pup sold as kc registered but not received them

[sapphirey1966]

Can anyone please give me sum advise on what i can do with regards to this.

 

I bought a bullmastiff pup on 27th December 2010. She was advertised as kc registered, micro - chipped, ect. when i first contacted the breeder via text message asking about this pup, he sent me a text confirming she was kc registered and that he was awaiting the paperwork from kennel club, he also sent me this in an email when he sent me photos of the pup stating exactly the same and that again he would forward the paperwork onto me.

 

When i went to get pup again i confirmed with him that she was kc registered and he said he had filled the paperwork out on the kennel clubs online website and that as soon as he received them he would forward them onto me. He also said she was micro chipped and gave me the micro chip form to fill out into my name and address, then he said he had to take one part of the micro chip form to his vet and the other part he would send of to the micro chip company and that they would send me out paperwork in my name.

 

I have not received this paperwork (any of them) and i have tried to call, text and email the breeder and he is not getting back to me. When i call it goes straight to his voicemail.

 

He was originally first selling the pups for £800 (their was 4 boys and 1 girl pup in the litter), he was left with the girl pup and lowered the price just to get her homed he put her up in the end for £450 or near offer. I offered him £400 for her and at the same time checked to make sure that this price would still include all her paperwork, which he said it deffinately was including all her kc and mirco chip paperwork.

 

I asked him for mums kc registered name and registered number and also dads - so if need be i could confirm things with the kennel club, which he sent to me mums details via text message. But stated he did not have dads to hand as they used a stud dog, he only gave me dads registered name.

 

As i was not getting anywhere with him i decided to try and track dads owner down, which i did. The lady that owns dad only allowed them to use her stud dogs as a favour to her friend (who is a friend of pups mums owner). She said she handed over dads details so pups could be registered and it was on the understanding that they was going to be registered. She said she would get back to her friend and find out what was going on. Her friend said to her that the owner of mum has deffinately registered pups and was still awaiting paperwork from the kennel club.

 

I also found out from this lady that the registered number that the person i bought pup of had given to me for mum was not mums number but infact dads registered number. Which she was not happy about.

 

I have since contacted the kennel club asking if they could let me know if pups had been registered and i gave them all the details i had. They have come back to me today and stated that no pups have been registered to either of mum or dad on any of their records at all. They confirmed that the person i bought pup of owns the mum of my pup.

 

Can anyone advise on what i can or should do about this. I no longer have the texts or emails he sent to me as i clear them on a regular basis and didnt even cross my mind that this was going to happen and that i may need them. But when i last emailed him asking for the paperwork i did say in my email that i still had the text and email where he stated that he would send pups papers to me, even though i hadnt still got them but he doesnt know that. I await any help that anyone can give. I just feel sorry for the people who paid £800 for the first pups as they wont get paperwork either.

 

I wanted to have a go at showing her and possibly breede her and he knew this, as i also asked if he had put any endorsements on paper with regards to breeding, but i cant do either without papers.

[Guest naillig]

To be honest -i am sick of people buying cats and dogs all the time to "breed with " .

Doesn''t anyone think about all the healthy animals being put to sleep every day as they can''t find a home for them ! - we are not talking about 1 or 2 here -we are talking of hundreds of animals per DAY !

And still people want to breed- its just a money making scheme as it looks like you have found out and are going to do too !

 

There are pedigree rescues too if you bother to look !

[Conniff]

I no longer have the texts or emails he sent to me as i clear them on a regular basis

 

What ISP are you with and what email program are you using ? You can send that in a pm if you don't want to publish here.

[hightail]

What is it you hope to achieve here? There is no doubt this pup was misdescribed and you can prove it but the only difference it makes is that you can't use the pup for breeding. Are you prepared to return the pup for a refund because it was not as described? If not then there's not a lot you can do. If pups normally sell for £800 and you were aware of this then you already got a substantial discount which I'd guess means you paid about the right price for an unregistered animal. You have no idea what the others sold for by the way, you only know an initial asking price.

 

Don't know so much about dogs but a breeder who is prepared to sell at a lot less than the 'going rate' for a breed should set alarms off in any buyer's head, whatever yarn they spin. It's a common tactic with any con to start high and offer huge discounts and definitely a ploy used by backyard breeders.

[jackieandwayne]

I too cannot abide this constant puppy breeding. Especially the poor staffies who are having such a bad press at the moment. That is just my opinion however, and yes I appreciate your problem, especially if you are a genuine dog lover who wanted to show your new dog at KC shows. . I can only tell you what I myself would do in this situation. If you are minded to breed from this dear little soul then you won;t take my advice. I have an awful lot to do with problem dogs.

 

I hope that you love your pup. and I also hope that you see now how dreadful all this breeding for profit is and what the consequences can be. If this was me, I would kiss goodbye to any monies I had handed over. I would kick myself for being a bit naive, but I would then look at that lovely bundle of joy just waiting to be my best friend, and then the money wouldn't matter. I would just accept the situation, but know that at the end of the day I got the best deal. Because, why did you buy the pup? To be your friend for the whole of its natural life or to make money from her? You have your friend, so if you are a dog lover that will do for you. If she is just to be bred from, then I believe you have her for the wrong reasons.

 

However, as I said this is just my opinion, and it has to be a strong opinion, because i help to rehome so many problem dogs it is part of my responibility to get this message across.

 

I am sure you could go the County Court route if you wished, its quite easy to do yourself for a reasonable fee, and I'm sure people on here can help you with that. But you must be prepared to return the pup, and if you are prepared to do that then I have to say I believe you have her for the wrong reasons.

 

So my best advice to you is to keep that pup if you love her, you'll have forgotten about the money many years down the line, but you'll have her loyalty and love for much longer. If she starts getting pushed and pulled between different owners now it will affect her behaviour, she could become one of the many problem dogs I see, and may end up being put down - in which case what was the point of her being born at all?

 

I hope you won't be offended by what I have said, I'm just getting you to try and think outside the box, and put this little one's welfare above any other concern.

[jackieandwayne]

And now I re-read your post I see you "wanting to have a go at showing her". Well, let me tell you that all this KC showing stuff is so incredibly boring. Who cares what a dog looks like, lets see what it can do! You will have more fun and satisfaction from enrolling in a puppy class as soon as you can, then going on to the Good Citizen Award with her. Get all the basics out the way and then... at 12 months get out on a good agility course. This is one of the best ways to get a true bond with your dog, show off its intelligence and skills, as well as yours as a handler. Later on have a go at flyball - you'll wet yourself laughing and be very proud when your little one wins you a ribbon. Enter all the fun competitions run by the local shelters, show all those pratts out there that actually staffies are fantastic little dogs.

 

To me, this is what having a dog is all about, not poncing around with a hair dryer in a tent full of lethargic looking animals who'd much rather be rolling on their backs in horse pooh if anyone bothered to ask them.

 

I do apologise to any owners who love showing at KC and Crufts, its just not my cup of tea as you probably gleaned. And if this pup is not registered she won't be meeting you guys anyway!

 

I hope you sort the problem, if only to show up the person who sold her to you, I am secretly hoping you will keep that pup. I hope you can come back and tell us what you decide, because its an important subject.

 

Actually, I think I might give Trading Standards or whatever they call themselves now, a call. I would tell them that no way was my dog going anywhere but that I didn;t want to see other people (who may not be so concerned with animal welfare as I am) getting caught like this. Then I would leave it at that.

[sapphirey1966]

To be honest -i am sick of people buying cats and dogs all the time to "breed with " .

Doesn''t anyone think about all the healthy animals being put to sleep every day as they can''t find a home for them ! - we are not talking about 1 or 2 here -we are talking of hundreds of animals per DAY !

And still people want to breed- its just a money making scheme as it looks like you have found out and are going to do too !

 

There are pedigree rescues too if you bother to look !

 

In reply to your statement. I wanted to show this puppy and if and only if she was in good health and after having all relevant vet checks i would consider breeding from her and again only also if she did well in the show ring, mainly so i could keep one of her pups and possibly show on. I am not a breeder and would not breed from any dog the RSPCA so please before u start to attack somone next time make sure u have full facts first.

[Guest naillig]

I stand by my comments and agree with poster above too.

 

You state you would only breed from her if she did wll in the show ring -thats another way to ensure you get a better price is it not ????

 

Why not just have a dog , love it and enjoy it and care for it properly .

 

Why are they always seen as money making machines !

[sapphirey1966]

i do understand where u are coming from and yes pups welfare is and will always be put first and there is no way i would part with her no matter what. As for flyball or agility im sorry but i have bought a bullmastiff and they are heavy, bulky cumbersome dogs that do not do well in them kinds of activities at all. She may never be up to the standard for showing anyway but that is not my point here. Yes i looked around for a pup that i could possibley show (as its somthing i have been interested in for years but never done with any of my previous dogs - and my little girl is very much into going to dogs shows and wanting to do it). I have worked closely with the RSPCA rehoming dogs and also helping abused and ill tret dogs to adjust to a family life (having them in my own home and re-abilitating them) and some i have not been able to part with and ended up keeping myself. I have also had many a mongrel and pedigree dog. And yes i do agree totally that to many people i trying to profit out of breeding any kind of animal. But this was and is not my intentions i want to do it (if i ever did do it) to have one of my dogs pups and for the love of the breed and again i stress if i did breed from her it would be after she has had all health checks and i would not breed her if she had any hereditary problems or anything else. I feel that i asked this breeder all the right questions and like many a breeder i know that they do not always have the paperwork back from the kennel club by the time pups are ready to go and they normally do send them on. But i feel if when u do get done over like this if you dont make a stand against these breeders then they will keep on doing this to other people and i bought a pup with paperwork as advertised be it no matter what price i paid for her, that was what he was advertising and he lowered the price as he had sold all the others and she was last left and obviously getting older so would have been harder to sell the older she got. If u went a bought a washing machine with warranty and was told it would be sent onto u then u found out there was no warranty at all i think u would be annoyed and want to do somthing about it.

[sapphirey1966]

Im with sky and using windows mail (i think used to be outlook express).

[hightail]

If u went a bought a washing machine with warranty and was told it would be sent onto u then u found out there was no warranty at all i think u would be annoyed and want to do somthing about it.

 

Yes I would and I would do something about it. What I'm saying here is that this was a private sale so where SoGA is concerned the only issue is whether the pup was misdescribed. Obviously she was but your only remedy is to return her for a refund and I'd guess you already love her too much to want to do that. You got a pet dog at a knockdown price for that breed. Doesn't matter whether I or anyone else think the price of pedigree dogs is ridiculous or whether people should be breeding at all. The point is whether you truly want your legal remedy which is to lose your dog to get your money back. Don't think I would once I'd already bonded with the dog.

[jackieandwayne]

Glad you came back Sapphire because now we all know you are a genuine dog lover. A dog of mine caused the neighbours dog to have 9 puppies yonks ago - and I know what you mean, not only did I rehome them I had to keep one! All my dogs are now firmly snipped. Border collies see, too many of them.

 

Where did I get the idea it was a staffie from LOL! I agree that flyball might be a bit much (can't see her standing much chance against the borders!) unless she intended to physically knock down her competitors with brute force! But I still think she could do agility at low impact (tunnels, low A frame, jumping on the stands). Keeps them fit and sociable. And then, because she will become so in tune with you, think on, if you really get to go in the professional show ring with her, won't it look good as she trots along by your side! Bugger the obedience mum, I do it because I love you and you play with me! That'll brighten the boring show ring up a bit. Its probably just me, but whenever I' ve had the chance to go to a professional show, all I get is a feeling of tension everywhere. I admire the dogs, but its just not my thing!

 

Well, yes if I had a beef about the washing machine I would go balistic, whatever necessary to get what was my right, I expect I'd probably kick it a few times as well; but that is an inanimate object and doesn't involve any other emotion but my foul temper when on one. I would never risk losing my much loved new pup over something i should probably kick myself for!

 

I'm just pleased to hear she will be ok. And I hope you have many happy years with her even if you will insist on putting her in those dreadful shows - I hate Miss World as well!

[janmal2000]

has the vet checked the pup as being in good health and microchipped? get report off them stating as such so you have evidence that he has not fulfilled some of his contract, same if you can get a letter from KC stating both parents registered but pups not, and the same from the stud stating she only allowed her stud to be used if pups going to be registered. this is your evidence you will need to try to compile a case against him.

 

hand deliver )take a photo of you doing the posting) as well as posting recorded delivery, a formal letter of complaint stating you have not received the paperwork which was to be provided by him as agreed. as you are still waiting, he has defaulted on the contract of sale and if he dosnt supply them within 7 days then you will issue a claim against him under the small claims court. tell him you have evidence against him to prove your contract against him but dont tell him what!

 

what are you going to do if he asks or pup back and refund you etc?

 

there is nothing wrong with buying pedigree pups, showing or breeding if done in a responsible manner. when i had my Rottweiler we attended shows and i was so proud of my girl but if she didnt enjoy it, i would never have done it. if she was having a 'bad day' and didnt want to show, we wouldnt. you cant force dogs to do things they dont want to do and show dogs enjoy it! they also do other things as well as being shown, such as family pets who go down the beach ot up mountains for a run.

equally, there is at least one breed rescue for every pedigree dog out there, which is sad but a fact of life. the rescues are always full of pedigree and mongrel dogs, all of which have something to offer the right home. i worked for NCDL as well as breed my own pups. i assist local rescues with transport,fostering etc and have seen some of the most horrific cases of abuse and neglect - of ALL types of dogs. even dogs that costs hundreds of pounds can end up half dead through neglect. there is no line drawn. people have the right to decide what and where their dog comes from if its the right decision for the dog and i also hope they do always consider a rescue dog as these are the ones most in need.

[Surfer01]

As said the breeder dropping the price so much should have set off alarm bells. We were respected and well known small breeders for many years and at some point may return to breeding. Unfortunately in this case there is not much you can do on your own unless you have a copy of the original ad that stated the puppies were KC registered etc. If you do, you will have a very strong case of misrepresentation, but your local Trading Standards will need to take this up. They will prosecute and when they win, only then can you sue the breeeder.