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    • Makers of insect-based animal feed hope to be able to compete with soybeans on price.View the full article
    • Thank you for posting up the results from the sar. The PCN is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4. Under Section 9 [2][a] they are supposed to specify the parking time. the photographs show your car in motion both entering and leaving the car park thus not parking. If you have to do a Witness Statement later should they finally take you to Court you will have to continue to state that even though you stayed there for several hours in a small car park and the difference between the ANPR times and the actual parking period may only be a matter of a few minutes  nevertheless the CEL have failed to comply with the Act by failing to specify the parking period. However it looks as if your appeal revealed you were the driver the deficient PCN will not help you as the driver. I suspect that it may have been an appeal from the pub that meant that CEL offered you partly a way out  by allowing you to claim you had made an error in registering your vehicle reg. number . This enabled them to reduce the charge to £20 despite them acknowledging that you hadn't registered at all. We have not seen the signs in the car park yet so we do not what is said on them and all the signs say the same thing. It would be unusual for a pub to have  a Permit Holders Only sign which may discourage casual motorists from stopping there. But if that is the sign then as it prohibits any one who doesn't have a permit, then it cannot form a contract with motorists though it may depend on how the signs are worded.
    • Defence and Counterclaim Claim number XXX Claimant Civil Enforcement Limited Defendant XXXXXXXXXXXXX   How much of the claim do you dispute? I dispute the full amount claimed as shown on the claim form.   Do you dispute this claim because you have already paid it? No, for other reasons.   Defence 1. The Defendant is the recorded keeper of XXXXXXX  2. It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant. 3. As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance. The Claimant was simply contracted by the landowner to provide car-park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner. Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim. 4. In any case it is denied that the Defendant broke the terms of a contract with the Claimant. 5. The Claimant is attempting double recovery by adding an additional sum not included in the original offer. 6. In a further abuse of the legal process the Claimant is claiming £50 legal representative's costs, even though they have no legal representative. 7. The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety. It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all. Signed I am the Defendant - I believe that the facts stated in this form are true XXXXXXXXXXX 01/05/2024   Defendant's date of birth XXXXXXXXXX   Address to which notices about this claim can be sent to you  
    • pop up on the bulk court website detailed on the claimform. [if it is not working return after the w/end or the next day if week time] . When you select ‘Register’, you will be taken to a screen titled ‘Sign in using Government Gateway’.  Choose ‘Create sign in details’ to register for the first time.  You will be asked to provide your name, email address, set a password and a memorable recovery word. You will be emailed your Government Gateway 12-digit User ID.  You should make a note of your memorable word, or password as these are not included in the email.<<**IMPORTANT**  then log in to the bulk court Website .  select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box. .  then using the details required from the claimform . defend all leave jurisdiction unticked  you DO NOT file a defence at this time [BUT you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 ] click thru to the end confirm and exit the website .get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim type your name ONLY no need to sign anything .you DO NOT await the return of paperwork. you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.
    • well post it here as a text in a the msg reply half of it is blanked out. dx  
  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like

Beserker v A&L ***WON***


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Hiyas,

 

Just a big thx to you all for the information on this site. I visited the Govan Law Centre site before I registered here here and have sent off the Data Protection Act letter. I have had financial problems in the past and have paid large sums of money to A&L with regard to these, as a consequence I do not have the best credit rating, however, there are no ccj's only a couple of default notices from 5 years ago.

Now I am concerned that A&L are going to close my current account at some point. I am not (lol) very attached to A&L and am quite prepared to open a parachute account (wish I had read about this before sending the DPA letter). Will having the adverse credit rating affect my getting a new bank account? I would also like to have a go at A&L through the courts if they try and close my current account as this is hardly equitable , which I understood was a principle of English law.

I will keep you posted of events.

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Thx have just applied to Co-Op (it's the old hippy in me) online.

 

I will continue reading and learning.

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Just a thought should I start to add the "Alliance and Leicester Data Protection Act letter sent DD/MM/YYYY" signature to the bottom of any posts? Can anyone tell me how to do it?

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Cheers Michael, checking

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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  • 4 weeks later...

What a parcel!! Wish I could charge 'em an hourly rate for going through this lot! OK guys, guess I have to do the spreadsheet stuff, some questions :-

 

a) oldest charges first or t'other way round?

b) Interest after lba i.e. when you do moneyclaim?

c) If the total charges are greater than £5k break them into two claims?

 

They also seem quite keen on me as they have actually sent me my statements going back to 6 March 2000, can I claim the penalty charges back beyond 6 years? or is it 6 years from date of SAR?

 

Thanks

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Oh I have just read the last para. of the covering letter...

 

"If you want to query any aspect of the details provided, please write to me at the address given above"

 

Oh I will, I will....

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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What a parcel!! Wish I could charge 'em an hourly rate for going through this lot! OK guys, guess I have to do the spreadsheet stuff, some questions :-

 

a) oldest charges first or t'other way round?

b) Interest after lba i.e. when you do moneyclaim?

c) If the total charges are greater than £5k break them into two claims?

 

Thanks

a) Not sure, maybe it makes no difference.

b) Yes.

c) Yes.

Luck, dude. :cool:

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Just worked out the charges + interest on their penalties = £4989.93. Handy, just under the £5k :). Prelim letter sent today.

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Threads merged.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Quick response to LBA!! Fob off letter "Our reference aaannnn/UNFAIR4" .At least they did'nt charge me £25 for the pleasure. Arrogance comes before a fall though:).

 

MCOL or visit to Reading CC?

 

Can someone give me a link to the words to use?

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Its in the bank templates library.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Doh, thanks Caro

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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I feel young and unsure again :smile:.

 

Advice on the words for MCOL please :-

 

"Claimant has account XXXXXXXXX with Defendant conducted on their standard terms and conditions. Claimant is claiming the return of £4926.01 taken by Defendant in charges over 6 years. The Defendant's charges are a disproportionate penalty and therefore unenforceable as they are contrary to common law. They are also invalid under the Unfair Contracts Terms Act 1977 s.4 and under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.Para.8 and sch.2.1.e.

In the event that the charges are not a penalty they are unreasonable within the meaning of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 s.15. Defendant has declined justification of charges despite repeated requests. Claimant claims interest under Sec.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% a year from 9 November 2000 to 28 September 2006 of £34.48 and also interest at same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of £1.09 (Amount claimed x 0.00022)."

 

 

 

Interest taken from the most excellent Spreadsheet:)

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Interest doesn't look right, but the wording is from the template isn't it?

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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The interest is £4926.01 x 0.00022 = 1.0837 = 1.09? or can I not do that...

 

Yup the words are from the template, although as I can't remember when we opened the account (long, long time ago) I simplified that sentence by removing the "opened on".

 

The interest on the total owed is directly from the complex spread sheet...

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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You should be charging interest on each charge from the day it left your account. At the rate of £1.07 a day that is only about a months interest. Check your spreadsheet.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I will check the figures however, but surely are we not talking two different figures here:- 8 % is on the monies illegally taken by A&L from the day they were taken, I would not have been owed £4926 in 2000. The £1 odd is the daily rate of interest from the day of MCOL to the date of judgement....

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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If you were charged £20 on 1st September 2000 you would start charging interest from that date on that charge. To give you an idea I had charges from Yorkshire Bank between 2000 and 2003 of just under £3000, but the interest so far is over £1200. The spreadsheet should be showing the interest for each charge from the date it was imposed.

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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two points, I will check things obv, but:-

1) £4926 was not the penalty charges imposed at the start of the period in question. This figure is cumulative from september 2000. I wonder sometimes......

2) I thought the 1.09 odd figure is the interesrt charged on the sum claimed from date of MCOL to date of judgement (s'pose equivalent to 8%?)?

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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Big appologies :- just been looking at the interest on their interest!!

Am I going to get away with claiming £1291!!! interest, oh boy that would be very sweet.

MCOL revised to:-

 

"Claimant has account XXXXXXXXX with Defendant conducted on their standard terms and conditions. Claimant is claiming the return of £4926.01 taken by Defendant in charges over 6 years. The Defendant's charges are a disproportionate penalty and therefore unenforceable as they are contrary to common law. They are also invalid under the Unfair Contracts Terms Act 1977 s.4 and under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.Para.8 and sch.2.1.e.

In the event that the charges are not a penalty they are unreasonable within the meaning of the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982 s.15. Defendant has declined justification of charges despite repeated requests. Claimant claims interest under Sec.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at a rate of 8% a year from 9 November 2000 to 28 September 2006 of £1291.53 and also interest at same rate up to the date of judgment or earlier payment at a daily rate of £1.36 (Amount claimed x 0.00022)".

 

 

 

Thanks for you help guys, would have looked a bit silly. Comments, please.

We haven't got the money, so we've got to think!

Ernest Rutherford

 

A & L

Data Protection Act Letter sent 11/08/06

Data rec'd 14/09/06, Prelim letter sent 16/09/06

LBA sent 22/09/06, MCOL 6QZ68670 issued 2/10/06 - chq for £6,375.34 rec'd 04/11/06.

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That sounds much more like it! Glad you got it sorted. Just remember the donation button when you get all that lovely lolly back.;)

The Consumer Action Group is a free help site.

Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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