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Parcel delivery insurance is prohibited under section 57 – Consumer Rights Act – Read about It Here and in The Times. ×


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      Sorry for the long post but I don't want to miss out any relevant information: My wife bought a car from Trade Centre UK and have been having nothing but trouble with it. Unfortunately we paid of the finance used to buy the car as we weren't expecting this much trouble with the car as we we though we would have protection as buying from a dealer. We are wondering if we can still reject the vehicle since the finance plan has been paid off. Timeline is as follows: 13/12/2023 -15/12/2023 Bought car from Trade Centre UK for £10548 £2000 deposit paid on credit card on 13/12/2023 £8548 on finance from Moneybarn (arranged through Trade Centre UK). picked up car on 15/12/2023 Also bought lifetime warranty for £50/month 25/12/2023 Engine Management Light comes on. The AA called out and diagnosed the following error codes: P0133 - Lambda sensor (bank 1, sensor 1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Slow reaction. Error sporadic P0135 - Lambda sensor heat. circ.(bank1,sensor1) Oxygen Sensor. Error Message : Component defective Due to it being Christmas took a few days to get through to them but they booked me in for 28/12/2023 to run their own diagnostics. 28/12/2023 Took car in to Trade Centre so could check the car – They agreed it was the Oxygen Sensor and Booked me in for repair on 30/01/2024. I was told they had no earlier slots, and I would be fine to carry on driving car when I said I was afraid of problem worse. During diagnosing the problem, they reset the Engine Management Light. During drive home light comes back on. 29/12/2023 - 29/01/2024 I carry on driving the car but closer to the date, engine goes to reduced power every now and again – not being a mechanic I presumed that this was due to above fault. 20/01/2024 Not expecting any more problems paid off the finance on the car using personal loan from bank with lower interest rate. 30/01/2024 Trade Centre replace to O2 sensor (They also take it on a roughly 60mile road trip which seems a bit excessive to me – I can’t prove this as something prompted me take a picture of milage when I handed car in but I forgot take one on collection – only remembered next day.) 06/02/2024 Engine goes in reduced power mode again and engine management light comes on – Thinking the Trade centre’s 28 day warranty period was over I booked the car the into local garage for the next day to get problem fixed under the lifetime warranty package. Fault seems to clear after engine was switched off. 07/02/2024 In the Morning, I take it to local garage who say as the light gone off – the warranty company is unlikely to cover the cost of the repair or diagnostics and recommend I contact them when the light comes back on. In the evening the light comes back on and luckily I manage to get it back to the garage just before it shuts for the day. 08/02/2024 The Garage sends me a diagnostics video showing a lot error codes been picked up by their diagnostics machine including codes for Oxygen sensor and Nox Sensors, Accelerator pedal and several more. Video also shows EGR Hose not connected to the intake manifold properly, they believed this was confusing the onboard system as it is unlikely this many sensors would trigger at same the time but they couldn’t be certain until they repaired the hose. 13/02/2024 Finally get the car back as it took a while to get approval and payment for the repairs from the Warranty company. Garage told me to keep an eye the car as errors had cleared with the hose but couldn’t 100% certain that’s what caused the problem. 06/03/2024 Engine management light comes on again. Fed up I go into Trade Centre as I was just around the corner when it happened and asked them how to reject the car or have the problem fixed. They insist that as it’s over 28 days I need to get the car fixed under the warranty package I purchased and they could no longer fix the car as it was over 28 days. When I tried telling them it appeared to be the same or related problem they said they couldn’t help as I hadn’t contacted them earlier. I asked them if they were willing to connect the car to the diagnostics machine and tell me what the problem was, as a goodwill gesture, which he agreed to do and took the car to the back He came back around 30 minutes later and said they took a look at the sensor they replaced previously and there was nothing wrong with it and engine management light went off when they removed the sensor to check it. When I asked what the error code he couldn’t give me an exact fault but the said it one of the problems I told him earlier (Accelerator pedal). I have this visit audio recorded on my phone – I informed the reps I was recording several times. As the light wasn’t on, local garage couldn’t book me for a repair under warranty. 07/03/2024 Light came on so managed to book back into local garage for the 12/03/2024 Whilst waiting to take car into garage, I borrowed a OBD sensor and scanned for errors on the car. This showed the following errors: P11BE – Manufacturer specific code (Google showed this to be NOX sensor) P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow 12/03/2024 Took car to local garage and the confirmed the above errors. This leads me to believe that either Trade Centre UK reps lied and just reset the light or just didn’t check properly (Obviously I am unable to prove this) 22/03/2024 Finally got the car back as according to garage, the warranty company took a long to time to pay for the repairs 28/04/2024 Engine management Light has come back on. Using the borrowed OBD scanner I am getting the following codes: P0133 - Oxygen (Lambda) Sensor B1 S1: Response too Slow P2138 - Accelerator Position Sensors (G79) / (G185): Implausible Correlation I have not yet booked into a garage as I wanted to see what my rights are in terms of rejecting the car as to me the faults seem related. I can’t keep using taxi or train to get to work every time the car goes into the garage as it is getting very expensive. Am I right in thinking that they have used up their chance to repair when they conducted the repair end of January or when they refused to repair it in February ? If I am still able to reject the vehicle could you point to any sample letters or emails I can use. Thankyou for your advice on my next steps.
    • northmonk
      NPC/DCB(L) Vanishing Windscreen PCN Claimform - Taxi - Appealed - No Parking Or Waiting At Anytime - St Thomas Hospital, London, Se1 7eh.

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    • Post in Suing a parcel delivery company when you don't have a direct contract with them – third-party rights Copy of judgment available

      BankFodder posted a post in a topic,

      We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
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      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Parcel delivery insurance is prohibited under section 57 – Consumer Rights Act – Read about It Here and in The Times.

Supanet - xxxxxxxxxx **** Resolved****

SuzyJ
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SuzyJ

SuzyJ

Posted
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Will do, thanks for the advice and the 'other avenue to resolution' (ispa) did not know about that one. Might not get the letter on until tomorrow now but will get stuck in in the morning.

Thanks again.

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SuzyJ

SuzyJ

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I have written the letter as advised after going through a lot of other posts to get ideas on the wording. I have not sent it yet, thought it best to let you have a look at it first so you can let me know if you think I have left anything out or need to add anything else. Many thanks again for you help and advice.

 

8 June 2012

 

Supanet

TCS Support Centre

Time Technology Park

Blackburn Road

Burnley BB12 7TW

 

Dear Sir/Madam

ACCOUNT IN DISPUTE REF: xxxxxxxxxxx

 

With reference to your letter demanding the following

 

Remainder of contract £139.90

Cancellation fee £39.99

Current outstanding balance £13.99

Total to cancel account £193.88

 

I dispute all of the amounts detailed. The only contract I have ever agreed to with you was 6 years ago so no further contracts have ever been offered or requested since.

 

The cancellation fee cannot be demanded as there was no contract to cancel since the only one I have ever agreed to expired 5 years ago. Since the new laws regarding these contracts came into force I have not agreed to any new contract with you. I have never asked for or received any upgrades or downgrades to my service which may have ‘assumed’ a new contract with you.

 

I do not owe you any outstanding balance as you have been paid for all the time that you were supplying my broadband and for approximately a further 2 weeks beyond that.

 

I would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my liability for the sums in question.

 

I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed. Otherwise I will have no option but to make a complaint to Trading Standards and also inform the Office of Fair Trading of your actions.

 

Yours faithfully

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  • 3 weeks later...
SuzyJ

SuzyJ

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We have finally received a reply from Supanet, not their usual - almost by return - but over a week later.

This is what the body of the letter says:-

 

Thank you for your recent correspondence in relation to the above account.

 

After investigating your complaint I can confirm that I am unable to find any order confirmation to support our claim of the contract length and therefore agree that your service - although showing on our system as in contract, may not actually be.

 

I have therefore removed the costs associated with the remainder of the contract and the cancellation fee. I do however require you to pay the monthly cost up until the date of closure: 28/06/12.

 

This amount due is £14.99 only and can be paid with a card on 0845 120 4473. Alternatively, you may send a cheque or postal order to the address above.

 

I do hope this is a fair solution to your issue, however if there is anything further we can help with then please do not siditate to contact us again.

 

Bearing in mind the monthly cost was £13.99 and not £14.99 and it was paid 2 weeks before the supply was ceased, they have had 2 weeks beyond the cease date paid for.

 

Obviously they won't be getting any more money from my neighbours.

Just to make sure it becomes more difficult for them to behave like this to others I have send details to Ofcom and have added feedback about them on some website, one in particular is MoneySupermarket who have added it to their test case archive and asked if we would be willing to speak to journalists about it. Of course we said yes and now hoping to hear more from them in the not to distant future.

 

Thank you for your support and advice during this disupte, most of it I was able to cope with myself but the 'Account in Dispute' advice was invaluable to me and I wouldn't have know about it without your help.:yo:

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SuzyJ

SuzyJ

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I am happy for you to mark it as resolved. Once again, thank you.

 

I doubt that they will try to go to Court for the £14.99 (or £13.99 if they manage to work out how much they think my neighbours owe them), but if they do will certainly share our amusement with you! I am wondering if they may put something with the Credit Referece Agencies when they realise they are not going to get any more money, must remember to check in a few months time.

 

I think there are thousands of people out there thiinking that they have to pay for broadband contracts that they have not agreed to and haven't got the will or know-how to demand proof of the debt so they just pay it. Over the past few weeks I have read so many postings on websites giving that impression and I bet that most of them are pensioners who have no idea they are being taken for a ride and pay up rather than try to fight it as they don't feel they have the strength to get into a battle with aggressive broadband suppliers.

 

I shall move on to my next battle now, speaking to my council about a serious breach of Data Protection through not realising they had put the wrong attachment into an envelope disclosing some very personal details about someone we know!.:nono:

 

I may be back sooner than I think .....................

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  • 6 months later...
Highwaygirl

Highwaygirl

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I can say that there has never been any email renewing any contract within all the time I had been with them, only an email about monthly bill so they were lying to you. I was a customer of Supanet for 12 years. Service was ok, not fast but ok. I was originally on unlimited broadband £11.99 a month. When they got taken over by a Cyprus company they upped it instantly to £17.99. I stayed as it was unlimited and seemed easier than swapping. Then it went totally crazy. I was called to say usage exceeded but was only a curtesy call to warn me (since when was my unlimted package capped?) however I let it go but the monthly bill shot up (so much for it was only a curtesy call). After some months I was thinking to stop and find another ISP when they phoned to offer a phone and broadband package. It sounded ok so I agreed. OMG what a mistake! Contract came, wrong deal. Phoned up, ok will send another. Wrong again. Phoned (long time on 0845 hold) 3rd contract wrong again. Then date of phoneline changeover came, from BT to Supanet, call quality dropped 50%, could hear clicks and dialling as if I was sharing a line with 20 people. Then phone went completely. Caller display disappeared, 1571 service disappeared. Phone line dead! Broadband dead! I called technical help from another house, they were SO rude. In fact all the customer service people (and I spoke to many) were unhelpful. The tech guy actually said, well I dont know whats wrong and by the way you have a new phone number, I dont want a new number I said, well you have one anyway he said! Can try and get yours back but no promises.' Then said 'and youre not going to like this but I dont know when your broadband will be back on either'. I asked lots of times for explainations why I had no broadband and why contracts were always wrong, and to speak to managers as advised on their own customer charter pdf. I was told, managers are ALL busy in meetings and anyway they dont come to the phone. I was promised (actual word used) one guy would call me back in 10 minutes after checking account. 2 hrs later sitting by the phone - no call. I called (loooooooong time on hold) another person said oh, he shouldnt have said he would call you back. I finally wrote to the headquarters (couldnt face another phone call)saying I am cancelling. I had lost money over Christmas as I sell from home and if anyone wanted to pursue any contract obligations, I would sue them for loss of earnings. As far as I am concerned they did not provide me with any service to pay for. Broadband went down beginning Dec and never came back. I have now switched to BT. My call to get MAC code went as you can expect! YOU CANT LEAVE, you are in a contract!! (oh btw they issued me with contract no4 after last call! I didnt even order anything!) I would like to think this is now over but I have just checked my online billing and guess what?!!! I am over £50 in debt and on the bill are 2 phonelines!!!! They are seriously crazy.I have cancelled the direct debit but remains to be seen what their next move is. Stay away. They are ok so long as you dont mind them having full control and heaven help you if you have a problem. BT in comparison were angels of mercy on the phone. Helpful, knowledgable and respectful.

ps a friend of mine was also with Supanet, when they stopped they agreed to pay £10 a year to keep email address. Meantime they keep trying to charge £10 a month!

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