Bother with Barclays and Barclaycard.

[Ayr]

In 2006 I had tried to make a payment to Barclays in their bank.

 

I am disabled and standing in queues tends to result in me falling over (the name of this is something-or-other-hypotension which is a part of the condition i am stuck with). So I had gone to the seated area of the bank and waited until someone saw me there (I also thought they were the best people to speak to about getting statements in large print, as despite asking often on the phone - this never happened).

 

After a while of having no luck on the phone she said she would do it later - and I offered her the money to meet my standing orders - but she said she could not take it and I would have to wait in the queue at the front.

 

I waited as long as I could but had to leave when I knew I was close to falling over. I went outside, but had really left it too late and ended up on the ground at the edge of the road.

 

A taxi driver had seen me wobble before going over, and came out to help me, and took me home.

 

Barclays hit me with fees of £90 and initially said these might be refunded - but then just became pains.

 

Anyway - to cut a long story short - the costs ended up massive, including being evicted as they blocked money being drawn on my card, which I had tried to use to pay my rent with while errors in my incapacity benefit DLA and housing benefit were sorted out.

 

So I ended up homeless - but basically passed round relatives for almost two years until my health picked up enough to get a place to stay on my own again.

 

During this time I never got benefits - as no one wanted me staying and getting mail at their house why the bank were being stroppy about things (they were declining to email me - which was best as it meant I could get it where ever I was - but called me over 160 times. I was worried with the frequency of calls, and that it would risk me staying with relatives, so I diverted the number to my email - and that was how I knew the number of calls - all are stored.

 

Cutting to the chase - I want to try to fix this - as stress worsens my condition and it has been hanging over my head now for years - and I now have an address of my own.

 

I have had no contact with the bank via letter since a mail diversion I got ended near the end of 2007, and they never got round to managing large print which never helped matters. My emails to them resulted in being told they would not deal with me via email.

 

I feel let down by them - and by the benefits agency - as if what I was entitled to had been paid, I could have paid the bank fees (as I had previously) and just put it down to experience.

 

I read here that its possible to end some old credit card agreements - as they don't comply with the law - mine was from the mid 90s - is this likely to be one that they cannot enforce? However, its unlikely I still have the letters they sent, and anyway to try dealing with masses of small print mail is a nightmare. However, I do have the telephone numbers of the people who keep leaving phone messages on my email.

 

In whatever they claim I owe, there will be a high amount of charges - with most being in periods where my benefits were stopped. Additionally - they owed me for money they paid to an ISP after I had swapped to another, but their unwillingness to send out large print seemed to initially be centred around me not seeing how much they had paid in error. They had also changed the date my credit card payment was due - but and only included details of this it tiny writing on my bill. This meant I had paid them about £200 at £12 a month, as my standing order from Barclays to Barclaycard was now always a couple of days late (I wonder why they did that?)

 

Any suggestions?

 

Also - if this is in the wrong place - could you move it please?

[silverfox1961]

Hi,

I'm not going to go into how angry I feel for you.

 

What you could do is to send a SAR and a CCA to the bank. The SAR letter is number 4 here:

 

The Consumer Forums - Bank charges templates (consumer)

 

Enclose a £10 postal order and send it by recorded delivery. You will need to sign it but make it slightly different or use signguard which you can find on the site.

 

The CCA request is letter 8 here:

The Consumer Forums - Debt collectors

 

Send with a £1 postal order and send by recorded delivery.

 

Once you get the details of your SAR, it may show up the failings of BC which you may be able to complain about. Without a paper trail from when you were having hassle with them, it will be hard to prove what they did.

[DoomPriestKano]

let down? LET DOWN? they haven't just let you down, they have behaved positively disgustingly towards a member of the public who requires assistance, i'm guessing you mentioned to the lady that you were unable to wait for that long in the queue?

 

christ i'm angry! and that's not a regular thing!

 

Follow silverfox's advice, it's easy and should bear some fruit if the circumstances allow it.

 

Also, the health card is an ace in the hole, when you contact them via letter to claim on your charges / interest, pile on the guilt for allowing you to suffer in one of their branch queue's despite asking for help, mentioning the resulting incident outside, they wont risk arguing as it's a matter they would find very awkward to deal with. They also tend to get jittery if you mention Watchdog, the OFT or any other asset that will happily screw them over should you report the matter.

[Ayr]

Thank you for your suggestions.

 

I feel massively reassured after what feels like being ****ed on for years that some people actually seem interested and helpful.

 

Pretty weird - as you can guess what happened really annoys me - and I lost most of my belongings when I was evicted,

 

But after posting here and seeing support I felt a little empowered.

 

Suddenly I feel I would rather let them jump through the hoops I have faced - rather than relying 100% upon a British procedure - when basically most of the banks are now British owned - and in any court cases the majority of judges seem to fall as "company men".

 

I don't mean I will be popping round to Barclays for my appointment with the manager while sporting a chain saw, However, in the UK there is the "rule of law" which in simplistic terms means that the same laws cover us all.

 

I have been telephoned 160 times, so which Barclays director's home number can I get first?

[slick132]

Hi Ayr,

 

I think you should maybe consider this more before you give Barclays your new address. They'll be all over you like a rash, looking for whatever debt was left with the bank and with Barclaycard.

 

Proving the bank was at fault about the current a/c may be harder than you think. Getting charges refunded is also now far harder than before the OFT test case went against the consumer.

 

Reclaiming any penalty charges from BC will be a doddle, by comparison. But they'll have your address and will use it to harass you from here to eternity.

 

[Ayr]

Thanks for your comment, I did expect there to be a quid pro quo for stirring things.

 

In the past I had worked for the CAB - and have some pretty horrific stories about sheriffs officers, but there never seemed to be anything like the horror stories I have read here about debt collectors (although from about 1995 I never really dealt with that aspect of things any longer).

 

My sister works abroad, and I had thought about asking her to send my mail for me, and I gather in non EU and non commonwealth countries its virtually impossible to chase UK debt, or enforce UK court orders.

 

I still have loads of mail that is unopened, as it was shoved in a box where it was diverted to - and so about summer until the end of 2007 is like this. There was no mail after that and any they sent I would guess would be returned to to them.

 

I had shoved loads of earlier mail into the box too - as none was in large print, so would need scanned and enlarged onto the screen. However, when I was being passed round relatives - this option was unavailable so its still unread. I am sure I can still find the box.

 

I had also thought about bankruptcy, as I don't have anything left to lose - and unfortunately it seems really unlikely my health would let it happen in the near future. But this seems like giving in to them although would stuff the council for the full council tax they claim to be entitled to at the period between my benefits being stopped and being evicted from my flat.

[Ayr]

How long would it be before these claimed debt would become unchasable?

 

I have seen six years mentioned here - but also five for in Scotland.

 

I am in Scotland.

 

Also from when do they decide this date to be from?

 

I would guess the last twice I had called them about my account was to get them to change the date they were making the payment to my credit card - although each time they never changed it (they had moved my payment date forward for some reason without letting me know - so my standing order from the same banking company was now late). This would be about easter 2007.

 

I think my bank account must have died about December 2007 - as my mobile phone which was on contract (although outwith the minimum term) and paid by standing order stopped working about then - although to be honest it could be a couple of months earlier.

 

The last time they contacted me in a way I had requested was spring 2007 - when I had emailed them telling to only contact me via email (given this makes sense with due to aspects of my disability - and even the totally useless DWP say this is an acceptable request) - so they emailed saying they could not do this - which I will still have on the computer if I look back.

 

I had made further attempts via their web site - but even when I was a customer there were problems with online banking so it seldom worked. The last contact resulted in no reply - and I think was via a box to contract them on their site - again probably spring 2007.

[slick132]

Under the Limitation Act 1980, a debt becomes statute barred after 6 years in England and Wales and 5 years in Scotland.

 

The clock starts ticking from the last time you either paid toward the debt, or acknowledged it in writing.

 

So you'd have a further 2 or 3 years before then.

 

[Ayr]

So I guess the best way would be to write a letter to Barclays and Barclaycard - asking for a data protection subject access request?

 

Do they count as one or two different requests?

 

Also - as I guess this is leaving me open to a kicking from them, what should I expect to happen as soon as the request goes in?

 

Also - would it be Barclaycard - or one of the dozens of numbers that have been calling me (going straight to email - which I cannot actually hear from this computer - as its an old server, and has no sound card, or from my 486/50 laptop, as it has no sound either, and now has problems with many web pages, even with flash cancelled). But I can get them at a relatives - although the email's title shows the number calling - and the last time I listened to one - it was a computer not a person asking for me - so I can see who called. In saying that however, they were all pretty similar "call us mr debtor, its really important - your reference number is 123456"

 

Lastly - what have I to lose by going bankrupt - as it seems that's them off my back at once - and it lasts a year - with me currently having sufficient hospital appointments to cover most of the next 4 months - but its been like this for years now - so i dont see me suddenly getting back to work in the next year - although it would be good to thing that I will work again one day - as life currently is seriously ****e.

 

Also (sorry) - what can they do me for - I have no savings, no assets, am currently getting about £63 a week as my benefit keeps getting cancelled, which means there is a delay before housing benefit starts again - and my DLA is on hold after they lost the appeal (paperwork) - so £9 a day to live on. I know this sounds pretty unbelievable - but it got so bad my MP is trying to sort it.

Edited March 22, 2010 by Ayr

[oilyrag]

Hi Ayr,

 

I do not want to be downer on this as you are in enough difficulty as it is. But after the experience we had with Barclaycard, after being diagnosed with a serious untreatable heart condition we talked to them and explaining the situation trying to be reasonable. Huh! They then exploited that weakness and hammered us.

 

That is until I found CAG. You have more rights than you can imagine at the moment. You will get good sound advice here and you should consider making use of it. But please keep the health card as the ace up your sleeve should and I repeat should they get as far as taking any action against you. Use the ace where it will really matter and that is in a court of law. I would never be reasonable to a bank again, and never reveal any problem voluntarily to them. They are NOT reasonable people just ruthless amoral criminals with no ethics or principles and that is how you must treat them.

 

best regards and best of luck

oilyrag.

[slick132]

HI Ayr,

 

One SAR sent to Barclays Bank plc will get you all data that Barclays and Barclaycard hold for you. Best tell them the a/c nos. that you need data for though.

 

Have you spoken to CCCS or Payplan to get Barclays to accept token pay'ts while you can't afford to pay more. See here - Debt: Where to Get Help - Consumer Wiki

 

Also see here about BR and other options - Formal Solutions: Bankruptcy, Administration Orders and IVAs - The Consumer Forums

 

[Ayr]

Thanks - but the last thing i intend to do is encourage them by offering them anything when I would not have owed it if they had stuck to the law/the original agreement.

[slick132]

Noted, but you have to decide if you want to try and sort this out, or ignore it and hope the debts becaome statute-barred.

 

It's not enough to just say you don't owe them anything anymore, because you think they have acted immorally or unlawfully.

 

If you want to ignore it now and leave it at that - fine.

 

Just shout if you want any more help with this.

[Ayr]

After a massive jump in time, these are now definitely time barred.

 

I guess I should edit in - I am in Scotland.

 

I saw this -

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/news-and-updates/press/2014/18-14

 

- and was wondering if it would let me reclaim the charges & interest that made up the majority of my "debt"? Its worth adding, as I did continute paying things for years in on similar events previously at close to the minimum percentage, its likely the interest would actually exceed anything they claimed had been left outstanding.

 

They have no idea where I stay, so although I don't see equal enthusiasm in chasing to pay me, it would be nice to know if it was waiting for me (or I needed to chase it).

 

Both accounts were started about the early 90s. Last payment to them was perhaps 2006/7. I think I have most of their mail somewhere up to the end of 2007 (so well after last payment).

 

I have no idea if these were ever sold on to debt collectors, but I was wondering if this ruling says they owe me money, and the "debt" they claim expired in 2012/13 could they set a payment off against a now expired "debt"?

Edited March 27, 2014 by Ayr

[slick132]

Hi Ayr,

 

To see if it is worth reclaiming penalty charges from BC, you need to quantify the amounts using a compound interest spreadsheet.

 

BC have continued to pay restitutionary compound interest at 24.9% over the last few years. However, unless the refund exceeds the balance owed on the a/c, it will not be worth doing. They have the right to set any refund against the outstanding debt.

 

See the 2nd spready here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?330996-Latest-Spreadsheets-PPI-Claims-and-Charges-Claims-Dec-2011

 

[silverfox1961]

Hi

Agree with Slick on this.

 

Although the debt is Statute Barred (in England) the debt still remains and any reclaim will be taken off the debt.

 

Personally, I would let sleeping dogs lie.

[Ayr]

Thanks - to both of you.

 

I have looked over the site, and it seems like in England the "debt" (if it was one, as most they created) still exists but cannot be taken to court, but in Scotland it ceases to exist entirely.

 

I don't know if you presumed I was in London, as for some reason my BT connection shows me there, But I am in Scotland, what would happen here?

 

I copied the post to the Scottish debt forum, as this thread was so old, but I see its gone (or I never posted it properly).

[slick132]

Hi Ayr,

 

If you try to reclaim charges older than 6 years with restitutionary interest using s.32 of the Limitation Act 1980, it is likely the bank will ask that the same principle be applied to the debt left on the a/c. While the debt you owe cannot be pursued and/or enforced, I see no reason why it would not be taken into account in reaching a settlement re older penalty charges and interest.

 

However, I now think you were looking (in post #14) specifically at the option of reclaiming charges as per the linked OFT article.

 

Can you can show that they added charges and/or interest after the account was defaulted AND failed to provide the necessary letters, or account statements in the correct format. If so, then I see no harm in writing to the bank, pointing out their failings and insisting that you a/c be reviewed.

 

But I would not be surprised if they refuse to investigate anything older than the last 5 (Scotland) years. They may say they no longer have that older info.