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    • Thanks for all the suggestions so far I will amend original WS and send again for review.  While looking at my post at very beginning when I submitted photos of signs around the car park I noticed that it says 5 hours maximum stay while the signage sent by solicitor shows 4 hours maximum stay but mine is related to electric bay abuse not sure if this can be of any use in WS.
    • Not sure what to make of that or what it means for me, I was just about to head to my kip and it's a bit too late for legalise. When is the "expenditure occured"?  When they start spending money to write to me?  Or is this a bad thing (as "harsh" would imply)? When all is said and done, I do not have two beans to rub together, we rent our home and EVERYTHING of value has been purchased by and is in my wife's name and we are not financially linked in any way.  So at least if I can't escape my fate I can at least know that they will get sweet FA from me anyway   edit:  ah.. Sophia Harrison: Time bar decision tough on claimants WWW.SCOTTISHLEGAL.COM Time bar is a very complex area of law in Scotland relating to the period in which a claim for breach of duty can be pursued. The Scottish government...   This explains it like I am 5.  So, a good thing then because creditors clearly know they have suffered a loss the minute I stop paying them, this is why it is "harsh" (for them, not me)? Am I understanding this correctly?  
    • urm......exactly what you filed .....read it carefully... it puts them to strict proof to prove the debt is enforceable, so thus 'holds' their claim till they coughup or not and discontinue. you need to get readingthose threads i posted so you understand. then you'll know whats maybe next how to react or not and whats after that. 5-10 threads a day INHO. dont ever do anything without checking here 1st.
    • I've done a new version including LFI's suggestions.  I've also change the order to put your strongest arguments first.  Where possible the changes are in red.  The numbering is obviously knackered.  Methinks stuff about the consideration period could be added but I'm too tired now.  See what you think. Background  1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of November 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.  Unfair PCN  4.1  On XXXXX the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) the solicitors helpfully sent photos of 46 signs in their evidence all  clearly showing a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will  be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  There can be no room for doubt here - there are 46 signs produced in the Claimant's own evidence. 4.2  Yet the PCN affixed to the vehicle was for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid promptly).  The reminder letters from the Claimant again all demanded £100. 4.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.   4.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim. No Locus Standi 2.1  I do not believe a contract exists with the landowner that gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-  (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or  (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44  For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.  2.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The contract produced was largely illegible and heavily redacted, and the fact that it contained no witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “No Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract. Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed  3.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and Country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.  3.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses this document.  No Keeper Liability  5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.  5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.    5.3        The claimant did not mention the parking period instead only mentioned time 20:25 which is not sufficient to qualify as a parking period.   Protection of Freedoms Act 2012  The notice must -  (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates; 22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim. 5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.   Interest 6.2  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for four years in order to add excessive interest. Double Recovery  7.1  The claim is littered with made-up charges. 7.2  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100. 7.3  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims. 29. Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practise continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.” 30. In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverable under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...'' 31. In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case. 7.7        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.  7.8        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).  In Conclusion  8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim. Statement of Truth I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. 
    • Scottish time bar: Scottish appeal court re-affirms the “harsh” rule (cms-lawnow.com)  
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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A landlord's right of access


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It is often asserted that a landlord, even if the tenant has agreed to it in the tenancy agreement or lease, may not enter premises without the consent of the tenant. Whilst on the whole it is wise for a landlord (and especially a landlord of residential premises) to proceed on the basis that that is the law, I do not think it is in fact the law.

 

There is no rule of law that says that a landlord may not exercise any right of entry he reserves. A tenant must of course not be harassed. Apart from that he has a right to quiet enjoyment, but that right needs to be read as if it were qualified by any right reserved that allows the landlord to enter, so long as he behaves reasonably. It is not easy to say what is reasonable. Since the exercise of the right is not dependent upon a court saying it can be exercised there must be circumstances, apart from a case of genuine emergency, where it is not unreasonable for a landlord to enter without consent and even where consent is refused, but it is a brave landlord who thinks he knows what the circumstances are.

 

If you want a more detailed consideration of the question, read on.

 

To put the question is a wider context, no interest in land, whether freehold or leasehold, is ever absolute in the sense that the whole world can be excluded or that the law permits you to do what you like on your own land. First and obviously you cannot commit a crime. The law allows aircraft to invade your airspace. The ownership of mines and minerals such as coal, gas and oil is determined by statute and such as gold and silver by the common law. You may not do anything on your land which interferes with any natural rights of drainage or support enjoyed by your neighbour. The law does not allow you to commit a legal nuisance on your land. Certain activities or changes may require the permission of a competent authority. There are any number of statutory rights of entry.

 

When it comes to land law, which is private and not public law, rights exercisable over land may be agreed (and in some cases implied) and a landowner may agree to restrict the use of his land in some way. In particular, rights of access (not to be confused with rights of way) may be granted or reserved.

 

If the owner of a property wishes to go onto his neighbour's land to carry out repairs there are two possibilities:

 

A. He has an easement that allows him to go onto the land. The easement can only be exercised for the purposes stated and according to the terms of the grant and must in any event be exercised reasonably. If the neighbour declines to allow or prevents access an application may be made to the court to enforce the right.

 

B. He does not have an easement and the neighbour refuses consent. In that case, if certain conditions are fulfilled, the court may, if asked, make an order allowing access under the Access to Neighbouring Land Act 1992. Access is then allowed for the purposes specified in and subject to any conditions imposed by the order. Once the works permitted have been carried out and all conditions complied with the order effectively becomes a dead letter and any future access requires a new order.

 

The difference between A and B is that in A the right of access exists without the intervention of the court, even if it may prove necessary to ask the court to enforce the right, but that in B the right only exists by virtue of the court order. This distinction should be kept in mind.

 

When it comes to tenancies the starting point is this: a tenancy is an arrangement in which the landlord gives up his right to exclusive possession (that is possession in the sense of occupation) and hands it to the tenant in exchange for (usually) money. Ignoring the intervention of statutes such as the Protection From Eviction Act 1977, the tenant's right to exclusive possession is strengthened by two things:

 

1.The landlord's covenant for quiet enjoyment, which if not express is implied. (Theoretically, I suppose it may be expressly excluded, but I have never heard of this being done.) This covenant is essentially a promise by the landlord not to interfere with the tenant's enjoyment of the property. It is a right that arises as a matter of contract; a breach by a landlord of his covenant for quiet enjoyment is not a tort. The distinction is important because the remedies are different. Whilst in an action for both breach of contract and in tort the court may make an order restraining the defendant from repeating the action complained of, the measure or quantum of damages is different. Simplifying and without going into the matter in detail (something I am in any event not competent to do since I was never a litigator) where there is a breach of contract the measure of damages is the financial loss suffered. It is important to bear this in mind.

2.The rule that a landlord may not derogate from his grant, that is that he cannot give something with one hand and take it away with another.

 

There is some overlap between a breach of a covenant for quiet enjoyment and derogation from grant, and some actions may amount to both. However, no discussion is required for the purpose of this post and any further reference to a breach of a covenant for quiet enjoyment should be taken to include a reference to a derogation from grant.

 

In a tenancy agreement or lease a landlord may do one of two things, or may do both:

 

(a) impose an obligation on the tenant to allow access for specified purposes

 

(b) reserve a right of entry for specified purposes.

 

The effect is the same, which is that the landlord has what we may call “the landlord's right of access” - or at least that is what I hope to show.

 

There is no statute or any common law rule that says that the landlord's right of access is void or unenforceable. Indeed, in certain cases the law implies a landlord's right of access into the terms of a tenancy. It would be nonsense for statute to imply a right that was void or unenforceable. It cannot be the case that the right only exists where the court says it exists (like a right granted by the court under the Access to Neighbouring Land Act 1992) because there is no statute that allows the court to create such a right. Further, it cannot be the case that you can ask the court to enforce a right that does not exist. I think therefore that we can say that the landlord's right of access exists by reason of it having been agreed, whether expressly or impliedly, and that it exists from the moment that it is agreed.

 

If it has been established, as I hope it has, that the landlord's right of access must exist if it is agreed, we can then ask how that right is to be reconciled with the tenant's right to quiet enjoyment and, if some reconciliation can be made, what restrictions may be imposed on the exercise of the right. I think the two questions are related and can conveniently be dealt with together.

 

The right to quiet enjoyment is, like most if not all rights, not absolute. It has to be subject to exceptions, even if not agreed. Where an exception is agreed, whilst a landlord can with some justification point out that it was agreed, I think it comes down to whether the exception strikes at the heart of what a tenancy is – the right to enjoy exclusive possession in substantially the same way that a freeholder would enjoy it. However, discounting long leases of houses, the fact is that being a tenant is not the same as being a freeholder. It is therefore a question of whether the right is intrinsically reasonable and, if it is, whether the manner in which the right is exercised is also reasonable.

 

Landlords may require their tenants to allow access for two main reasons.

 

The first is to allow access (including access for inspection) for some estate management purpose connected with:

 

(i)carrying out such maintenance as is necessary to preserve the value of the property

(ii)complying with the repairing obligations owed to the tenant

(iii)complying with statutory obligations

 

It is not too difficult here to assess whether a landlord's right of access is being exercised reasonably. I cannot imagine a court refusing a landlord an order requiring the tenant to allow access if it is reasonable to do so.

 

The second is to allow access for inspection for some purpose connected with a proposed dealing with the property by the landlord which requires:

 

(i)allowing prospective tenants to inspect

(ii)allowing prospective buyers to inspect

(iii)allowing a valuer or surveyor to inspect

 

Apart from (iii), which should not be frequent, this is more problematic. For a right to allow prospective tenants and buyers to inspect to be useful it has to involve allowing all prospective tenants and buyers to inspect at short notice. A succession of people calling is soon going to amount to a significant annoyance even if you are easygoing; it is annoying enough when you have a vested interest in selling. A reasonable compromise may be to agree viewings should take place on only one day a week during an agreed period of an hour or two. It would be interesting to know what a court would decide.

 

Obviously in either case there is no problem if the tenant allows access, but what if he does not? Clearly a landlord or anyone acting on his behalf is ill-advised to force his way in. Whether when the tenant is absent and has objected to entry a landlord or his agent should let himself in is difficult to answer. I think it has to come down what the tenant can do about it. As I said above, the tenant can only ask for damages equal to his loss and it is difficult to see what the loss is if the premises are left as they were found. Whether if a landlord without permission but having the right to enter for a specific purpose persistently, but not unreasonably, enters for that purpose a court would order him to refrain from further entry I would not like to say.

 

All the above is all very well, but in practice and in the absence of harassment by either party, when the tenancy is short term no one is going to take the time and trouble to go to court. It really has to come down therefore to the parties behaving reasonably and not adopting entrenched positions, each bearing in mind that if he goes too far he may end up paying the other damages.

 

The above applies to residential property only – different considerations may apply to non-residential property.

Edited by Aequitas
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A most interesting post Aequitas.

 

If, as you surmise, these terms for access within the contract are in fact enforceable, one situation I can see arising is a landlord suing a tenant for lost rent, or lost value on property (perhaps having to sell later, or at a lower price).

 

Do you have any thoughts on this?

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By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

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If, as you surmise, these terms for access within the contract are in fact enforceable, one situation I can see arising is a landlord suing a tenant for lost rent, or lost value on property (perhaps having to sell later, or at a lower price).

 

Do you have any thoughts on this?

 

Not really, except to suggest that it is a distinct possibility that such a claim may succeed.

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Aequitas another one to throw at you.

 

I am aware that there have been successful claims against landlords for the tort of trespass.

 

How does this apply in this situation - would this tort apply in a situation covered by the contract allowing access? Surely the contract cannot overrule this tort, as the tenant has exclusive possession and as such can request others (including a landlord) to leave at any time, or expressly forbid their presence?

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

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I think that if a landlord reserves a right he cannot be trespassing at all if he enters for the purpose provided for. Whilst we talk about the tenant giving his consent for the landlord to enter, he has in fact already given it and the landlord does not need to ask again. The question is rather whether and in what circumstances the tenant can refuse entry.

 

It is of course quite possible that in entering where he has a right to do so the landlord may commit some tort other than trespass.

 

Any question of tort or anything arising under the Protection from Eviction Act or legislation having the like effect whilst important, is quite separate from, although it runs parallel to and overlaps with, the question of whether and to what extent the exercise of any rights of access may be a breach of the covenant for quiet enjoyment.

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I'm not entirely sure thats the case Aequitas.

 

Permission to be on property can be withdrawn at any time and for any reason.

 

e.g. a cinema can ask a customer to leave at any time. As soon as they have been asked to leave, if they refuse, they are committing the tort of trespass. This is despite the fact that the customer had previously been given permission.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

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Surely the tort outweighs the contract?

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

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of course it does, a contract however written cannot remove a persons legal rights,

 

You can waive or contract out of some rights, but not others. What rights do you think are involved here that a tenant might be giving up?

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The tort of trespass Aequitas.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

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quote > "You can waive or contract out of some rights" , only if agreed by both parties at the start of the contract and its is clearly stated how it would affect the tenants rights if they agree to the waiver

 

you cannot just say well its in the contract and you signed it

..

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The tort of trespass Aequitas.

 

If you have no right to enter and you do, it is trespass.

 

If you have a right to enter for a specified purpose and enter for that purpose it cannot be trespass. The entry is "licensed" by the agreement. Any subsequent refusal to allow access does not change the position.

 

It is possible to read too much into the fact that a tenancy grants exclusive possession. What this means is that the possession is not shared with anyone including the landlord. It does not stop anyone having rights which if exercised do not amount to sharing occupation. This has to be the case otherwise you could not for example reserve a right of way over a field when you let it.

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quote > "You can waive or contract out of some rights" , only if agreed by both parties at the start of the contract and its is clearly stated how it would affect the tenants rights if they agree to the waiver

 

you cannot just say well its in the contract and you signed it

 

But what right are you saying here that a tenant is giving up?

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whereas a clause such as "we may enter at anytime we feel it necessary " or "we may enter the property once every 28 days to check the condition of the property"

infact a landlord must give 24 hours notice of their intention and be reasonable with tenant , e.g. if the tenant has other places to be etc , or a doctor / social worker or any other person that may be visiting the home on the day the landlord wants to attend, and a LL should by virtue of common sense only attend when the tenant is there, in case of claims of theft etc etc, yes there are times when the LL may believe the property is being damaged by the tenant etc , but cannot just barge in, there are legal procedure he must follow

There are exception i.e., in an emergency such as flooding /fire / structural problems of the building etc

These and many landlords that have tried to Inc on a contract which is

Contrary to the tenant’s legal rights.

Aequitas are you a LL or estate agent as most of your responses are biased towards what they would say / act on

And BTW up until a few years back our family had 37 properties ( houses ) that were let out and I was for a time active in the management .

..

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whereas a clause such as "we may enter at anytime we feel it necessary " or "we may enter the property once every 28 days to check the condition of the property"

infact a landlord must give 24 hours notice of their intention and be reasonable with tenant , e.g. if the tenant has other places to be etc , or a doctor / social worker or any other person that may be visiting the home on the day the landlord wants to attend, and a LL should by virtue of common sense only attend when the tenant is there, in case of claims of theft etc etc, yes there are times when the LL may believe the property is being damaged by the tenant etc , but cannot just barge in, there are legal procedure he must follow

There are exception i.e., in an emergency such as flooding /fire / structural problems of the building etc

These and many landlords that have tried to Inc on a contract which is

Contrary to the tenant’s legal rights.

Aequitas are you a LL or estate agent as most of your responses are biased towards what they would say / act on

And BTW up until a few years back our family had 37 properties ( houses ) that were let out and I was for a time active in the management .

 

I am not a landlord or an agent. Just because my view of the law happens to run counter to the prevailing view does not necessarily mean that I am on the side of money here. I find that not only on this subject but on several others that misconceptions are rife. I happen to be a lawyer and I think it is important that people should know the law. The position as I set it out in my original post may be wrong, but at least I have set it out at length with legal argument and not relied on mere assertion. Once you know the law you know where you stand. Of course the law is not everything and practical considerations are important.

 

To restate my position succinctly to take account of the law and practical considerations:

 

If you make a statement such as : "A tenant can refuse his landlord access for any given purpose even if the tenancy agreement says he can have access for that purpose" then I say:

 

A. It is a statement that cannot be supported by legal argument

 

B. It is a statement that a landlord is wise to assume is true

 

C. It is a statement that it is not wise for a tenant to rely on as being true

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but then Lawyers, Solicitors, Barristers, and QC's get it wrong every day in Court.

 

so on that fact , its often down to ones interpretation of the Law, in how you see it , that is why we have the term "case book law" because a Judge made a decision on his understanding of the Law, which I am sure you know the meaning of the term :rolleyes:

 

however we do have many members of the legal proffesion who post on CAG , and will often post a response in laymans terms to make it easy for people to read and understand, but they dont identify them selfs in general, but there are members of CAG who know who they are.

..

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May i ask a question about Keys

 

you all may have read thread http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/residential-commercial-lettings/124982-how-safe-my-tenancy.html

 

about my tenancy(regulated) under 1977 rent act and access by my LL is a very sore point.

 

Before i stopped talking to my LL back in Oct 2008,my LL kept banging on about he was entitled to a spare set of keys to my flat and that his solicitor had told him this as well and on 2 occasion the estate agent told me that a LL was entitled to a spare set of keys to my flat.

 

I had changed my locks some 20 years ago as i found my LL coming out of my flat and with out my permission,if he still had keys he would clearly carry on going into my flat without permission and show estate agents and buyers around when im out :x

 

Is a LL entitled to a spare set of keys to a tennants flat under law ?

 

MARTIN

Please use the quote system, So everyone will know what your referring too, thank you ...

 

 

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Referring to the OFT position:

 

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/reports/unfair_contract_terms/oft356.pdf

 

They say that LL has a responsibility to check and repair a property (Housing Act 1988 ), and that a term in a contract that permits access to do this with 24 hours written notice would therefore not be unfair. There is also case law that suggests that landlord would have this right even if there were no term in the contract (because of their duty to maintain).

 

The OFT say they would object to a term that allows LL "excessive" access. Eg. for viewings. That implies that they would not object to a term that gave reasonable access.

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but then Lawyers, Solicitors, Barristers, and QC's get it wrong every day in Court.

 

Half the lawyers who go to court lose! And judges have their decisions overturned.

 

so on that fact , its often down to ones interpretation of the Law, in how you see it , that is why we have the term "case book law" because a Judge made a decision on his understanding of the Law, which I am sure you know the meaning of the term :rolleyes:

 

Agreed. You sometimes have to wait for a clear decision for the courts on a point of law before you can be certain.

 

however we do have many members of the legal proffesion who post on CAG , and will often post a response in laymans terms to make it easy for people to read and understand, but they dont identify them selfs in general, but there are members of CAG who know who they are.

 

I am not sure if you are saying I ought not identify myself as a lawyer. You did ask me if I was an agent, so presumably would have been happy for me to identify as one if I was. I mentioned it as it seemed necessary to explain at least in part to explain my motivation for the original post. You also seem to suggest that the post was not easy to understand. I point out that it starts with a summary and then invites those interested to to read on. It is of necessity long because there is a lot to explain. The reason I wrote the post (and posted it on other legal forums) was because people are constantly insisting that this is a black and white issue and I wanted something to refer to to save having to keep repeating myself. On the whole, if I am to believe what I am told, people find my posts clear and informative.

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firs steve you are correct BUT 24 hours notice is not just to allow the landlord to enter whenever he wants etc,

 

as for yourself Aequitas, normal practise would be to explain in simple / laymans speak so to say , making it easy for the normal person in the street to understand etc, but when advice is given in writing a letter etc , then of course the legal terms need to given

 

its for ones own protection to remain anon etc , walls have ears

..

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On the whole, if I am to believe what I am told, people find my posts clear and informative.

 

Without blowing smoke up your jacksey, I agree Aequitas - and I see it as certainly a very good post as a good basis for a discussion point.

 

I, personally, am certainly not a lawyer, but to me the whole thing seems to be at loggerheads.

 

I struggle to disagree with most of what you have said, but I cant agree that there is NO legal basis to argue that the tenant is not in his right to prevent access to the property.

 

The tort of trespass allows the tenant this right to my mind - although I absolutely agree that I do not personally know of a case law.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

Please click the star if I have helped!!

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The OFT document referenced case law that gave a landlord a right of access for maintenance reasons. If a tenant refused such access then I presume he would be open to a claim for damages if a foreseeable event took place caused by lack of maintenance.

 

The other "reasonable" reasons for access would be to show the property to valuers, potential buyers and potential tenants.

 

I wonder whether there is a risk of a claim if a tenant refused such access agreed through contract. It may be hard for a LL to prove loss.

 

I don't think it would be fair or wise, though, for a LL to descend on a tenant in the last two months of a tenancy with a horde of estate agents, viewers and repair men getting the property in order. As it happens, my OH is currently preparing a rented house for sale, and is being extremely sensitive about it (not least because the tenant is a complete toss pot).

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