Employer/mental health issues

[pinkkibby]

Hi

My husband became stressed with work last year as he felt bullied by one of the managers. He ended up being signed off work with stress in December and at the time told work he wanted to raise a grievance at the time and made this known to HR. However, he then ended up with severe mental health problems and was in hospital for 2 months. One of the contributing factors was stress from work.

He has now been home for just over a month and has been signed off from work til the middle of May. He received a letter from work the other day asking him to go in for a meeting about his absence. I responded on his behalf and said that he didn't feel he was able to go in for a meeting at this stage and as he's been signed off til May, could we review the situation nearer that time when he may be well enough.

Today we've received a letter stating they want authority to access his medical records given the amount of time he has been off. Our initial reaction was 'no' due to the sensitive nature of his illness and the events that led up to him being detained in a secure psychiatric unit. However, I've since had a look on the internet and from what I can see, if he doesn't give them access, they are allowed decided whether he should continue being employed by them regardless of the fact he has a sicknote.

Can anyone advise? From our point of view we don't really want to deal with his work issues at the moment as he is still getting over his illness which was severe and we don't want them to know the details of everything that happened. Why isn't a doctors note enough and what are his rights?

He has been employed with them for over 12 months and maybe had one or two sick days in the whole time he has been employed which I think is about 3 years so he hasn't got an issue with sickness etc prior to December last year.

Any advice is welcome!

Thanks

[assisted blonde]

Does he want to go back to this job as it has obviously had a major affect on his health? that decision may help you decide how you want to procede with this, whatever you do be careful as your husband wont need any more stress at the moment.

[pinkkibby]

Hi

To be honest I don't think he wants to go back which is understandable but we are thinking he deserves the sick pay he will get for the time being after all he's been through..we want to get something out of it all and just don't feel like they should be calling the shots and deciding what's what after the stress they have caused him and the least they could do is pay sick pay until his sick period is up! Not that I'm bitter about it or anything

[becky2585]

I would usually say in these circumstances that it's best to cooperate. If you don't agree to helping the employer determine the nature of his illness, they may well be more likely to be able to fairly dismiss him on capability grounds as your husband refused to provide evidence to assist their investigation. That's the worst case scenario.

 

The issue is not the sick note, but his likely return to work. They may take a view without medical evidence that he won't be coming back, and dismiss him. With evidence in place that he may shortly be fit to return to work, that could help his case. If he won't be fit to return in the next few months, I guess you'd have to take a view on it. Ultimately he doesn't have to agree, but it may be best to send redacted medical records, relating only to his current condition.

[papasmurf1cx]

Can you tell us what the state of his grievance is? Also the bullying aspect, was there an element of discrimination at all ie was he ill before he went off sick or is his illness caused by the incidents?

 

You are clearly in Discrimination territory and his illness clearly would be covered under the Equality Act 2010. Even if there was no discrimination prior to him going off then HR and the company clearly have to be careful that their actions do not become discriminatory. The handling of the grievance and the handling of him during his illness have to be fair. Accessing his medical notes could be helpful on the other hand they could throw up matters that you and he would rather his work does not know. Signing a carte blanche access authority in my opinion when dealing with mental health issues is very fraught and should be avoided.

 

Seeing that you state "Our initial reaction was 'no' due to the sensitive nature of his illness and the events that led up to him being detained in a secure psychiatric unit." you need to come up with a solution. I suggest you play the 'reasonable adjustment' card. Write to HR stating that due to the nature of his illness you believe the EA 2010 aplies and that you ask for a RA in that they specifically ask questions they are seeking to assist in their process and that you will ask a doctor to answer them. Do not give unrestricted access to the notes. State that reports from the notes can be accomodated. Then when you get the questions copy it and forward it to the Consultant Psychiatrist (or you could do the privately too if you have the resources) with a coverung letter. Tell the doctor in that letter you want to see ALL communications and reports before they are disclosed. If there is anything in that report / letter then ask for it to be removed and / or suggest a form of words that is acceptable to you both. People generally just write and allow access... but it is fishing expedition for the other side and it can go horrible wrong if YOU don't control the flow of information.

 

If the company / HR decline to cooperate then they probably will have discriminated against him.

 

Check if you have Legal Protection Insurance to cover employment disputes (normally attached to home contents insurance policies) because you may need it in due course.

[pinkkibby]

Thanks for your responses everybody, very helpful!

 

In relation to your questions papasmurf, he had just said that he wished to raise a grievance shortly before he went off sick or it might have been initially when he went off sick and he sent an email saying he would like to raise a grievance, I would have to check. The HR lady then emailed him and said she would like to have a meeting to discuss the grievance, as he was then severely ill I responded and said he was in hospital and we would deal with the grievance at a later stage so it was just left at that. We since haven't had the energy or been in the right frame of mind to do anything more about it as we have been focusing on getting him out of hospital and getting better.

 

Prior to him going off sick in December, he had probably a couple of months where he felt like he was being bullied..things like he was told he was up for a job on the day shift (he worked nights) and then his manager virtually laughed in his face and told him he would never get it when he went for it. I think there were a couple of incidences of his manager swearing at him and shouting in his face and such like. He was made to feel like a fool. This wasn't the sole cause of his illness but I think it pushed him over the edge in terms of everything that subsequently happened. Now I'm thinking about it, I'm getting angry about it and thinking we should proceed with the grievance, it's just whether my husband is up to it really.

 

Your suggestion of reasonable adjustment is a very good one, that makes sense to me. There's no need for them to know all the details and they are not mental health experts so I can't see what use his medical records would do but if they have specific questions, I'm happy to get them answered.

 

Will check about the legal cover too. Thanks for the helpful information.

[papasmurf1cx]

OK that is helpful, but as these things go one response generates others.

 

The one thing I would say about grievances, especially those alleging management bullying and behaviour that is unbecoming as you describe, is that they can become nasty. Expect lies and more lies to cover their backs and even if proved no action will be taken against errant mangement. Nothing will be upheld in his favour and even if it is they won't discipline his managers. So you have to mentally prepare yourself and that is doubly difficult when also dealing with mental illness. These conditions can last many years and even a lifetime so ask yourselves, are you up to the task? Once you start his health (and yours) may get worse. Ask yourself are you a fighter or are you more pragmatic and see that early extraction would be better for his and your health? There is no shame in either you do what you think is best for yourselves.

 

is the company a public authority, large corporation or a smallish company? They will have Policies for Equality, Sickness, Grievances, Appeals etc and you need to see them and get copies. The time limits in those policies should be adhered to but they can be extended according to circumstane eg as you requested on the grieveance to deal with it when he is well enough.

 

You seem rather vague as to the incidents... you need to sit down and make a list of things that you want to raise in the grievance and try and get evidence about it eg witnesses (although don't expect any as people tend to want to protect their own jobs so beware what they say to you.) If witnesses are available get written and signed statements from them. Secure any written evidence eg emails applications and the like. Once you have done that try and formulate what the grievance is about you will need that later.

 

Union membership? What has happened there if relevant.

[assisted blonde]

Agree with Becky and Papa in that a grievence can turn nasty and that its always better to cooperate, or be seen to be cooperating at least initially. is he being paid sick pay at the moment? if so how long will it be paid for? Be reasonable for now, it will be less stressful for both you and your husband and the important thing is not to hinder his recovery by getting into stressful argumentative situations. Just be a bit careful, dont jump at anything and dont say too much yet, see how it looks to be panning out, sometimes an employer may be more reasonable or fair than you think they might be.

Hope it all works out ok

[lbruk]

I would suggest a yes to the medical records, or make them send a questionairre to his GP and consultant.

 

When you raise your grievance i would suggest you ask for the stress management policy and risk assessments (the latter being a legal requirement) if they cannot supply these then you onto a good start.

 

The reply to your grievance will be insulting, and upsetting, unless you have a really good employer. Try not to take it personally and just think they are trying to cover themselves legally. Appeal the grievance and then get another insulting reply!

 

Its not very dignifying, and not very fun at all, but it is a step to making them take you seriously. And you never know they might say something that you'll be able to get hold of and get them for!

 

Good Luck!

[SweetLorraine]

I have suffered work stress to the point where I have needed time off. Please look to your GP for assistance in this - they can be an absolute godsend in these circumstances. Certainly my doctor did not take kindly to my employer's behaviour - and she was very supportive to me without being antagonistic towards my employer.

 

She was very good at asking me 'what do you want to do?' and advising me what could be done. GPs have to deal with the mental (and physical) health fallout from the bad behaviour of employers these days. Please seek out this support.

 

All the best to you both - do remember that once this is over calmer times will come back.