 

I'm told my bank account was closed by their collections department in September as no deposits had been made in October or November and it was in an unauthorised overdraft state. That in itself does not make sense, but I've had that information from two seperate people. How can it have been closed in September for that reason? Oh well.

 

Anyway, I've tried, without much joy, to get hold of someone who can take action on this and I'm now told that they are doing nothing until they deal with my claim. If they dismiss this then the account will not be re-opened. I could try applying for a new one, but with the credit record I currently have that is likely to be refused! If I win my case, as I fully expect to of course, then someone at the Halifax will have to sort out what to do with my account.

 

So, I asked what stage my claim was at and they say they got my rejection letter on the 14th, it was posted in their own envelope on the 6th at the Post Office counter and I added recorded delivery! As yet, nobody has taken any action on this...

 

SO, I have emailed Kelly Duffy - Senior Customer Relations Manager in the Executive Office AND Rachel Hinchliffe in their Legal department, giving them a breakdown of my claim, the circumstances in which the account became overdfrawn, and firmly requested that this matter be resolved by repaying the charges in full, re-instating my bank account and ensuring that I am able to make a withdrawl at branch. They cancelled my debit card and I've never been able to access my account on-line.

 

It's their fault the account became overdrawn in the first place and the overdrawn amount is all charges. I'm told the account is closed and the overdrawn amount 'written off'. They've referred to this in their offer letter and said they would deduct that amount if I accepted the offer.

 

Sadly, their office now seems to be closed for the day, so I'll have to resume in the morning.

[hillards]

--

[hillards]

*** WON *** WON *** WON *** WON *** WON ***

 

Having had no reply from either Kelly Duffy or Rachel Hinchcliffe I called Phil Giaramita at the Halifax's Birmingham office...

 

Very nice man, make a point of saying so if you should call, who looked at my case and we've almost settled. There are a couple of awkward points though.

 

One is that Halifax Card Services have a default lodged against me and so have a claim to any money that any other part of HBOS may hold on my behalf - such as winning this claim. I don't mind contributing something towards that account but have had lengthly correspondence with them on the matter and they keep insisting I should pay them when they know darned well I'm out of work and cannot claim benefits. It's not yet been passed to a DRC and they have had payments from me, because they took it from my bank account without any notification!

 

The other is the fact that my Halifax account was closed by head office due to the overdrawn amount and nothing going in for 2 months. I've pointed out that it was their fault it went overdrawn, and that the total is made up of charges only. Also that the account has been in this state of dispute and they should not have closed it in those circumstances.

 

I have already given a provisional 'Deal' on a settlement figure. There are those that would say I should have stuck it out and gone to court, thereby being able to claim a further £200 as the 8% interest, but I am out of work, it's Christmas time and I have the choice of either paying the £120 court fee on Friday or buying my kids their presents.

 

I have checked, and despite not having an income, I cannot claim exemption from the court fees as I don't qualify. I do not receive any benefits directly. My wife claims Working Tax Credits (jointly), but that isn't enough to be able to dismiss the fee at court stage. She's not pregnant or disabled and I don't feel like breaking her leg just to get round that one.

 

It seems I got my figures slightly wrong and my total amount was a little less than I had put into my claim, so we've agreed upon that. In effect I am correct in accepting at this stage, as it is my full claim amount. To go forward to the court stage would not be right.

 

So, he's sending out a letter in tonights post, I need to sign and return etc. and they'll send a cheque out. We've agreed that they will not persue the amount they 'wrote off' when they closed my account, which was £173.93. My original claim of £1,559.79 should have been £1,551.00, they are going to pay £1,500 by cheque - and when you take into account the written off overdraft, I've actually settled for £1,673.93 !

 

However, he cannot do anything about re-opening my bank account. That's gone forever. He also advised that if I open another Halifax account, which I could do, then Card Services can happily take what they like from that account...

 

As such it looks like I'll no longer be a Halifax customer and I'm about to start looking for another account someplace. Even if this is just a card account, so I can use the hole in the wall and pay direct debits, it's better than not having one at all OR allowing Card Services to help themselves.

 

Thanks to everyone on CAG for their help and support. A donation will be made when I get the money. A pity it couldn't be before Christmas but I'll have to take their cheque and deposit it somewhere and wait for it to clear. They can't arrange anything at Branch level to cash it over the counter for me.

 

It's saved me a bit of time and hassle, and having to spend the £120 on the court fee at this time of year.

 

Can I just add - DO NOT call them unless you're at an advanced stage, in that you've had an offer letter and sent in your LBA etc. If you want to try and use this method then wait until the week before you're due to go to court, which will save your time and theirs.

 

They will ask for your reference number and will negotiate your claim there and then, if they can. No point getting stroppy with them or making threats, they are trying to help you...

[tezviper]

Well done mate, really happy for you. Heres hoping u have a good xmas now.

 

TezViper

[hillards]

Certainly feeling a lot happier tonight after all the sleepless nights wondering if this nightmare would ever end. The wife any myself have been out for a meal and a drink for the first time in months, by way of celebration. OK, we had to borrow £30 to do that, but we're sure we can give that back soon.

 

I can only hope that my thread will be of use to others as they work their way through the system of reclaiming their charges. I have usually tried to add information as I go, rather than just the basics, for that reason. I know some people think I waffle on too much, so for this time... I'll stop!

[soapygreen2412]

well done hun good for you!!! i just got acknowledgement of service from court buying the halifax 28 days fingers crossed they will relent soon and i can deal with them.

[Andrea450]

Great news Hillards! Congratulations!

[hillards]

Just to keep this thread fresh and full of useful info for others to follow:

 

In my case I've no longer got a bank account, so the Halifax cannot pay anything into it now I've settled. So, as part of my acceptance letter (when the postman brings it) will be to request a Bankers Draft cheque.

 

A Bankers Draft is as good as cash and you should be able to present it at any high street bank and they give you the cash. You don't need to pay it into an account and wait for it to clear.

 

See the BBA website for more info - BBA - British Bankers' Association - Understanding a bank draft

 

A major bank should be able to organise payment by this method, so that's what I'll be asking them for. I can't any reason for them to refuse, and I have pointed out to them that I do not have an account thanks to them closing it.

[doo]

hillards, you are bloody brilliant, just read mrsirishjohn's thread, as we are both at similar stage - and saw your advice and decided I would take the same action. Well have just rung the number you put out and they have agreed to pay my charges, saves them interest and court fee and I am happy not to have the hassle. They are sending out a settlement letter today - so a big thank you and a pat on the back to us both, hope your money comes through asap. HAPPY CHRISTMAS

[hillards]

OK - my letter arrived this morning, so I've no chance of getting that back to them and the money paid out this side of Christmas, and I've no idea when they'll be back in whatever department deals with these things - my guess is that the majority of their staff will not just take bank holidays.

 

But, the good news is that the aceptance form does not have any silly conditions attached, just sign and return and we'll send you a cheque. As I don't have an account with the Hx any more, I'll happily sign that to get the cash.

 

They've also repeated that there is no default attached to my bank account, and if I do find one I've to supply eveidence and they'll investigate how it got there.

 

So, I'm about to borrow some money from relatives for the last time, which will allow me to buy presents for my kids (and long suffering wife!), as well as getting a couple of extra bits with the shopping tonight. It would have been odd going through Christmas without silly things like mince pies, but they had already been crossed off the shopping list when we felt we couldn't afford them.

 

I'm pleased to hear that a few others have taken the same path and got a result - well done all. Have a Happy Christmas!

[doo]

Same to you hillards, took the dog for a walk with a spring in my step, what a difference money makes. Anyway I will await their letter, they had better not be messing me about but it all sounded good, should have letter down by Wednesday they reckon, I asked if I could e-mail acceptance back and was told that would be ok. So once again many thanks for posting your experience on this site - without reading this I would have been worrying about putting the claim through court, would have definately done it though. HAPPY CHRISTMAS I'm so pleased for you so you go buy those mince pies............

[MARTIN3030]

CONGRATULATIONS !!!

Title duly changed.

Please take a moment to fill in the survey.

[hillards]

Thanks - Survey completed, although there wasn't a specific point that related to my case - it was after letters, but before court action. Maybe it needs a new point for cases settled before court action?

 

I just had a horrible thought - after reading a thread elsewhere relating to donations to this site...

 

I don't have a bank account, so can't fund my PayPal account (the easiste way to donate I think), or send a cheque (chances are if I get a new account it will be a restricted on, with no cheque book...), erm - hmmm, need to think about this one! I want to donate, I just hope it will be accepted it may be delayed a little, while I find a way to do it!

 

I've requested a bank draft, rather than an ordinary cheque, so I can get at the cash. I'll be attempting to open a new account somewhere, but need something to put in before I can do that - so it's not going to happen just yet.

 

Then I wonder why I don't get to bed until 4am... I spend far too much time on here! LOL

[hillards]

Just for my own peace of mind, I've just called the Birmingham office again to make sure they got my letter. Yes, all scanned on the system etc. and they can see that I asked for a Bankers Draft, rather than a normal cheque.

 

I'm told it's with payments office to be resolved, there shouldn't be a problem with my request. I did explain the circumstances.

 

Just watching for the postman now...